Jump to content

MSU158

Members
  • Content Count

    7,541
  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    34

Everything posted by MSU158

  1. To say he wrestled poorly is a fact. McDonough and Brands agree with me. Even though McDonough was hurt, he still was able to secure a high seed for ncaas and beat both Garrett and Megaludis earlier in the year. He had Garret right where he wanted him going into the 3rd period at the ncaas, but he wrestled poorly from the bottom position in regulation, and poorly from neutral in overtime. I'm sorry, but that can't be denied. I can't see how anyone could describe his wrestling in the latter part of his matches with Garrett and Sprenkle as being anything good. Or the way he repeatedly walked into Delgado's shots. And again, the notion that because someone has an injury going into a mach, therefore the injury must be the primary reason for whatever goes wrong is silly. Just because someone loses a match while hurt/injured it doesn't mean that the injury was the main or even second reason why they lost. McDonough was healthy enough to win at the ncaas. Just like he was healthy enough to beat Megaludis and everyone else he beat on the season. Yes, he had to alter his style a little, but he didn't have to COMPLETELY change everything. That is simply an exaggeration. And I do take McDonough at his word, and what I saw from him over the year is consistent with what he said. I can see there is no way to convince you that your viewpoint is skewed. At the highest level of ALL sports injuries and illnesses, even small ones, play a integral part in their performance. A small knee injury may cause a running back to cut differently than he would have if he was confident his knee would work properly. It was glaringly obvious that mcdonoughs offensive style that had made him dominant for 3 years was gone. You can ignore the fact he had surgery and listen to the no excuse mentality but in the end he made it as far as he did his senior year on heart alone. His body wasn't where he needed it to be and at the very highest level where everyone's year is on the line injuries make elite(Letters, Kish, Pucillo, etc.) beatable.
  2. I was thinking more on the lines of WWE or MMA. It is one thing to challenge a linebacker to a wrestling match. I did it before. It is another to expect him to have a clue or, more importantly, any interest in following the rules. The first time a guy that big and strong clubs you in the back of the head you may start to rethink things. Well WWE is fake so I guess whoever wins this match is whoever the promoters pick and if MMA I have no clue to how tough either of these guys are when getting hit in the face but most likely would put my money on Ruth because of his conditioning and wrestling skills. When responding to me please read and respond to more than the first sentence. My point of the post was not only that bullough may not follow folk style rules but that he may not follow any rules. He may use WWE style As most non wrestlers do without faking it like the real guys do. In the end when big guys hit you it hurts!
  3. I was thinking more on the lines of WWE or MMA. It is one thing to challenge a linebacker to a wrestling match. I did it before. It is another to expect him to have a clue or, more importantly, any interest in following the rules. The first time a guy that big and strong clubs you in the back of the head you may start to rethink things.
  4. Because the Brands mentality of "NO EXCUSES" was ingrained into McDonough's brain DOES NOT change the fact he had to wrestle COMPLETELY different than he did in previous years due to his injury. How well he did his senior year was a testament to his will power. To say he wrestled poorly is a joke. He was unable to wrestle matches HIS way and with a broken down body got beat a couple times at the most grueling tournament of the year. To point out how he lost the matches is to ignore the fact he would have been in different positions if he was at full strength. Again, I cannot stress enough that the fact McDonough won't make the excuse does NOT mean his injury wasn't why he lost.
  5. That depends on if the match adheres to college wrestling rules. I have learned to never underestimate high level athletes in ANY form of a confrontation when they can bench press 450lb+, squat 600lb+ and standing high jump 3ft.
  6. Here is the chance for all of you college wrestling media haters to sink or swim. Max Bullough of MSU has been suspended from the MSU football team for the BIGGEST game of his career, as a senior no less. So far no specifics, other than exactly what PSU released. He was suspended for breaking team rules. Dantonio has treated the media very similar to how Sanderson did regarding Ruth. Here is your chance to see how long and how hard the Media pries into the reason why the suspension happened. This gets 50x the national attention that College Wrestling does and there is still no information. Me thinks some of you may owe some much less paid, yet often more dedicated, media sources an apology!
