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BigApple

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  1. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from BadgerMon in Strongest wrestlers   
    I wrestled in the Army and got out at the end of 1969. I was a helicopter pilot. Tommy Evans refereed the 4th Army tournament in 1969 at Ft. Hood. I told him that when I got out I wanted to go back finish my degree and fly in the National Guard. He said come see me I'm the company in Norman, Oklahoma. I am from Wichita, KS 200 miles to the north. I joined the Oklahoma National Guard in the fall of 1971, and transferred from Wichita State to OU. He got me a job running an athletic dorm. At the end of the first semester having watched be workout everyday, he said you're tougher than I thought you were. How would like to be an assistant coach? He said there are things i need help with, and Wayne only gets $3,000 a year and said he wasn't getting paid enough to do those things. So i finished out as assistant that season, then was an assistant for Stan Abel the next two years.
     
    I was in an unusual financial situation, I had a 50% VA disability so my tuition, fees, books were paid for, plus i got a monthly vocational rehab stipend, VA disability, pay from flying in the guard, and free room and board for running a dorm. I think my standard of living was lower after graduating for about the next 5 years.
     
    I think Wayne was just naturally strong.
  2. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from BadgerMon in Strongest wrestlers   
    I did mention Doug Blubaugh, I got to know him fairly well after I moved back to Oklahoma. The first time I really got to experience him was at lunch before Tommy Evans memorial service. I'd flown back from Phoenix to attend the service. The power half came up. Doug was setting at the head of the table, and I was next to him. He got up and shows how he did the powerhalf. He'd trap your forearm and bicep with one arm encircling them, the lockup the power half with his other arm. I was able to say that is the way I've been teaching it for 35 years, because Port Robertson taught to me. Doug had been on the 1960 Olympic team Port coached.
     
    Doug ran the family farm, wrestled for OSU, and went to school full time. He told me he had a miserable college experience. I can understand why.
     
    When I met Rafik Turna who had wrestled for Turkey in the 1960 Olympics, I asked which American impressed him the most. He said without hesitation Blubaugh. At that time I didn't know about his pinning Habbibi.
     
    Doug walked the length of the football field at OSU everyday after practice ON HIS HANDS! Then he went home to work on the farm, study, eat, fall asleep. He didn't cut any weight. He said he weighed 157 when he wrestled Habibbi.
  3. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from TobusRex in My Ringer Beat Your Ringer   
    I was the wrestling coach of the Ft. Wolters, Texas (about 40 miles west of Ft. Worth) base team. Ft. Wolters at that time was the primary helicopter flight school for the US Army. In addition there were many foreign students. I taught in the Leadership Branch, which also got the officer classes for pre-flight. My high school coach had been an AA for Ed Gallagher at Oklahoma A&M, so I'd had some pretty decent coaching in high school.
     
    I figured some of the students in the officer classes might have wrestled in college. I was the scheduling officer for 15 officers. So I made sure that I got a different section each day. I'd ask them if any of them had wrestled in college. Finally one day a student held up his hand, he said he hadn't wrestled in college, but had wrestled for Greco-Roman for Turkey in the 1960 Olympics and placed 5th. Rafik Turna was his name, and he was at 136.5 in 1960 and could still make in 1968 even though he smoked and drank.
     
    First day of practice I'm in the down position I stand up and the next thing I know I am flying through the air straight to my back. I said that is a slam! Rafik replied no it was a Salto. So every day I got an education in Greco Roman wrestling from Rafik, how to do arm throws, spins, jap whizzers, and gut wrenches.
     
    We could use foreign students in dual meets, but not the tournaments for the Army teams (Ft. Wolters which had about 4,000 stationed there, took a team of foreign students as their soccer team and won the 4th Army tournament easily. After that the generals said no more foreign students!).
     
    I convinced Rafik that as good as he was, there was no way the Ft. Sill team would have anyone as good as he was. So he agreed. Goes out in the first period and hits a 5-point arm throw. Then he stalls the rest of the match and wins 5-3. I realized the wrestler from Ft. Sill was pretty good. When the match was over Rafik, said you lied, he was pretty tough. When the meet was over the coach for Ft. Sill comes over and asks me who my 136.5-pounder was? I said who was yours? He said mine was 2nd in D-2 last year. I said mine was 5th in the 1960 Olympics, my ringer beat your ringer!
     
    Rafik completed his 5 months at Ft. Wolters and then went to Ft. Rucker. I never saw him again, nor how to get in touch. I still teach some of the stuff he showed me, and tell these two stories.
  4. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from TobusRex in Why have so few schools won a wrestling D-I team title?   
    Wrestling is a technique and personality sport. One individual can make a major impact.
     
    Ed Gallagher gave OSU a huge lead technically by applying engineering principles to the human skeleton. He got his wrestlers coaching positions at Perry, Ponca City, Blackwell, and Cushing to develop a feeder program for OSU.
     
