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Foley Mailbag today says Spencer Lee will be an NCAA Champion and future world senior team member and his chances will be high if chooses Penn State since he'll get to practice every day with Franklin Gomez. 

 

Also, should Lee land in Happy Valley I think that the chances of him making an Olympic run are greatly improved since he'll have a room full of young talent and Franklin Gomez with whom he can roll and learn.

 

 

But I'm sure Foley is just pulling a Willie, you know, steering recruits towards Happy Valley. LOL. 

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Foley Mailbag today says Spencer Lee will be an NCAA Champion and future world senior team member and his chances will be high if chooses Penn State since he'll get to practice every day with Franklin Gomez. 

 

Also, should Lee land in Happy Valley I think that the chances of him making an Olympic run are greatly improved since he'll have a room full of young talent and Franklin Gomez with whom he can roll and learn.

 

 

But I'm sure Foley is just pulling a Willie, you know, steering recruits towards Happy Valley. LOL. 

Under that awesome logic, he should be super greatly improved by going to Iowa since he'd be rolling around with better young lightweight talent (Gilman, Clark, McDonough, Ramos vs. Megaludis and Conaway) and Brent Metcalf, who is in Franklin Gomez' weight class and beat him just a month or so ago.

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The PA fanboys really are nauseating.  I am fairly certain Tdope is about 13, and if Chasden didn't make constant reference to being a parent, I'd think he was Tdope's younger brother.

 

It's actually pretty sad to see.  You boys need to get out of your trailers, take off the camo pajamas, and see the world a little.

There's more to life than where the best 110lbs kid in America is going to school.  

BTW, drop the "he's the best HS wrestler in America" line.  He got handled by the OK kid a month or so ago.

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Under that awesome logic, he should be super greatly improved by going to Iowa since he'd be rolling around with better young lightweight talent (Gilman, Clark, McDonough, Ramos vs. Megaludis and Conaway) and Brent Metcalf, who is in Franklin Gomez' weight class and beat him just a month or so ago.

This was TFoley's patented dig at Iowa to get the clicks up. If you don't think that him and Flo do this on purpose you are mistaken.

 

I mean Ramos, Dennis, and McDonugh all had about a 1/2 the pedigree of Lee and they will be the top contenders to Make an Olympic run next year. Add in current college guys Gilman & Clark, future recruits  Mejia and Renteria,  Brent " currently better than Gomez" Metcalf and throw in Terry "knows the sport of wrestling more than anyone I know - Andy Hrovat" Brands and I think he would have a decent chance at an Olympic run at Iowa too.

Edited by OtisCampbell

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Foley also said this in his mailbag column, which has me scratching my head about more than anything else i've ever read from him:

 

"As for weight classes I understand that eight weight classes feels like it would be better for the sport because there are more opportunities for weight class competition. But the reduction in the number of weight classes actually offers wrestling a myriad benefits. 

Contrary to the idea that wrestling has crowded national fields at many weights (e.g., 74 kilos in USA and 65 kilos in Russia), no country, including the United States and Russia, was able to fill every Olympic qualification spot in 2012. That means that no matter what the funding, training system, or location near the Caspian Sea there was no nation able to fill an entire Olympic roster."

 

 

"the reduction in the number of weight classes actually offers wrestling a myriad benefits" WTF?

 

and the rosters? its due to the limited number of qualifying spots. fewer qualifiers per spot = less countries fielding full rosters. more qualifying spots = more countries filling full rosters. what does that have to do with any federation having deep weight classes? 

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That weight class comment is just moronic.

In fairness, Foley offered a rationale for his position.  Something along the lines of "four placers per wt means more countries will produce placers.  In turn these countries are more likely to continue to fund their wrestling programs."  Left unsaid is his contention that only three placers per wt--even with two extra wt classes--would lead to less countries producing placers.  

 

Personally, I'd still rather have more wt classes and one less placer per wt.

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Wrestling is such a fringe sport that I would rather have more athletes participating than a few less countries. I don't really buy that more countries will fund wrestling because one of their wrestlers sneaks in a 3rd/4th place every once in a while. That might be true at the margin once every blue moon, but I don't see how that's such a great benefit. I'd rather see more Russians, Iranians, Americans, etc. per event.