  7. No clue why this became 2 topics.
  8. Good question. He finished 143-6-1 with all 6 losses in his true freshman year. He did have a tie after that. I would have them very comparable and maybe interchangeable. I would have no issue with someone putting Kemp ahead of him, but I personally would still put Ruth ahead of Kemp. Again, this is ALL based on the ASSUMPTION he finishes this year undefeated and as dominantly as last year.
  9. He should replace about 47 or so. The biggest problem/argument used in the GOAT argument is 4 years wrestling vs. 3. A lot of people bring up 3 year wrestlers when comparing and I think this argument would actually HELP Ruth. He, in all likelihood will finish UNDEFEATED his final 3 years. Since the 3 year wrestlers only wrestled 3 because they couldn't wrestle Varsity as freshman Ruth fits right in. As far as 4 year guys go his career record will be better than EVERYONE not named Sanderson. If he finishes this year undefeated, and more importantly, as dominant as the last 2 years he has a GREAT argument to be a TOP5 guy. ruth also didn't wrestle varsity as a freshman he is as dominant as any wrestler has been in their senior year but there are a lot of greats out there and he isn't likely to even get the hodge this year with taylor winning it I know the use of redshirting complicates things, however my argument was based off of them only having their last 3 years of eligibility. Even before the 80's wrestlers without the redshirt option were still allowed an injury option and many gamed that system back then. I do know that there was a stretch where wrestlers were only given 4 years to complete 3 years of eligibility where it is now 5 for 4. The point still remains he will finish his last 3 years undefeated, which puts him VERY high on every list. He will also finish with only 2 Varsity losses in 4 total years of wrestling. None other than Sanderson have a better record. I know the above is based off of assumptions but, IF, he does finish this year the way most believe he will his 4 year Varsity career stats, simply by the numbers, are better than anyone not named Cael.
  10. He should replace about 47 or so. The biggest problem/argument used in the GOAT argument is 4 years wrestling vs. 3. A lot of people bring up 3 year wrestlers when comparing and I think this argument would actually HELP Ruth. He, in all likelihood will finish UNDEFEATED his final 3 years. Since the 3 year wrestlers only wrestled 3 because they couldn't wrestle Varsity as freshman Ruth fits right in. As far as 4 year guys go his career record will be better than EVERYONE not named Sanderson. If he finishes this year undefeated, and more importantly, as dominant as the last 2 years he has a GREAT argument to be a TOP5 guy.
  11. You are joking, right? No. I think many assume they are, but I'm not sure how many know for sure. Just because they look very similar doesn't make them identical. Kind of like the famous Olsen twins who aren't identical. They ARE Identical twins.........
  12. I am sorry but your argument is like comparing a Cadillac salesman with a Ford Fiesta salesman. Which one do you think has an easier time selling a car? MSU is a FULLY funded B1G program. It SHOULD and USED TO sell itself. CMU is a MAC school in a Native Indian town. Having equal expectations for both programs is ridiculous. Have you ever heard of the phrase, "doing more with less"? Minkel, over the last 10 years is doing, "less with more". Of the above stats you have quoted ONLY 3 wrestlers have contributed over the last 10 years, the Simmons brothers and Gomez(who admittedly wanted to transfer). In addition to the above paragraph, CMU has DOMINATED MSU over the last 10 years. I will admit that when I was there, 94-99, we were a Contender. He was really goofy, even then, but most of the guys liked him. He simply has NOT changed with the times. Everything about the program has stagnated and he has DONE NOTHING to try to change this. His time has passed. PERIOD! Comparing coaching careers over an equal period of time is really all that can be done to draw a fair conclusion. The level of expectation of each program is very debatable. You would think the administration of a Big 10 school would have much more expectation compared to that of a MAC school (and all other conferences), but we all know that is not true based on the current debate. I believe you can disregard your phrase "doing more with less" with the comparison of MSU Tom and CMU Tom. I can honestly say it would be very difficult to determine which situation has 'less". The MAC vs Big 10 argument is cliché at best, there is so much more than conference that "sells" an institution. I agree that the MSU situation is stagnate and change in leadership (total change) could revive a program with great potential. The MSU Wrestling community needs to unite and bring the promise of financial support to leverage change. Emails to the administration reminding them of a dual meet loss or a tournament performance is not the best proactive strategy. They are obviously satisfied with the current level of expectation. Start by recognizing that the list of coaching accomplishments was achieved by more than 3 wrestlers. Those accomplishments resulted from the efforts of 30 athletes a year for 22 years, possibly including yourself from 94-99. If the current level of expectation is not high enough, unite the 22 years of Minkle alumni and find what makes athletic administration listen ($). Believe me we are TRYING HARD. As far as comparing the 2 schools, and I KNOW your stance on Borrelli, I can tell you first hand that NATIONAL recruiting is 10x easier for a Fully Funded B1G school located near a major city vs. a MAC school surrounded by an Indian Reservation. You can dislike Borrelli all you want and I won't debate you on the subject. But using the comparision between the 2 coaches to say Minkel's past 10 years are ANYTHING but HORRIBLE is laughable. A head coach with his approach should be DISAPPEARED.
