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Graverobber

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Posts posted by Graverobber


  1. Hey folks, I got a bit of free time and decided to make this thread. I will update the first post after each day and count all the qualified weights per nation at the end of world's. 

    Greco Roman 6 weights in total (60kg, 67kg, 77kg, 87kg, 97kg, 130kg) :

    Germany : 3 (67kg, 87kg, 130kg)

    Russia : 3 (60kg, 67kg, 97kg) 

    Uzbekistan : 3 (60kg, 77kg, 87kg)

    Iran : 3 (60kg, 77kg, 130kg)

    Kazakhstan : 2 (60kg, 77kg) 

    Ukraine : 2 (60kg, 87kg)

    Armenia : 2 (77kg, 97kg)

    Turkey : 2 (97kg, 130kg)

    Cuba : 2 (67kg, 130kg)

    Hungary : 2 (77kg, 87kg) should be noted, the two qualified weights are brothers and both in the final. 

    Georgia : 2 (97kg, 130kg) 

    Serbia : 2 (67kg, 97kg)

    Japan : 1 (60kg)

    Egypt : 1 (67kg)

    Denmark : 1 (67kg)

    Kirgisistan : 1 (87kg)

    Belarus : 1 (87kg)

    Sweden : 1 (77kg)

    Polen : 1 (97kg)

    Estland : 1 (130kg)

    Women Freestyle 6 weights in total (50kg, 53kg, 57kg, 62kg, 68kg, 76kg) :

    China : 2 (50kg, 53kg)

    Azerbaijan : 1 (50kg)

    Romania : 1 (50kg)

    Kazakhstan : 1 (50kg)

    Japan : 1 (53kg)

    Greece : 1 (53kg) 

    Prk (don't know what this is) : 1 (53kg)

    That's the list so far, I will update it this evening or tomorrow morning and will continue to update it until the competition is over, feel free to discuss. 

     


  2. 2 minutes ago, Chet said:

    Father time has caught up to Vlasov. Maybe he'll get on a good Russian supplement program and make a run in 2020?

    Maybe, I think he can medal at the Olympics but at first he need to qualify his weight. 

    Did you guys noticed the top 6 in 97kg? All 6 are from Europe, which will give the "lesser" European guys a good chance to qualify at the qualifier tournament! 


  3. 1 hour ago, whaletail said:

    From your earlier post, it seems like the DRL teams actually use lower level German wrestlers (who wouldn't be able to make the national/world team anyway), but higher level foreign wrestlers.  Is that correct?

    And if I read it right, there are only 4 DRL teams across all of Germany?  Or just in Baden-Wurttemberg?  Whereas the original amateur leagues sill have many teams within each region?

    Finally, do those wrestlers - all foreign, I guess - of Ringer or Gwiz' level get paid a decent salary (~100,000+ euros per annum), or only around 1K euros per match?

    It is correct, at the moment only lower lvl German wrestlers compete in the DRL, it's to high of a risk to compete in the DRL if you still want to be considered for worlds or Europeans. In Germany the Coaches pick the Nationalteam and since the federation and the DRL are not in good terms they could end up losing their position in the team. For example, a few Germans signing with the DRL : Mohammed Yeter got kicked out a few years ago of the nationalteam because of weight issues. Ibrahim Fallacara ended his international career a few years ago and just wants to wrestle in the league.

    The DRL and the amateur league uses high lvl foreigners, in the first season of the DRL Schifferstadt hired most of the U23 Team of Georgia because the Coach and Manager in Schifferstadt knew the U23 Coach of Georgia. 

    Currently the DRL league contains 6 Teams (5 German and 1 Belgium) and it's suggested and there are rumors about the DRL clubs wanting to get back under the roof of federation. Also it's unlikely that new clubs will enlist in the DRL because often times a club in the highest league got more than one team in the amateur leagues and it could hurt the career of all wrestlers, nobody wants to risk the career of the wrestling offspring. Also it might be bad for the club as well to join the DRL, because the majority of visitors are regional wrestling fans and a big minus is, the attending folks often times can't interact with the foreigners like they can interact with German wrestlers due to language barrier. 

    Hmm! About the payroll I can't say anything, mostly because I don't know it. The budget of Ispringen under the Federation was approximately 400k euro just for the wrestlers and what I heard a few years ago was Soner Demirtas (Bronze Olympics 2016 74kg freestyle) earned round about 25k during the season, flights and everything got obviously paid. I think Gwiz and Dieringer will have 3-4 Fights, because it would be too expensive to let them stay in Germany for the whole season and it's nuts to fly every week from the US to Germany for 6 minutes of wrestling so I suggest they will cash in 8-12k in total. 

    Edit Also it should be noted, in Eastern Europe a payroll of 8-12k is much more than 8-12k in the US due to living costs 


  4. 2 hours ago, Mphillips said:

    Thanks Graverobber.

    This sounds like it works much like the Bundesliga Soccer Association?  Is that a fair statement the way the teams are relegated and/or promoted?