    Art Griffith first developed "counter wrestling" as a style. He figured he couldn't beat Gallagher's disciples using the same style. So Tulsa Central because of the huge talent base became the best high school wrestling team perhaps ever in the U.S. When Griffith took over OSU he completely changed it's style of wrestling.
     
    Port Robertson who was coached by Paul Keen, who was a Gallagher disciple believed in pinning. John Devine the Perry coach had wrestled for Gallagher had a falling out with Griffith when he was told his wrestlers would need to change their style to wrestle at OSU. Port and Devine formed a close relationship which created the great pipeline from Perry to OU, making OU a powerhouse.
     
    Harold Nichols got in the ground floor of hosting large wrestling camps in the summer. He hired many OSU and OU former wrestlers as clinicians. This began the wholesale export of the then advanced techniques from Oklahoma to Iowa. Nichols stockpiled the best high school wreskers in the upper midwest. Thus, the first dominant outside of Oklahoma was created.
     
    Gary Kurdleneier and Dan Gable transformed college wrestling by doing the following.
    1. Having post collegiate wrestlers at every weight class as workout partners.
    2. Gable implemented strength training in wrestling which had never been done before on a wholesale basis.
     
    Although wrestling is a team sport, the score is derived from each individual scores. So a team with 4-5 outstanding wrestlers can win the NCAA title. iowa under Gable was the exception, it usually had 8-10 outstanding wrestlers.
     
    Kids idolize the outstanding athletes at the next level in their sport. Wrestling is the only one where the great college wrestlers windup as head coaches at a major program. These major programs have the recruiting network at the in-state high schools, extra funding by alumni, large crowds. All these things make it hard to break into the upper echelon.
  5. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from steamboat_charlie in Why have so few schools won a wrestling D-I team title?   
    Wrestling is a technique and personality sport. One individual can make a major impact.
     
    Ed Gallagher gave OSU a huge lead technically by applying engineering principles to the human skeleton. He got his wrestlers coaching positions at Perry, Ponca City, Blackwell, and Cushing to develop a feeder program for OSU.
     
    Art Griffith first developed "counter wrestling" as a style. He figured he couldn't beat Gallagher's disciples using the same style. So Tulsa Central because of the huge talent base became the best high school wrestling team perhaps ever in the U.S. When Griffith took over OSU he completely changed it's style of wrestling.
     
    Port Robertson who was coached by Paul Keen, who was a Gallagher disciple believed in pinning. John Devine the Perry coach had wrestled for Gallagher had a falling out with Griffith when he was told his wrestlers would need to change their style to wrestle at OSU. Port and Devine formed a close relationship which created the great pipeline from Perry to OU, making OU a powerhouse.
     
    Harold Nichols got in the ground floor of hosting large wrestling camps in the summer. He hired many OSU and OU former wrestlers as clinicians. This began the wholesale export of the then advanced techniques from Oklahoma to Iowa. Nichols stockpiled the best high school wreskers in the upper midwest. Thus, the first dominant outside of Oklahoma was created.
     
    Gary Kurdleneier and Dan Gable transformed college wrestling by doing the following.
    1. Having post collegiate wrestlers at every weight class as workout partners.
    2. Gable implemented strength training in wrestling which had never been done before on a wholesale basis.
     
    Although wrestling is a team sport, the score is derived from each individual scores. So a team with 4-5 outstanding wrestlers can win the NCAA title. iowa under Gable was the exception, it usually had 8-10 outstanding wrestlers.
     
    Kids idolize the outstanding athletes at the next level in their sport. Wrestling is the only one where the great college wrestlers windup as head coaches at a major program. These major programs have the recruiting network at the in-state high schools, extra funding by alumni, large crowds. All these things make it hard to break into the upper echelon.
  6. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from vsnej in Why have so few schools won a wrestling D-I team title?   
    Wrestling is a technique and personality sport. One individual can make a major impact.
     
    Ed Gallagher gave OSU a huge lead technically by applying engineering principles to the human skeleton. He got his wrestlers coaching positions at Perry, Ponca City, Blackwell, and Cushing to develop a feeder program for OSU.
     
    Art Griffith first developed "counter wrestling" as a style. He figured he couldn't beat Gallagher's disciples using the same style. So Tulsa Central because of the huge talent base became the best high school wrestling team perhaps ever in the U.S. When Griffith took over OSU he completely changed it's style of wrestling.
     
    Port Robertson who was coached by Paul Keen, who was a Gallagher disciple believed in pinning. John Devine the Perry coach had wrestled for Gallagher had a falling out with Griffith when he was told his wrestlers would need to change their style to wrestle at OSU. Port and Devine formed a close relationship which created the great pipeline from Perry to OU, making OU a powerhouse.
     
