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Everything posted by Pinnum

  1. Football players are suspended every year for failing the test. You just don’t know about it because they are suspended for “violation of team rules” and are suspended for failing a school administered test. If an athlete fails an NCAA administered test it is a harsher penalty ( I think it costs a year of eligibility but would have to look it up to confirm). However, if an athlete fails a school administered test then the penalty is up to the school as long as they have a written policy on file for how they will handle the violations so that it is consistent for athletes at the school. Some schools test a few weeks before the end of the season to prevent a failure from turning up in an NCAA test. If an athlete is going to fail they want to know before the harsher penalty will be imposed.
  2. I assumed since the previous discussion was about the lack of athletic scholarships in the Ivy that it was understood. So I added that financial aid in the Ivy is all based on need. You don’t get scholarships from Ivy League schools for “being smart” you get them for being poor (or less well off than the study body as a whole). Stanford offers scholarships but is not fully funded. They offer great financial aid, like the Ivy schools do. And that allows them to attract more quality than their athletic funding would otherwise allow.
  3. This is true but is often misunderstood. It doesn't apply to high income families. The Ivy doesn't provide any merit aid. This means there are no academic scholarships in the ivy league. All aid is based on financial need of the family. So for lower income and middle income families (especially NY state residents for Cornell) they can pay less than they would to wrestle for a fully-funded program, but it has nothing to do with wrestling. They get that same deal, even if they don't wrestle. This also applies to Stanford, which allows their lack of funding to go further than it otherwise would.
  4. FWIW: When you view it on mobile, it is one page and easy to read...
  5. https://sports.yahoo.com/ranking-all-65-power-five-schools-in-overall-athletic-success-155454743.html Thought this was interesting.
  6. Fleming's actually applied pressure to the jaw.
  7. There is no reason to join a conference. They don't need a qualifying tournament until 2024. This will allow them to schedule as they see fit. They should schedule duals with the weakest of the "brand name" D1 teams so that the wrestling teams looks to be competitive in D1.
  8. Lax has had more people willing to step up to invest into the sport. There are very few alumni that competed in Lax compared to wrestling but they write checks to the college programs and parents of college lax players are willing to donate to the sport. This is one of the key differences I see in the two sports. The other big one is that the demands are different. College wrestling is much more demanding and a less social sports. Which really hurts the sport. Wrestling year round isn't very good for the sport, but it great for creating world champs.
  9. https://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/28/sports/colleges-never-rowed-take-a-free-ride.html
  10. Whoever is a standout--once in a generation--wrestler at Iowa State. They are the only school that can produce a Gable or Sanderson.
  11. I had thought that. There has been a lot of tweaking with Folkstyle. I have observed instances of former high school wrestlers getting back into wrestling and feeling like the rules are completely different. I do wonder if this is the effect of so many people who competed under Fila now being in folkstyle leadership positions and for them rule changes seem so natural. While at the same time UWW probably learned that consistency is needed.
  12. You know, when I wrote that, I was sure someone would bring this up. There are some key differences. Basketball was invented by Naismith (an American) and then spread to the rest of the world. Sure, the game has experienced some changes over the years it isn't a significant deviation from the original game. Wrestling has been identified in every culture throughout history with many different original inventors who all invented wrestling independently with their own rules. There are many different influences that go into it and this is what makes it a political struggle with Freestyle as there is a fight over what Freestyle should be between the factions. The University of Kansas was playing college basketball in 1898 which was nearly 40 years before FIBA was formed to add the sport to the modern Olympics. Wrestling was in the ancient Olympics. The Freestyle and Folkstyle model in the United States could be like the NBA/NCAA/FIBA comparison, in that the Americans involved with the sport are largely are not concerned with the international rules or the governing body and only participate in those rules because it is necessary to win Gold Medals. While I believe that the differences in the multiple bodies controlling their own rules would be a structural challenge, it would be one that could be managed. The real issue is disenfranchisement. The biggest stakeholders in the United States wrestling community are not at the top of the pyramid. All too often we get caught up in focusing at the top of the sport and we lose focus at the grass root level. The key stakeholders in really those that first introduce people to the sport of wrestling and overwhelmingly this is done by people volunteering their time to coach their kids or by people who do it has a hobby. The largest influence into the large participation numbers stems from people who don't actually follow international wrestling but rather wrestled 20 years ago and simply got back into it because their kids were involved. Most high school coaches don't even follow international wrestling. We always like to pretend that the high school coaches that we all know are representative of high school coaches in general but they are not. Most high school coaches are only focused on their individual athletes. They have too little time to spend following the sport since they work fulltime jobs outside of the sport and focusing on their team takes up so much of their free time already. This is the real roadblock. The cost of education would be significant. You would see a further divide between the best youth and high school programs and those that aren't as well established. A former high school wrestler can take to being a youth or high school coach and communicate the sport well enough to make a team competitive in folkstyle but if they don't have any experience in freestyle they are going to be even further behind and frankly will likely be intimidated that they don't know enough about the new version of the sport. One of the thing that has helped coaches to get involved in the sport, in my experience, has been their ignorance to how little they don't know. Most people in wrestling don't really know how little they know about wrestling. And that is a good thing because it gets them involved with the sport. I have often said that no matter what changes we make to the sport we will always have national champions. We will never lack national champions. But we can change the number of people competing for those championships, coaching athletes for those championships, officiating those championships, and sitting in the stands at those championships. And while we all like to think those numbers will only go up, we need to be cognizant to the fact that changes can result in a contraction where we lose those key stakeholders.
