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  1. 9 points
    The fact that you named national champs at each body type, that should tell you that there isn't a "best" body type.
  2. 8 points
    This thread : Man. This is bull, Downey was gifted his spot, this can not stand. Also this thread: We should install Dieringer or Nickal, with zero wins at this weight or entering the qualifying tournaments at this weight, directly into the Best of 3 Finals. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
  3. 8 points
    You can't change weights mid-process because you lose and think you might be able to beat the guy at a weight next to yours. Downey won the 86 kg spot by winning the US Open and then the trials, and now final x where he will essentially accept 2 forfeits from DT. It's against the ethic of the sport and would set up potentially disastrous situations down the road if they were to allow Nickal or Ringer to wrestle off Downey despite neither of them ever wrestling 86 kg. You'd have guys asking for special wrestle offs every year. The only reason people are having this conversation is because Downey rubs people the wrong way. It's not like he's some scrub. He's a junior world silver medalist, has a great freestyle skillset, and is an amazing athlete. I think we're going to be fine there this year. He's not a bad second option behind DT.
  4. 7 points
  5. 6 points
    JasonBryant

    USAW's coverage is just sad

    Let me provide a little insight, having been on both sides of the coverage of events like this. The first line quoted is accurate because at USAW events, the communications team is first and foremost, media relations/public relations for the organization. Some NGBs don’t even provide external content. For USAW purposes, Gary, Mike and Taylor’s job is to focus on USAW and the basic facts of any and all situations. Editorializing and feature-based journalism exists in their external coverage of the college season, etc. I first experienced it in 2003 when I was freelancing for TheMat.com and stringing for the Associated Press at the World Championships. IIRC, Cormier got beat and shoved his Iranian opponent. My story for USAW skirted over this, since it did not impact the final score, but I did allude to it being something like “an emotional finish.” In my AP story, I outlined what happened post-match. Independent media will focus more on the controversy, but don’t expect any NGB to draw attention to a controversial topic as a big part of a recap or release. As someone who cut my teeth in newsrooms, it was a hard thing for me to deal with initially, but there is a difference between PR and journalism. We have a lot of fuzzy lines in our sport in that regard - a lot of covering your friends and access journalism - so the bottom line here is the folks did their job as it relates to their company. The editorializing and analysis won’t come from an NGB in a post event wrap. Hope that provides some background on why you don’t see long, drawn out explanations on things like what happened on Saturday night.
  6. 6 points
    Fletcher

    Top Freshman 2019/2020

    You missed a chance to say Woods has a Real shot at 141. I'll show myself out.
  7. 6 points
    tbert

    Downey Making Weight...

    Rubber match?? Dont you have to win at least one first?
  8. 6 points
    and all you have to do is buy my course for $497 and learn the secrets that will make you make money and fully understand the meaning of financial freedom!
  9. 6 points
    But the age group silver, besides being against just kids, not the best grown ups, was seven years ago, when he was 19 or 20. Not only was that a long time ago, but the years in between, when he was an inveterate and unrepentant screw up, were the young adult years when unfortunately a fair number of talented young people blow themselves up. And Downey seemed on a mission during that time to ensure that he not only blew up but nuked himself, but by all appearances in the last year or so he's found a way to bring himself back from that brink and become a productive person. In other words, he doesn't today like the same complete irredeemable jackass that he appeared to most of the wrestling community to be for the better part of seven years. The prior world silver is just a small example of the kind of talent that he screwed up in the intervening seven years when he accomplished nothing on a par with that. That's what me and others are trying to say about this complicated situation. He still ain't our favorite, but we're really happy to see that he's made the improvements he's made and we'll take it over what preceded it. And we hope he can get some points to help the U.S. win the team title. Also, why do people keep acting as if David Taylor is John Smith and Dan Gable rolled into one? "Cleared out weight"? That doesn't make any sense. The top guys in the weight class above and below him have materially better college and senior level records than him. The guy below him beat Taylor so often, so badly, and in so many different big matches in folk and free that it's been a source of fodder for years for running jokes on these boards. The guy above him won more NCAA titles and more world medals and beat him in the Olympic trials on one leg. Why would either of them clear out for Taylor, and why would anyone competing in either of those weight classes prefer to wrestle Dake or Cox instead of Taylor??
  10. 6 points
    New member on the board, wrestler from Germany, unfortenaly we got no community and board like this for talking about international wrestling, so I joined here. I wrestled against Eduard Popp (5th place Olympic 2016 130kg) and Jello Kramer (bronce u23 Worlds 130kg 2017) in tournaments, lost to both.
  11. 6 points
    The only reason they would be wrestling off is if they lose at final x at the weight they already chose. Pat Downey did significantly more towards winning the 86 kg spot than other WTT winners by actually wrestling 86 kg. Also, USA did not give DT a bye. He earned it through pre-set criteria (like the one you're arguing against right now). Remove DT from the field and there's nobody sitting in final x. Downey wins the open. Heflin wins the trials, Downey beats him at final x. What you are arguing for is either the ability to lose a tournament (the trials process in this case) and then reenter that same tournament at a different weight you might think you can win at for a second chance or the ability to change weights in the middle of a tournament because you found out the competition was easier at a different weight. Nonsense either way. We have a trials process for a reason: transparency and fairness. If the point is only to send the best team, we might as well just have the coaches pick whoever they think matches up best internationally or who has the best results.
  12. 5 points
    tigerfan

    If Cox medals at World's...

