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Posts posted by gopher_fan_90

  1. With a sport like wrestling, there will always be situations where people want a case by case approach. Final X originated from people saying it wasn't fair that a guy could sit the whole day and then wrestle two matches fresh. US Open winners started to get a bye to Final X if they won and the weight wasn't occupied by a previous world medalists. IMO the process changes too much. I think it should go back to being the trials is how you qualify, take away Final X and take away the bye to the finals. I know it is for more reasons then just the bye with some guys but it isn't good for our sport to only see some of our best guys wrestle 2 matches on US Soil, maybe 3 with BTS.

  2. On ‎5‎/‎12‎/‎2019 at 8:24 AM, treep2000 said:

    I'm trying to figure out why (aside from the scholly monies) any of this still matters?  

    Even if the scholly maxes at 4 years... if I choose to pay my own way, how is that "abuse"?  Again, I feel that there's this arbitrary rule (I like your naming of it) that is grounded in very little actual logic, other than the fact that the NCAA wants to ensure that people are in for a short time, and then immediately out.  

    So long as the scholly monies are appropriated correctly, it ought not matter where the money to pay for college comes from after the scholly period runs out.  My own pocket, military, my rich uncle, etc. etc. etc.  Maybe this rule is more for the stick n' ball sports, where after you're "eligibility" runs out, you're supposed to go "pro" or hang 'em up?  

    Other thoughts?

    While overall, I'm sure very little would use this to the level of the hypothetical originally mentioned, there are some other factors. Lets be honest, everything revolves around Football, maybe Basketball. For simplicity lets say the football roster is an average of 100 players. Year 2019 you have 15 guys who want to stick around and keep playing the game. Maybe even more if the NFLPA decides to use this as a way to "develop" guys. You mix that in with the recruits coming in, lets say 25 recruits. Overtime that is more and more players to pay for equipment, access to trainers, traveling, access to tutors, and not to mention now athletes getting all their meals covered. This doesn't even consider scholarships. There has to be a good amount of people leaving each year.

  3. On 4/30/2019 at 12:34 PM, Ragu said:

    As for the TD situation I had never done that math and it is very interesting. I guess my only problem with the 3pt TD would be the prospect of a feet to back being 7pts. I believe that could cause a lot of problems, I mean that's one point from a major in one move set...

    That is the heart of every viewpoint involving how much points something should be worth; the opinion of how many points are needed for wrestling to be excited. IMO this is why the 4 pt near fall even became a thing. One thing I don't like about freestyle is how wrestler A can get a tight trap arm and the match be over in 15 seconds. At the end of the day, you won't be able to please everyone. I have always thought if you wait a little longer to award TDs you will have less of those 3 second escapes. If you ask me, leave the scoring as is, and in turn require wrestlers to invest time in all three positions. 

  4. Ragu, 

    In regards to your view on riding, this allows the bottom guy to just sit there, and wait for the top guy to get called for stalling. College kids are strong enough where most of them can sit there long enough, especially if they know they aren't in danger. Points or the lack thereof are not always a perfect result of how hard a guy on top is working. 

    For your points discussion, you have mentioned several times a certain amount of points shows domination, but you think a three point takedown makes a tech fall easier... If there is just take downs and no near fall, you can get a tech fall in 15 takedowns with it worth two points. If TDs are 3 points it takes 8, the same number if you take away the escape point and keep the TD at 2 points. If a guy can take you down 8 times in a row, he has earned the tech fall. In freestyle, it only takes 5 straight take downs for a tech. What I like about the 3 pt takedowns and 1 point escape is that the point differential is the same but you reward the guy for finding a way to get back to neutral. 

  5. Anthony Cassar is an interesting story because of the fact that he missed so many years to injury. On top of that, he took the spot of a 2X AA, who probably would have made the finals this year if he was the starter. I think people aren't giving Cassar enough credit. Yes, he was the 2 seed, and beat Gable two weeks before but in a lot of ways I don't think it is out of the possibility to have him and Foster sharing the spot for least likely this year.

    On a somewhat side note, perhaps Flo is starting to create a title curse

    CP says MyMar is not going to lose, or be touched...he loses

    CP and the guys say Gable is not going to lose...he loses twice

    Nomad says Zahid will never lose to Mark, he loses after that prediciton, and has a very close title match.

    Obviously it is just irony and it shows no one is unbeatable, especially at this level. 