    Harold Nichols got in the ground floor of hosting large wrestling camps in the summer. He hired many OSU and OU former wrestlers as clinicians. This began the wholesale export of the then advanced techniques from Oklahoma to Iowa. Nichols stockpiled the best high school wreskers in the upper midwest. Thus, the first dominant outside of Oklahoma was created.
     
    Gary Kurdleneier and Dan Gable transformed college wrestling by doing the following.
    1. Having post collegiate wrestlers at every weight class as workout partners.
    2. Gable implemented strength training in wrestling which had never been done before on a wholesale basis.
     
    Although wrestling is a team sport, the score is derived from each individual scores. So a team with 4-5 outstanding wrestlers can win the NCAA title. iowa under Gable was the exception, it usually had 8-10 outstanding wrestlers.
     
    Kids idolize the outstanding athletes at the next level in their sport. Wrestling is the only one where the great college wrestlers windup as head coaches at a major program. These major programs have the recruiting network at the in-state high schools, extra funding by alumni, large crowds. All these things make it hard to break into the upper echelon.
  7. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from de4856 in Why have so few schools won a wrestling D-I team title?   
    Wrestling is a technique and personality sport. One individual can make a major impact.
     
    Ed Gallagher gave OSU a huge lead technically by applying engineering principles to the human skeleton. He got his wrestlers coaching positions at Perry, Ponca City, Blackwell, and Cushing to develop a feeder program for OSU.
     
    Art Griffith first developed "counter wrestling" as a style. He figured he couldn't beat Gallagher's disciples using the same style. So Tulsa Central because of the huge talent base became the best high school wrestling team perhaps ever in the U.S. When Griffith took over OSU he completely changed it's style of wrestling.
     
    Port Robertson who was coached by Paul Keen, who was a Gallagher disciple believed in pinning. John Devine the Perry coach had wrestled for Gallagher had a falling out with Griffith when he was told his wrestlers would need to change their style to wrestle at OSU. Port and Devine formed a close relationship which created the great pipeline from Perry to OU, making OU a powerhouse.
     
    Harold Nichols got in the ground floor of hosting large wrestling camps in the summer. He hired many OSU and OU former wrestlers as clinicians. This began the wholesale export of the then advanced techniques from Oklahoma to Iowa. Nichols stockpiled the best high school wreskers in the upper midwest. Thus, the first dominant outside of Oklahoma was created.
     
    Gary Kurdleneier and Dan Gable transformed college wrestling by doing the following.
    1. Having post collegiate wrestlers at every weight class as workout partners.
    2. Gable implemented strength training in wrestling which had never been done before on a wholesale basis.
     
    Although wrestling is a team sport, the score is derived from each individual scores. So a team with 4-5 outstanding wrestlers can win the NCAA title. iowa under Gable was the exception, it usually had 8-10 outstanding wrestlers.
     