    Forgot Snyder, duh. He's 4 for 4 so far.
  13. 5 points
    Coach_J

    The call

    Horrible call. Defensive man initiated an exposure and the offensive man did not immediately assume control after the exposure. Two for the defensive man. Not a hard call. At no point did the offensive man stop or impede the motion initiated by the defensive man, thus no 2-2.
  14. 5 points
    MSU158

    #NCAAforFreestyle?

    Man do I EVER disagree with freestyle being a better product, let alone much better. All it really is, is a takedown contest with a little bit of sumo thrown in. Unless you want to count leg laces and trap arm guts, usually right off takedowns, as mat wrestling. If you don't score quickly an almost arbitrary decision is made to put someone on the clock. If they continue to not score, again, an almost arbitrary decision is made to put someone on the clock and it usually ends up being the other guy. And guess what? The other guy would win if the score ends up 1-1 to because neither scored when they were on the shot clock. Don't forget how convoluted tie-breakers can get. Score ends 6-6? Yep there is still a winner. But, did he score last? Or did he score the only 2 point move? 4 point move? Oh wait, was he cautioned? If you want wrestling to be the most simplistic it can be from a scoring perspective, I somewhat get why you follow freestyle. But, I don't want the actual wrestling to be as simple to view as it can be. I don't like the, "You took me down so I will quickly lay flat until I quickly get my chance to take you down!" philosophy. To me, Wrestling has always been about CONTROLLING your opponent. Without Folkstyle mat wrestling, I just don't see how that is done...................
  15. 5 points
    Blue Dragons

    Downey Making Weight...

    And Taylor should also have to weigh-in to qualify his National Team spot.
  16. 5 points
    scribe

    What makes Mark Hall so good?

    His large head gives him exceptional leverage
  17. 5 points
    Ogalthorpe Haywood

    #NCAAforFreestyle?

    Imo freestyle is just a better more entertaining product.
  18. 5 points
    Such a long thread with no end in sight. PDIII wasn't gifted with anything; the rules as set going in were followed and he is our rep according to those rules. Are there flaws with those rules? Possibly. Is he the best possible 86 kilo freestyler in the entire country now that Taylor is out and the best competitor to send to the Worlds? I can't say that for sure, but deviating from the agreed upon protocol now would be a cluster. Is PDIII a guy I'd like my son to be like? Not a chance, but that has nothing to do with the process as it now stands. He's in. You can "support him" (whatever that means) or not as you see fit. End of story. JMHO
  19. 5 points
    Conel's wins over Moore were flukes. Both of them - and yes, I realize how ridiculous that sounds. You'll see.
  20. 5 points
    Billyhoyle

    Cox vs "Snyder or Taylor"

    Nah. The PSU fans posting that he will go up to 97 because he has a better chance beating Snyder than Taylor have the inside info.
  21. 4 points
    scribe

    USAW's coverage is just sad

    Zains legs go limp too like he’s being ragdolled.
  22. 4 points
    irani

    Iran Wrestling News

    If Yakhkeshi is selected, I hope they invest in purchasing a long sleeve shirt for him
  23. 4 points
    Rob Koll. No one else routinely turns top 50-100 recruits (or lower into NCAA champs): Freidman, Leen, Simaz, Bosak, Garrett.
  24. 4 points
    Or they thought DT would be waiting for them at Final X. But....yeah....let's believe Cox, Ringer, and Bo are terrified of Downey. Again, he rightfully earned the spot and I think it would be awful to change the rules mid-session. But lets be real. If any of the guys mentioned above would have known DT wasn't waiting at Final X then rest assured that 86 would have filled up with a few very good guys looking to claim that spot.
  25. 4 points
    ugh... this gets so tiresome every year... my guy didn't get on the team so there must be a change in the way we do it... f all that... the US has the best system to determine world team members... totally merit based... you win you are on the team... proper allowances given to past accomplishments... everyone knows the dates... everyone knows the process (excepting some "fans")... you show up and you earn your spot or you do not... it is that simple... no ifs ands or buts... no politics... no one trying to get their guy on the team using some silly practice room goes as a factor... you show and win and you are on the team... how anyone can have a problem with this is beyond me...
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