  6. I think that is where the two camps are for the most part. Several people are acting like the no-call wouldn't have made a difference because Nolf would have found a way. The other people are surprised as Nolf has never been controlled or at least not for a while like that where he is in a situation where the match is 3-2 in the final seconds with a leg in the air. Obviously if Nolf was losing one would hope he would have kicked it into the next gear. The way he always wrestles, and the way he looked in that Semi, I'm not convinced he finds a way. At the end of the day, Nolf got his hand raised, destroyed Berger and I don't look at his title with an asterisk.

  7. 6 hours ago, spladle said:

    No, he didn't lose the match.  You cannot just tack 2 pts on the final score.  If the TD stayed, it changes the entire dynamic of the match and there is no way to tell what the final outcome would have been.

    I will agree with half of this. I agree that you can't just "add" two points that weren't there. The score is the score on the board. At the same time, I disagree that you are so confidently predicting the dynamic of the match changed. By saying that you are doing the same thing those who saying "Nolf lost" are doing.

    If Hidley gets that takedown I am not convinced Nolf turns it into a different gear and rattles off three takedowns. If he could have done that, he would have because that is what he does. Give a lot of credit to Hidley in that match. I think that was one of those "I'm putting every ounce of blood sweat and tears" into this match. Even if they had wrestled again the next day, the match most likely been much different. It is disrespectful to Hidley and the competitor he is to assume Nolf would have found another gear if he was losing. Mainly, because the Nolf we all watch finds that gear regardless.

  8. In Cassar's match it looked like Cael actually got on the mat in referee's position to show a move, might have been Varner. If that was Cael that is the most active I have seen him during a match. A few times he has shown some excitement post match, like when Nickal pinned MyMar last year. People used to always give Metcalf a hard time for never showing excitement. Some guys just don't express themselves like that.

  9. I wasn't able to watch as much of NCAAs this year as in the past. What I did notice though was the lack of explanation from the referees whether they reverse the call or not. Perhaps if they explained why the call is confirmed or changed it would appease people. Also, in NCAA wrestling do they use the same terminology as the NFL? For example, in the NFL I know they say "stands" if they might have been lacking certain angles. When it comes to these challenges and percentages we have to remember that sometimes these coaches throw the brick in desperation, because what do they have to lose?

  10. IMO if a guy is/was able to avenge that loss, that should give him a leg up over others. For example, Bo avenged his losses to both guys, so has Nolf (Van Brill) and Yianni. Next after that may be how many times they avenged those losses. For example, DT only lost to two guys officially, Bubba and Dake. He never got a chance to avenge his loss to Bubba, but was also never successful avenging his loss to Dake. Where as, Bo has avenged his loss to MyMar several times.

  11. 2 hours ago, Crotalus said:

    I have not ever subscribed to flo due to the negative reactions I see about their service. I know it is ridiculous to compare them to the juggernaut that is ESPN, but when I can stream 8 mats at once during the NCAA tournament without issue, I know the ability to consistently stream 1 match should not be that difficult to achieve. It is not worth it to me to pay into the service, hoping that it will one day become reliable. That said, I am rooting for them and hope they figure it out. Once they do, I'm in.

    So, ESPN has never had any issues? There have been times I am watching on the ESPN app for one reason or another as opposed to the cable channel and I have had to refresh the stream or I lose connection, it happens. Flo's services offer way more than just live streaming. At the end of the day it is your money and your decision, but is it fair to judge them for a product you yourself have never really tried?

  12. I haven't seen any of the Big Ten Finals on Flo's site as they did not broadcast them. Remember, Flo streams what is available on BTN plus, not the actual Big Ten Network. I have never been able to find matches that were on BTN on Flo's site.

    For the streaming, the weather Saturday was pretty crummy in Minneapolis, and Sunday still had some affects from Saturday. I'm not sure how much this affected the connection for others as I was at the tourney, but weather can always affect signal/connection. When I get a thunderstorm at my house in San Antonio, I don't call DirecTV demanding a refund, I'm just like well its a hurricane, that sucks. I know that is maybe a bad comparison but due to advancements in technology we lose our mind when it takes an extra minute for Facebook to load pictures and status updates.

  13. I can see where everyone is coming from as across the board it does not seem like the committee used the same thought process across all the weights. In the same fashion, does it really matter if Cassar wrestles Gable Friday night or Saturday night? Since White beat Cassar you can't fairly say the two best are wrestling in the semi-finals. I doubt if Gable wins the rematch Cassar is going to say, man I wish I could have lost that match in the NCAA finals. Most likely he will be upset he lost at all.