  13. NCAA can't really go to Freestyle. Freestyle's rules are determined by UWW. The NCAA would lose control over their rules if they simply adopted whatever UWW decided would be the rules that month. And if the NCAA wanted to standardize Freestyle rules (which many in the United States would love) it wouldn't compel UWW to adhere to the rules which would just end up with two very different Freestyle forms of wrestling. The wrestling community, in the United States, is a folkstyle community. It would be rare to find an American who has wrestled Freestyle but not Folkstyle. But you can find millions who have wrestled Folkstyle and never wrestled Freestyle. It just happens that the top athletes in Folkstyle are also involved with Freestyle. Changing college wrestling to Freestyle would be a major structural change. And I doubt you would get buy-in from high school and youth programs where most of the coaches and parents have little to no experience in Freestyle. And if the feeder programs aren't changed, it would have a major impact on college wrestling. I would venture to guess there would be many programs eliminated simply due to a lack of coaching and lack of ability to recruit and retain wrestlers with Freestyle experience (though the D1 programs would remain).
  14. PIAA tournament will be brutal. The talent will be even higher at each weight. It could actually be a good thing. Might see more JV programs developed.
  15. This is correct. They are actually six teams with six rosters of athletes.
  16. Automatic. You're only permitted one D1 to D1 transfer. The second time you go D1 to D1 it is an automatic loss, unless you're doing so as a graduate transfer. The graduate transfer is the only way to do it.
  17. Wasn't the weight class already optional in Dual scoring?
  18. Do the top programs recruit the best wrestlers to represent their program or do they take the wrestlers that join their program and create the best wrestlers? If the former, then any programs getting better recruits will be a threat. If the latter, then it would be the status quo.
  19. No. Not even a little bit. Clearly this thread isn't going anywhere... If you want to lobby your cause, you can do so. But I have a feeling you'll find that there isn't any support of your position.
  20. The only "We" here are the member schools (Iowa State, UTEP, NC State, etc) who are members of the Association (NCAA). And they have the power to say because it is their association and their teams. Any slot taken by one student-athlete displaces another student-athlete. Schools look out for themselves which includes their own community stakeholders.
  21. It applies the same reason professional league player associations push for minimum salaries based on years of service. The point of these policies is to get more athlete the opportunity to compete. College freshmen have traditionally not been ready to compete. For the longest time college freshmen couldn't even compete at the varsity level. These rules get more people engaged in college athletics. It serves more people and it fits in with the whole college mission. Without a doubt, it would make college sports look bad to have someone playing for ten years. To answer your question of why it exists: Because no one wants it to go away. There's no one that has a problem with it. Great athletes move on to professional opportunities. There are tons of opportunities for people. College is great but people recognize that it is limited and frankly even those who are loving their time don't want to be in that state long term. There is no one pushing for a change. (Note: When I say "no one" I don't mean that you can't find a single person. You can find someone to support any policy issue no matter how crazy it might be. But there is no measurable faction of stakeholders that have ever shown an interest in taking up the issue.)
  22. Me too! And I recognize the freedom of Penn State, UCLA, Rice, Hartford, Georgia Tech, and every other school in the NCAA to get together and agree to create an association where they agree to rules for sports. I also support athletes who maximize their freedom by choosing other options when they don't want to agree to the rules of the NCAA or any other entity. There is no problem with any of the NCAAs policies. You're not entitled to have a school subsidize your participation in sports ever, and especially not in perpetuity.
  23. The schools themselves don't want it. They don't want to keep athletes around long term. They want to move them on. The schools made this policy. Sure, they will try to get a waiver when they have a good athlete who missed two years due to injury. But as a rule, none of the schools want this. They want to serve college students for a limited term.
  24. There are explicit exemptions in the rules for Mormon missions, military service, and the peace corps. Brown used this exemption. The rule is supported by all members because it doesn't actually benefit any one and it is not a loophole that is used for athletic benefit. More athletes are lost to never return to college sports from entering these programs than those who enter them and then return to college sports.
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