    Kids idolize the outstanding athletes at the next level in their sport. Wrestling is the only one where the great college wrestlers windup as head coaches at a major program. These major programs have the recruiting network at the in-state high schools, extra funding by alumni, large crowds. All these things make it hard to break into the upper echelon.
  8. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from TobusRex in HELP - NFL players who were the best wrestlers   
    Jimbo Elrod was a state champion for Tulsa East Central.
    Wrestled at 190 pounds his freshman year at OU.
    Started the next three years as defensive end 1973-1975 teams at OU that lost one game in three years.
    Jimbo played in the NFL with the KC Chiefs.
  9. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from TheOhioState in HELP - NFL players who were the best wrestlers   
    Jimbo Elrod was a state champion for Tulsa East Central.
    Wrestled at 190 pounds his freshman year at OU.
    Started the next three years as defensive end 1973-1975 teams at OU that lost one game in three years.
    Jimbo played in the NFL with the KC Chiefs.
  10. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from Tofurky in Cauliflower Ear Poll   
    Stan Abel long tome OU coach explained why he didn't have cauliflower ears. He said I never let anyone get hold of my head.
  11. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from gowrestle in Cauliflower Ear Poll   
    Stan Abel long tome OU coach explained why he didn't have cauliflower ears. He said I never let anyone get hold of my head.
  12. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from xander in why freshmen are more competitive   
    Great coaching and competition at a young age is imperative.  However, I remember John Smith telling me that he wasn't going after the Altons as there was no upside potential.  He was right
  13. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from pennsyrules in Who style of wrestler is more dangerous? Leg Rider or Cradler?   
    Cradles, especially nearside are the most common pinning combination in college. You don't have to be strong, just get your opponent's head and knee close together. I wrestled in the Army with Len Kaufffman, who has the highest pinning percentage in college according to the Oregon State's records. He said 75% of his pins were nearside cradles. I was an assistant coach under Tommy Evans at OU in 1971-1972. He would have the last 20 minutes of practice between the Big 8 and NCAA tournament do the following. Practice partners alternated on top and bottom. Top guy locked up a nearside cradle, he had 30 seconds to pin his opponent. Then the bottom guy went to the top. They went left side, then right side. You had to wrestle the whole 30 seconds unless you got a pin. One of his OU teams pinned more than half of their opponents at the NCAA tournament.
  14. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from levityrel in 2019-2022 Championship Sites   
    KC with the new Sprint Arena would be excellent. There must be 20 bars/restaurants across the street from the main entrance
    .interstate is just south of the arena.
    Tulsa has a new arena near downtown. John Smith is working on them bidding for the tournament
  15. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from KCMO2 in 2019-2022 Championship Sites   
    KC with the new Sprint Arena would be excellent. There must be 20 bars/restaurants across the street from the main entrance
    .interstate is just south of the arena.
    Tulsa has a new arena near downtown. John Smith is working on them bidding for the tournament
  16. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from OKnowwhut in OSU vs Iowa   
    Sammy Brooks is a senior and doesn't know how to do a near side cradle. He needed to put his head in the hip.
    Schafer needed to circle to the trail leg so he wouldn't get pushed out of bounds. First thing I teach beginning wrestlers is Sumo, so they will own the center circle
    Dominating win score wise for OSU, but many matches were razor thin winsq
  17. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from VakAttack in OSU vs Iowa   
    Sammy Brooks is a senior and doesn't know how to do a near side cradle. He needed to put his head in the hip.
    Schafer needed to circle to the trail leg so he wouldn't get pushed out of bounds. First thing I teach beginning wrestlers is Sumo, so they will own the center circle
    Dominating win score wise for OSU, but many matches were razor thin winsq
  18. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from Yellow_Medal in Zach Beard at Otero JC   
    Beard left Wyoming to years ago.  Hadn't wrestled since then to my knowledge.  He might have been the best at his weight class coming out o Tuttle HS
  19. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from LemonPie in Which #1 will lose first?   
    Kaid Brock beats Cory Clark this sunday
  20. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from pish6969 in Mark Hall   
    Different Midlands from when Dan Gable was a freshman who entered and beat Do Behm (a silver medalist)
  21. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from HuskyHero133 in Olympic Medalists in College   
    You have to further back.
     
    Tommy Evans won the silver in 1952. He redshirted in 1953 because of a knee injury. Then won his second NCAA title in 1954.
    Danny Hodge won the silver in 1956, then won his third title in 1957.
    Chris Taylor won bronze in 1972 then won his 2nd NCAA title in 1973
  22. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from Billyhoyle in Mark Cody steps down as coach at Oklahoma   
    I've been in this sport since 1960 worked for three NWHOF coaches, two were head freestyle coaches in the Olympics. Andre Metzger is probably the best technician I've ever seen. He learned everything Stan Abel taught him, then developed upper body skills. Andre has won more international freestyle matches than probably any American. His club in Denton (North Texas University) had 99 wrestlers on its roster. This is the third season since he started the program. He personally raised all of the money until the university funded one scholarship. He would do an excellent job because he knows Oklahoma high school coaches, plus many out of state coaches. Not sure if he'll apply. I told him I'd have his friends write letters to the AD stating what the would donate to endow wrestling scholarships at OU.
     
    Many people don't realize how close football players were to the wrestlers. They lived in jock dorms. The entire football team would attend the home duals. When Andre wrestled home duals against Iowa and OSU were sold out at Lloyd Noble area a which seats over 12,000
  23. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from BadgerMon in Mark Cody steps down as coach at Oklahoma   
    Andre Metzger just left my place. He said what I said about the money is correct, but a little low on the amount. He has many friends wanting him to get the job, many were OU football players when he was at OU. He hasn't made up his mind yet.
  24. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from BadgerMon in Top 10 Americans ever, according to Askren and Rowlands   
    This greatest list doesn't include the 40s, 50s, and 60s
     
    I would add Henry Wittenberg who had a freestyle gold in 1948 and a silver in 1952. He competed in college ending in 1939. WWII cost him two Olympics that weren't held in 1940 and 1944.
     
    Wayne Wells isn't getting quite enough respect. He took 5th at the 1968 Olympics, bronze in 1969, gold in 1970, didn't compete in 1971, gold in 1972.
  25. Like
    BigApple got a reaction from GoNotQuietly in Top 10 Americans ever, according to Askren and Rowlands   
    This greatest list doesn't include the 40s, 50s, and 60s
     
    I would add Henry Wittenberg who had a freestyle gold in 1948 and a silver in 1952. He competed in college ending in 1939. WWII cost him two Olympics that weren't held in 1940 and 1944.
     
    Wayne Wells isn't getting quite enough respect. He took 5th at the 1968 Olympics, bronze in 1969, gold in 1970, didn't compete in 1971, gold in 1972.
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