  13. You guys are NUTZ! Terry Brands is probably the best lightweight coach in the COUNTRY! Look at what 125-141 has done since Terry has been the Assistant. The problems, if there truly are any, for Iowa are NOT at the lower weights. If you watch any of the practices or listen to the wrestlers (even Cejudo) they credit Terry BIG TIME!
  14. I am sorry but your argument is like comparing a Cadillac salesman with a Ford Fiesta salesman. Which one do you think has an easier time selling a car? MSU is a FULLY funded B1G program. It SHOULD and USED TO sell itself. CMU is a MAC school in a Native Indian town. Having equal expectations for both programs is ridiculous. Have you ever heard of the phrase, "doing more with less"? Minkel, over the last 10 years is doing, "less with more". Of the above stats you have quoted ONLY 3 wrestlers have contributed over the last 10 years, the Simmons brothers and Gomez(who admittedly wanted to transfer). In addition to the above paragraph, CMU has DOMINATED MSU over the last 10 years. I will admit that when I was there, 94-99, we were a Contender. He was really goofy, even then, but most of the guys liked him. He simply has NOT changed with the times. Everything about the program has stagnated and he has DONE NOTHING to try to change this. His time has passed. PERIOD!
  15. Otto again, showing some support during the pegboard. While some random extra/hater in the background tries to discourage Louden by saying "Come on Louden, not even Otto can do that." Come on don't be afraid to answer my 2nd quote. As a high schooler, the 2nd quote may be part of my favorite scene of the movie at that time.
  16. Email has been sent to your address.
  17. "Come on, Louden. Go for it, babe!" "Hello, Carla. I just was getting this shirt."
  18. How long of a line do you think there would be waiting for the chance to wrestle Metcalf in a 9 minute match? The US does NOT have 1 guy that would be competitive with Metcalf for 9 minutes at that weight. PERIOD. The score between Russell and Simmons was deceiving there were a LOT of great scrambles and as Russell has done throughout his career he ended up coming out on top of them. I admit Wendland was a poor decision and it was definitely the weak link of the match ups but you said 'No Names" and Wendland is the ONLY one who could even REMOTELY fit that bill.
  19. I am sorry but your account of Iowa wrestling has some SERIOUS flaws in it. The "IOWA STYLE" stills works against ALMOST all DI competition. St. John will most likely be a 4x AA,3x Finalist and 2x champ without having ANY truly visible offensive technique. Ramos bullies nearly everyone he wrestles and is still the favorite to win 133 this year. Lofthouse has a legit chance to be a Finalist without any discernible offense. Evans will finish top 6 and could finish as high as 3rd. Moore and Telford have a legit chance to finish top 4. That is SIX guys who not just CAN but SHOULD place TOP6 in the NATION. The jury is still out on Burak due to injury. In addition, you have 2 guys like Clark and Dziewa who are young and have shown they have potential. Kelly is HORRIBLE. Looking at the paragraph above, Iowa has a legit chance at 9 AA's. But 6-7 is more likely. If 6-7 AA's with a couple NCAA championships is a sign that the style they use doesn't work anymore there are only MAYBE 3 programs in the nation that are wrestling a style that works. Your argument is just BIASED SILLINESS. You used a comparision between a 3x defending championship team, who are the definitive favorites to win it again this year, and Iowa. The matches Iowa lost were 4-1 to a 2x finalist using their backup 125, 4-2 against the number 2 undefeated wrestler coming fresh off upsetting a 2x champ, Kelly is the WEAK link, Moore looked like ANY other 165 would against Taylor, Evans lost 4-1 to a defending finalist, Lofthouse looked about as good as ANYONE could against Ruth, and Brooks got pounded but he is a backup 184. So to sum it up, Iowa lost 7 out of 10 matches to: 125 A 2x finalist 141 an undefeated Former Cadet world champ 149 WEAK LINK vs WEAK LINK 165 A 3x soon to be 4x finalist 174 A defending Finalist 184 One of the best of ALL TIME 197 A very good wrestler who will probably be a 3x AA The above group would and pretty much HAS made EVERY other team look like their style doesn't work. I will leave you with an analogy that I think fits very well. The NFL has become a PASSING league. However, a team that rushes for 300 yards a game would still win almost every game. But, if you put them up against Peyton Manning and the Broncos the odds are they would still lose. Just because they lost to one of the most high powered offenses of all time DOES NOT mean their style doesn't win.