    Yes, on a lot smaller scale obviously, an average Bundesliga match will be attended by like 600-1500 visitors, depending on the team, location and everything. Playoff finals can be up to 6000 visitors.


  5. 14 minutes ago, whaletail said:

    If you don't mind, that'd be great!  The article didn't go into any detail regarding the number of teams, matches, rules, etc., and my curiosity is definitely piqued.

    I had no idea any sort of professional freestyle/greco league existed anywhere, not least Deutschland.

    Well, to understand the DRL you need to understand the system of wrestling leagues in Germany at first and the argument of the German federation and the DRL. 

    In Germany we got in each State a few regional federations and all of them organize 3-4 leagues with one league for the whole state. For example, I live in Baden-Württemberg and we got Federations of Württemberg, Süd Baden, North Baden and ARGE Bodensee/Schwarzwald, in all of this Federations we got like 4 leagues with different level, you as a team start in the lowest league and if you win the league you move on to the next. Each league contains 6-10 Teams and they compete from September to Christmas twice against each other, one time in your hometown and the other time at their town. A win gains 2 Point, draw gains 1 point and a lose 0 points. When you and, you're team win all state leagues and move on to the Bundesliga, we got 3 Bundesligen, South, North and Middle with 8 teams. The best 8 Teams of the 3 leagues compete from January to February in playoffs against each other. 

    These leagues are labeled as "amateur leagues" because wrestling is a amateur sport. A few years ago, I think about 20 years or more, the DRB (Federation) decided to allow 2 Foreigners in the lower teams and 4 foreigners in the Bundesliga. Each Team contains 10 Wrestler in the following Classes 57kg, 61kg, 66kg, 71kg, 75kg twice, 80kg, 86kg, 97kg and 130kg, five matches freestyle and 5 matches greco, they shift in the second half of the season. Usually in the fourth or fifth league it's common to "buy" two foreigners from Romania, Bulgaria, Polen or any other country with relatively near distance to Germany, the foreigner wrestler usually stay for the season in Germany or drive each other week for 6 minutes of wrestling to Germany, they get paid 100-300€ per fight and are expected to win every fight. Last year my old team in 3th league hired the 97kg bronce medal winner of U23 Worlds of 2017 and it was a good thing for him, because he earned money and competed 16 times against opponents of various skill levels, I think he lost one or two fights, just to understand the level of the leagues. 

    Every wrestler can earn 4 Points for his team in each match. The way for earning the points are

    Win with 1-3 Points difference = 1 Point for Team

    Win with 4-8 Points difference = 2 Points for Team. 

    Win with 8-14 Points difference = 3 Points for Team 

    Win with 15 Points or more difference = 4 Points for Team

    Pin = 4 Points for Team 

    In the lower leagues usually U23 or junior members of foreigner nationalteams get hired, but in the highest league often times worldchamps or medalwinners of worlds or Europeans get hired, for example Magumedmurat Gadzhiev, Cengizhan Erdogan, Balint Korpasi and many more.

    A few years ago a ceo and millionar of a big company in Germany needed a new hobby and decided to sponsor a small wrestling club in his hometown of Ispringen, he bought some foreigners, some German wrestlers and Ispringen worked his way up in the leagues and finally arrived in the DRB Bundesliga. He payed the foreigners and Germans very well, hired professional coaches and everything. He also tried to change the Bundesliga because we had 5 Teams with money up to 400k € each year just for the wrestlers and teams with less money and because of the high maintenance costs(for each foreigner wrestler the uww wants 500-1500€ just to allow them to transfer/wrestle and the state federation often times also wants money to let them go each week to compete) of the teams the Bundesliga got smaller and smaller and contained just 12 teams at the end. He decided to fund his own league and of the 12 teams just 4 joined them, Ispringen, Weingarten, Nendingen and Schifferstadt, later Eisleben and the Belgium based Team Eupen joined the League. Of course the German federation wasn't a fan of this because they lost a ton of money from the fees the 5 teams usually would pay and forbid every German wrestler to compete in the DRL otherwise they will get kicked out of the nationalteam. So the DRL decided to pronounce their league as a professional league to fight in court to allow the German wrestlers to compete in the DRL, the federation lost the battle in court and has to allow German wrestlers to compete in DRL but they told every German, if they compete in the DRL they will not be considered for the international Competitions and now only the third or fourth guy signs with DRL Clubs or older guys who wants to earn a bit of money and are totally fine with not competing internationally anymore. The DRL pays approximately 1000€ or more for each fight for a German guy, so it's not a bad thing for them. But because of the ban of German wrestlers the teams decided the rules in the DRL are, 10 Wrestlers for each fight, 6 Athletes from European countries are allowed and 4 guys from non European countries, such the US or Russia are allowed. The teams in total contain 24 Wrestlers. 

    I hope it's not to long to read and you understand everything, if not just ask, I wi try to explain everything. 


  6. Usually the videos are also on YouTube after a few days. I saw the Line-up of Ispringen yesterday, I hope dieringer and gwiz get well paid. 