  14. 2 hours ago, jon said:


    Flo content is great but Flo all-the-rest is not great! There's tons of stuff that Flo can improve. But yet when diehards make critique Flobros say 'axe to grind' and Flo proponents turn it into CONTENT RULES AND NOTHING ELSE MATTERS nonsense. Tomaco411's post gives everyone an opportunity to discuss one of Flo's (numerous) targets for improvement. Improvement a good thing! Holy smokes.

    Helpless-tribal mindset--"Flo is all we've got I make pro-Flo posts in order to counteract other folks' critical posts"--does Flo no favors, does fans no favors, does wrestling no favors.

    In the same context, starting x-number of threads every time a new person is upset with something Flo does, doesn't do any favors in my opinion either. I think the opportunity used to be there, but it has unfortunately turned into threads and posts calling out Flo in a very negative way, or calling out the Flo guys in a very negative way. Most of what I see goes right past constructive criticism and straight to name calling. Do we really expect the people at Flo to take things seriously when there is a lack of professionalism? Or is it more that a poster wants their two-cents on how they disagree with what Flo is doing? Some people still give professional, constructive feedback but it gets lost in the overwhelming negative based posts.

  15. I think what helps Brands case to stay is that PSU is one team dominating everyone. I wasn't really following the sport back when Z was at the healm, but there was more parity at the top it seems. I understand the Hawks are frustrated because they think something from twenty years ago should still be attainable, but should every team fire their head coach? Nobody has beat PSU minus tOSU one year (a year many say PSU "punted"). Sure, some teams have been close, Minnesota, OkState, tOSU but close only counts in horseshoes. At the end of the day you have to ask yourself who is available that is also willing. Lou Rosselli was considered the best next to Cunningham, and where has Oklahoma been since he got there?

  16. 13 minutes ago, Frank_Rizzo said:

    Zain Retherford made the world team while still in college.  Nolf lost to Jimmy Kennedy, a 133 in college.  Ergo, Retherford > Nolf.  

    Not taking anything away from Zain as he still made the team, but overall 65KG is one of our weaker weights and JO was not there that particular year. Also, the key word there with Kennedy is "in college." Kennedy graduated in 2011 at 141 lbs. When he competed against Nolf at 70 KG it was 6 years later. Putting on 13 lbs in 6 years is pretty realistic. That is like saying someone who loses to Taylor at 86kg lost to a 157 guy in college. Taylor grew and so do other people. Overall I think it would be a heck of a match up.  

  17. 2 hours ago, ThorsteinV said:

    The obvious difference is that with a car, you actually pay $400/month. In this case, you never actually pay $12.50/month.  What are they trying to do? Demonstrate that they can divide by 12? 

    Again, several online outlets do this. It’s a marketing scheme to help you see the breakdown for the entire year, and attempt to convince you it isn’t that bad. Can $150 be a lot in one swoop, yes but I pay it one time and then i am good for the year. Also, 95% of companies give a discount when you pay for the whole year up front, the local car wash gives out memberships that you can eventually go enough and get car washes for free. If they still had the monthly option it would most likely be 20–25 dollars. Even back then people complained about paying 25 dollars for one match, article, documentary. Some people just can never be pleased. 

  18. 6 minutes ago, Tomaco411 said:

    I just had to go through it again. 

    Pretty misleading as far as I’m concerned 

    these were the 2 screens I saw before they took my money  

    and I’m not a frequent flier on flo, so I hadn’t heard about the yearly only  policy




    I promise I am not trying to stir things up, but how is it misleading when the part where you enter your card info it literally says 12.50 and then beneath that $150.00 paid yearly? If that is something you are legitimately not used to seeing, i can understand the confusion. I guess as someone who appreciates what Flo does, I am getting irritated about people starting a new thread every time they aren't happy about it. I get that I can ignore it too, just as easy as people can either pay or move on. There is a lot that I can't do because of how much it costs.  

  19. 30 minutes ago, Tomaco411 said:

    I really wanted to see the quarters of the Big10s last weekend so I figured I’d just drop $12.50 and watch them on Flowrestling. Only problem was that when I clicked to pay the $12.50,  it said I was signed up for a Year for $150 , $12.50 a month, so a total of $150.00. 

    I didn’t even watch the quarters on Flo because I didn’t want them to say I watched and I’m responsible to pay the $150. After about 10 emails and phone calls, I finally got an email back, and they said they would refund everything but $29, what they say was their old monthly fee. So $29 for something I didn’t even watch, after trying to cancel within minutes of realizing I had been screwed out of $150  

    So this is basically a warning about Flowrestling, their business practices are questionable and their return policy is horrible. 