  20. I will agree that they did not promote the event very well. HOWEVER, to call them NO NAMES and POOR MATCHUPS is WRONG. This event was held in Michigan and they wanted to use as many local wrestlers to further promote the event as possible. Metcalf vs. Bono 3 NCAA championships and 5 Finals appearances between the 2. Also several World team members. Metcalf definitely pounded him but you can't control the outcomes before hand. Kellen Russell vs. Andy Simmons 5 A finishes between the 2 and 2 NCAA championships. The score was again lopsided but it was actually a very entertaining match. Simmons is still a big name in Michigan and would draw more there than Russell would. Cam Simaz vs. Ben Bennett I count 8 AA finishes between the 2. Did I just say 8? There is also a NCAA Championship mixed in there. A matchup between 2 of the most highly decorated Michigan natives in DI wrestling. Until the 3rd period the match was competitive but you couldn't ask for a better matchup to draw fans in Michigan. Max Askren vs. Sam Wendland. Here is the only case where you can argue 1 "no name". We all know Askren was a NCAA champ but Wendland was a 4x NCAA qualifier. In addition Wendland is an Assistant Coach at MSU so the local ties continued. Because the scores were pretty lopsided that does NOT mean the match ups were poor. The match up variables were there to draw the local fans, the problem is most wrestling fans are NOT used to any type of promotion for wrestling and most don't even look for it. Agon itself may be ran poorly but attacking the wrestlers as "NO NAMES" is COMPLETELY inaccurate.
  21. If there are 300 of them, and, because it is Michigan State, they are Spartans, then what you will have is a glorious battle against a whole lot of Persians. You are very observant and I am thoroughly impressed that you caught that subtle reference.
  22. No. And the reason why is there is NO WAY to do this without embarrassing the wrestlers as well. Now if everyone wore Run Minkel Out Of Town T Shirts you may get somewhere, but again, I doubt ANY family members, who make up most of the crowd, would do this and risk difficulties for their family member wrestling for MSU. It would take getting 300 or so former wrestlers and/or alumni that normally don't attend to START attending and make their opinion known. The problem is I can't get the 20 or so I know to care enough to do something like that.
  23. I figured as much. With the passion you have shown over the last few years I knew better than to think you hadn't already approached the Admins. I was simply hoping that a window of opportunity was still available. Thank You for the explanation and Thank You for all your efforts to keep MSU wrestling alive.
  24. I have tried. As I have said, those I knew and know that were a bigger part of the program have mostly drifted away and most don't care. I am proactive but I don't want to look like a kook if I go to meets and try to organize what is mainly the wrestler's families to try to push Minkel out. A lot of these parents don't want to rock the boat when their kid is on the team. The biggest problem is there isn't a strong enough fanbase to push Minkel out............. You can't talk to parents and such. That is off limits. It has to be the older guys and behind doors. If the interest isn't there, it isn't there and you are stuck. Try calling the AD to ask him if you can take him out to lunch, but don't be shocked if he asks you to contribute financially. That is what they do. That is what I am trying to get Dale to do. I think he could get an audience with Hollis much easier and the odds he would make an impact are significantly better. The results of such an attempt by Dale would let me know if there is anything further I can do.
×
×
  • Create New...