    Edit : I also plan to attend a few of the matches and maybe get the chance to talk to both of them, usually it's possible to talk to the athletes before or after the matches but the Russians don't speak English very well


  7. Germany has his best greco team in a few years. I hope we can at least win 3 Medals. 

    57kg Fabian Schmitt won bronze at the European Games but due to a good draw he came into the match for bronze with 0-1. 

    60kg Etienne Kinsinger, well got nothing to say about him besides he is very solid. 

    67kg Frank Stäbler hopefully will win his 4th World Title and the Olympics afterwards. 

    72kg Michael Widmayer is a young guy, it's his first Worldchampionship but he has good results and trains very very much, with a good draw and a non Olympic weightclass he can win bronze. 

    77kg Roland Schwarz, also a young guy, son of famous Russian wrestler Islam Dugutschijew, he won second at Europeans and all of his matches were pretty awesome and solid besides of his final against Vlasow, but again he is only 22. 

    82kg Pascal Eisele, well Pascal won the Europeans in 2016 and bronce at world's in 2017, his last tournaments weren't the best we saw from him, but I think he still can win a medal. 

    87kg Denis Kudla, Kudla the only guy on the team with an Olympic medal, he won bronce in 2016 Rio and silver at world's 2017, this year at the Europeans he lost razor-sharp against Abbasov from Aze but fought against absolute beasts in the repechage like Dawit Tschakwetadse and Maksim Manukjan to win the bronce medal and I think he will win a medal again. 

    97kg Peter Öhler looked good at the grand prix of Germany and it seems he overcame his injuries and I'm a bit curious about him, he always seems like a medal threat but ends up injuring himself, like last year world's he injured his elbow against Venezuela and lost. 

    130kg Eduard Popp finally deserves a medal, he always ends up getting 5th place but a good draw like last year he won't get this year, but I hope he proves me wrong. 


  8. 14 hours ago, Lurker said:

    Yes he will. Check the selection procedures. 

    Are you sure about that? Correct me if I am wrong but somebody explained it like this a while ago, if you win a medal in another weightclass you are placed in quarterfinals and if you win a medal in the exact weightclass you're placed in the semis 


  9. 2 hours ago, The Genius said:

    Abdollahi lost the Bronze medal match 8-6 vs GER. Very disappointing performance.

    Now Zare has to win at 125kg if we want to finish 2nd. 

    I'm very happy for Agca, I met him a couple of times and he's gonna be the number 1 in Germany in a few years, if he joins the military or similar to focus on training. How was the match?


  10. 1 hour ago, lu1979 said:

    What about that Russian that tossed Coon around in last years finals - I think he beat the Turk or at least had the Turk on his side of the bracket last year - I would think he enters as the favorite.

    I don't know, in my opinion the Russian wasn't as good as I expected at the grand prix of Germany. Heiki Nabi is not bad, but I don't know the guy from Finland and roumania 

    http://rdb.ringen.de/?sv=cms&nc=38&tk=tnm&op=tpa&xotypeid=0&tnmid=6&tnacid=3&xoview=q&wcid=21&paid=570&xopaid=570&xoname=Shchur&xogivenname=Vitalii&xoorg=Russland&orgid=73&xoou=HUN&__=1565385892.1893995250


  11. From my perspective (Germany), I appreciate every foreign wrestler willing to train here and help our own athletes to develop their skills. Since the crisis in Syria we got a few Iranian Guys like Asghar Lagari (FS 125kg) and Abdolmohammad Papi (GR 61/66kg) and we only benefitted from them, but also I think prior to international competitions athletes in the same bracket should be separated from each other for the last part of the trainingcamp. For example JB and Chamizo use to train in the same Club, chamizo should be not allowed to train from the moment JB is nominated for worlds. 


  12. I know the most guys around here don't follow greco as much as Freestyle but please consider to look at Frank Stäbler when he will wrestle his matches at 67kg :)

    He's the German equivalent to Borroughs (not as much Medals as Borroughs but I think you know what I mean), he won 2015, 2017 and 2018 World (66kg, 71kg and 72kg) Championsships and he is looking good in his old Weightclass 67kg with a win yesterday over Artem Sukov (Gold World Championship 67kg) at the UWW Grand Prix of Germany and he's aiming for his fourth title and for his first Olympic medal. He's a great rolemodel for any wrestler and his style is really fun to watch. 


  13. 7 hours ago, AHamilton said:

    Mr. Maia won't get the takedown, but is a killer off his back.  I'm not sure it is a great matchup for Ben.

    And in sad news, a boxer just died from injuries sustained in the ring... in a fight that was stopped against his wishes by his corner in between rounds.  Those  16 oz gloves!

    Well, at least nobody has to worry Ben will get more braindamage in this match up. I think he will win this by decision, so many good wrestlers were able to beat Maia and if askren sticks to the same gameplan, I see him winning.

    Rest in peace to the boxer :( I saw it today in the news... roundabout 260 strikes to the head. The coach did the right thing in stopping him from continuing the fight but unfortunately it was to late. 

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