    Several subscription based services display it that way where it will have a monthly price, and very close to that price it will say $XX.XX Billed Annually. Definitely a bummer that the mistake happened. Perhaps you could keep pursuing to get the $29.00 back. If they refunded the 150, they might give in for the 29 too.

  20. My least favorite argument is "if wrestler A doesn't get "insert point amount" wrestler B loses". Obviously there is some truth to this because at the end of the day it is the number of points on the board that decide it, (minus a pin down 14-0). I also feel like trying to use this takes away the beauty of the sport. At any point guys can come up with some magic and big scoring opportunities. It is fine to say something was the difference maker, but Marinelli still dominated that match. He won the position that created the points, and his neutral defense is so good Cenzo knew he had to spend the rest of the match going for big points.

  21. I almost wonder if some of todays college athletes think it is cool or it shows how much you care to get emotional after a win or loss. 10 years ago I feel like it wasn't a thing, and the Metcalf push was the worst thing out there. IMO it was only that bad because Caldwell was mid flip and could have been hurt. I also wonder if the opportunity for exposure gets in these wrestlers minds as well. You have Flo hyping and broadcasting matches, which I am thankful for but now you have thousands plus watching online rather than just a few thousand in the arena. Ultimately it falls on the coaches and athletes to learn how to control this. It may simply just be a negative side affect of being in a brawl for 7 minutes. I know there were probably more than just Metcalf a decade ago, but it seems like the past few years the post match antics have been more prevalent.

  22. People keep mentioning the monthly option, and I'm not sure why it went away either. My guess would be though that with annual subscriptions, it is easier to know the load that you need to support will be. Everyone against the 150 annually is making it seem like every wrestling fan in America would have shelled out 20-30 bucks to watch the dual. Since much of the arguments are hypothetical I will offer one too.

    Say for example Flo brings back the monthly option, or a one time fee. They have to assume and guess how much bandwidth support they need from dual to dual. If they predict 25,000 viewers and only 10,000 watch, they lose money. If they predict 5,000 and 20,000 watch, it crashes. I feel like this logic may be is there were far more issues in the past when it seemed like the feed would crash more often, and the month to month was available.

    Even if people want to make the argument that they want a monthly option. Dec-Mar at $30/month is 120 dollars. For an extra 30 dollars you get the whole year, and you can watch FS/GR events, and further support the sport. Trust me, I don't mean to come across like a rich prick. I definitely understand what 150 dollars at once can require. Another option is put aside $12.50 each month and then you have your FloSports for the year.

  23. 54 minutes ago, RED said:

    This is an absolute joke.  What a punishment - he sites for Maryland?  Pleeeeze!  Some are saying he's caught in the crosshairs and if it were anyone else....

    The problem is, this behavior has become consistent.  Anytime tensions are high, we can expect to see more of the same.  I honestly hope he proves me wrong.  It would have been great to see Brands sit him for a real match, then I may have said something about him "stepping up."

    I think the timing of it is the main thing. Trust me, I am the first person to scoff when a FB player gets suspended for the first half of a game, against an FCS opponent. I remember Baker Mayfield's SR year at OU he didn't start against someone but only missed a few drives. If the point was for DeSanto to miss a real match, that wouldn't be for three weeks until IA wrestles OSU. That gives three more opportunities for an incident, and heck you probably have the board saying Brands did it to duck Fix. I think what will potentially affect DeSanto is the pride involved of being suspended, and everyone knowing why he is not out there. IMO that is the goal here, as it can hopefully provide a wake up call.

  24. 2 hours ago, Housebuye said:

    Double standard. Never would’ve happened if Austin didn’t lose it at NCAAs last year. 

    He put himself in the crosshairs because of that, which is on him. I don’t blame Brands, but that was no where near as bad as Gilman vs Missouri. It was about on par with what Berger did, but there is no chances he gets in trouble. 

    The incidents last year definitely have not helped his reputation, but I don’t think that caused the suspension. I think it was the 3-4 duals in a row with not only some antics but actually losing a team point. Now, you could say that this years antics and last year are just part of his personality. It very well could be that it was there the whole time, his struggle to maintain composure. Last year, his biggest spotlight was NCAAs where some big issues took place. This year he is at IA where they are always in the spotlight, on Flo, and etc. Maybe he just plays into the atmosphere too much. 

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