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PA-Fan

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Everything posted by PA-Fan

  1. Really. It is pure lunacy to think that the (many agree) best NCAA wrestler in history - who NEVER lost in 4 years of NCAA competition - could "keep it close" with Neal? Not win mind you - just keep it close (not get teched or pinned - which started this argument)....that is lunacy? Interesting. And it would not be equivalent to that - not at all. Not only is Maple not Cael. Neal, or Ruth - but going from 141 to 184 is a much more significant jump than going from 197 to 250-260. While the jump in pounds is bigger from Cael to Neal - the difference in strength from 141-184 and 197-HWT is not comparable. Yes, it is lunacy. It is not lunacy to say that Cael, say he rolled in at 210 or something, could "keep it close" with Rowlands or McCoy...lighter heavyweights. He might even be able to "keep it close" with some of the big guys who wrestle more defensively. But if he wrestled Stephen Neal 100 times, he would lose by major or worse 100 times and there would be a lot of pins and techs in there. This isn't any knock on Cael, it's just reality. A 165 Dake would never beat a 184/197 Cael. (But a 184 Dake?.....) I saw in my HS room our 160 lber regularly wrestle our HWT. The HWT was not a typical fat HWT - he was BIG (as in muscle) and could move in a way that seemed impossible. Both were state champions - and they battled in the room. The 160 lber would score and be in the matches they had - more than just keep it close. Extrapolate this example - make it two World Class level wrestlers - make the smaller one Cael Sanderson at 197 lbs instead of 160 lbs - and the bigger one Stephen Neal... and tell me why it is lunacy to think Cael could keep it close. Get serious. You may not intentionally be knocking Cael (im sure you are not) - but you are severely underestimating how freakishly good he was. Side note: I also like how you threw in there that Cael "might be able to keep it close" with bigger more defensive HWTs - :lol: . Maybe if he wrestled his best match ever he could keep from getting majored by Tony Nelson!!
  2. Really. It is pure lunacy to think that the (many agree) best NCAA wrestler in history - who NEVER lost in 4 years of NCAA competition - could "keep it close" with Neal? Not win mind you - just keep it close (not get teched or pinned - which started this argument)....that is lunacy? Interesting. And it would not be equivalent to that - not at all. Not only is Maple not Cael. Neal, or Ruth - but going from 141 to 184 is a much more significant jump than going from 197 to 250-260. While the jump in pounds is bigger from Cael to Neal - the difference in strength from 141-184 and 197-HWT is not comparable. *It is like Man vs. Boy at 141 vs. 184....and Man vs. Oversized Man at 197 vs. HWT
  3. PA-Fan

    Hodge

    You are over-simplifying. Criteria: 1. Record 2. Number of pins 3. Dominance 4. Past credentials 5. Quality of competition 6. Sportsmanship/citizenship 7. Heart
  4. No, that is not the question. The question is why do people keep talking about his RS year as if it somehow negates the fact that his still went 4 years of NCAA competition without a loss and 4 titles.
  5. Nelson isn't Neal....but Cael -the guy who went 159-0 with 4 titles and 3 hodge trophies with like 85% bonus wins- is "any 184 or 197 pounder"? Interesting. :lol:
  6. PA-Fan

    Hodge

    Logie before Ruth? I don't think so. Ramos isn't a returning champ and none at 133 (other than Ramos) are close in stature to the top 5 at 184. Heck Graff has a loss to Conaway. Plus, Logie had his freshman title giftwrapped at JO's expense. ;-) I think you need to look up the criteria for the Hodge award...
  7. I don't care if you outweigh Cael by 150 lbs. You are not teching him - and I doubt a HWT could pin him either. You think Tony Nelson would take it to Cael too?
  8. exactly. Cael should have lured Stephan Neal out of the World circuit and had the NCAA grant him a fifth year so he could beat the defending Hodge winner. I know you are joking, but it is a good comparison because that would have been going up a weight ala Dake. The only problem is that Neal would have pinned or teched Cael. Now I think you are just trolling. The guy who went 159-0 in his NCAA career would have gotten pinned or teched? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :shock:
  9. Reece Humphrey Zack Bailey Kevin LeValley Donnie VInson Who beat Cael during his redshirt year? How tough was that redshirt schedule? When comparing apples to apples, Dake becomes even more impressive, no redshirt and 4 different weight classes. Apples to apples...what are you talking about? Cael lost to Paul Jenn his RS year 6-4. He subsequently beat him 3 times: by maj. and 2 tech falls. Wait, Dake won at 4 different weight class and didn't redshirt?! No way I don't think anybody knew!! :?
  10. You had a very logical and well thought out argument up until this. How can Dake's career look better/more accomplished "on paper" than 159-0 with 4 Titles and 3 Hodge Trophies? :lol:
  11. Reece Humphrey Zack Bailey Kevin LeValley Donnie VInson
  12. You are right. But realize that this works both ways. If you take away the credentials that were earned later of the guys Cael beat...you must do the same for Dake. So in his finals wins, he did not beat 3 National champs - only 1. :twisted: But seriously - to the point of this thread...the people on here saying that Dake had much tougher competition than Cael - or that Cael had weak competition - just wow. It is astonishing how ignorant of a statement that is.
  13. I don't want to have an argument over something hypothetical and pointless. But no. Nobody in any competition that is that close with someone else will win or lose every time. Agree to disagree.
  14. There is no more toss up consideration. Those guys could wrestle 30 times and 50 minutes a match. Dake will/would come out on top, every time. Dake could beat Taylor another 10 times straight and there would still be posters claiming that Taylor is favored in the next match. "toss-up" does not equal "favored"
  15. Hahahaha I remember that. Hysterical.
  16. I don't think Howe is as bad a match-up for Taylor as Dake. Howe is tough to score on, just like Dake...but the huge difference is Dake's athletic ability. I think that Taylor has an easier time in folkstyle with Howe than he did with Dake. However, I do not think these two will be at the same weight class next season. I really hope I am wrong though! Seeing Taylor go up to 174 would be awesome :D (not gonna happen though.
  17. There is no more toss up consideration. Those guys could wrestle 30 times and 50 minutes a match. Dake will/would come out on top, every time. :roll: I bet nobody thought Mark Perry would/could beat Johnny Hendricks. To say that Taylor would lose to Dake every time is just silly...and also pointless because the time that matter Dake got it done.
  18. Literally the dumbest/most ridiculous thread and comment ive seen on these boards. And that is really saying a lot. If you think Taylor is "mentally weak" go back and examine his career. Please. Vak nailed it. He is not mentally weak - he has 3 career losses - all to national champions - 2 to Kyle Dake by 1 pt each time. God, the stupidity of this post is mind boggling. :shock:
  19. I believe you nailed it right here. This, however, does worry me!
  20. PA-Fan

    Hodge

    Listen. I love Ruth, and he had a hell of a season...but the Hodge is Dake's this year. It has to be. He had just as many pins as anyone else in contention - and beat the defending Nat Champ and Hodge winner 3 times along the way. Not to mention his past credentials (which is one of the criteria) blows everyone else away (except for maybe Stieber who is 2 for 2..but still). Last year I was bitterly arguing with scribe over how Dake in no way deserved the Hodge - he wasn't even in 2nd place behind Taylor (that was Ruth). But this year - Dake is the clear choice. Stieber/Ruth in second. Oliver behind them.
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