 

If the sport ever becomes popular enough that having one or two less countries participating matters, then the popularity should attract more international participation/funding anyway.

 

I got Foley's point but thought it was very weak relative to the benefits of more weights. If we think we have a great product, which given the "new" rules in freestyle, I think we do, then we should want to showcase it as much as possible at each major event, not less.

Edited by wrestlingnerd

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In fairness, Foley offered a rationale for his position.  Something along the lines of "four placers per wt means more countries will produce placers.  In turn these countries are more likely to continue to fund their wrestling programs."  Left unsaid is his contention that only three placers per wt--even with two extra wt classes--would lead to less countries producing placers.  

 

Personally, I'd still rather have more wt classes and one less placer per wt.

I'm pretty sure that if more weight classes were added there would be more countries with medalists on average if you kept the double bronze.  Is there any indication that the IOC cares about the total number of medals distributed?  I've only heard about there being a limit on the number of beds in the Olympic village.

 

Given the cap on the total number of athletes, I'd rather give up athlete numbers and see each style get 8 or 10 Olympic weight classes with 8 or 12-man brackets, than 6 weight classes with 20-man brackets.

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Wrestling is such a fringe sport that I would rather have more athletes participating than a few less countries. I don't really buy that more countries will fund wrestling because one of their wrestlers sneaks in a 3rd/4th place every once in a while. That might be true at the margin, but I don't see how that's such a great benefit. I'd rather see more Russians, Iranians, Americans, etc. per event.

 

If the sport ever becomes popular enough that having one or two less countries participating matters, then the popularity should attract more international participation/funding anyway.

 

I got Foley's point but thought it was very weak relative to the benefits of more weights. If we think we have a great product, which given the "new" rules in freestyle, I think we do, then we should want to showcase it as much as possible at each major event, not less.

Multiple countries with placers was one of the key points in the platform of the Saving Olympic Wrestling movement.  Many countries can compete for medals in the combat sports, very few can compete in any sport -- the costs are too much of a barrier for entry.

 

If you watch the opening ceremonies, you will see a ton of wrestlers and judokas holding their country's flag.

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Multiple countries with placers was one of the key points in the platform of the Saving Olympic Wrestling movement.  Many countries can compete for medals in the combat sports, very few can compete in any sport -- the costs are too much of a barrier for entry.

 

If you watch the opening ceremonies, you will see a ton of wrestlers and judokas holding their country's flag.

 

I don't see how more weights makes such a difference to that. As you noted yourself, you could still give the double-bronze with more weights.

 

Even if you assume the extreme edge case in Foley's implied thought is right 100% of the time--that each fourth placer per weight always comes from a different country--and you eliminate those "new placers" in favor of more weights in which NO country that would've placed in the 4-place system places at the new weight... wrestling STILL offers multiple countries with placers as a benefit over the majority of other sports.

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"I am not sure what I spun. You put words into Gables mouth. He never said what you said he said and I reminded you what he said. That is assuming you are referencing what I think you are."

 

The earlier thread I'm about to reference was about recruiting Mark Hall. This thread is about recruiting Spencer Lee. Hawk fans are very active in both conversations. Their constant theme is to build up Brands and staff and to underplay Ryan and staff. I think often unjustly. I believe you are doing the same thing in effect.

====================================================================================================

 

Hawktalk3 wrote, on this message board, on April 23, 2015: 

"Dan Gable literally said this the other day on Jason Bryant's podcast. He said something to the effect that Ohio State wouldn't have won without Logan - and not in the obvious way like they needed his points, but his presence had a tremendous effect on those freshmen performances."

Hawktalk quoted the following post of yours when he wrote that:

"Lets see how they handle having an integral piece of the puzzle like Logan Stieber not on the team. They obviously have tons of talent and are going to be right there but guys like Stieber, Taylor and Metcalf are worth more than just the points they score. While having these guys around as coaches and or club guys is still nice, when they are actually part of the team the leadership they provide is priceless."

 

Your spin was telling me that I was putting words in Dan Gable's mouth. Mr. RB didn't put quotes around what followed his "Gable literally said" paraphrasing (said something to the effect that..) and neither did I with what followed "Gable said", which was a straight line logical conclusion from what Gable was purported to have said.

 

My paraphrasing of Gable looks more faithful to what Gable is purported to have said, than your paraphrasing which sure looks more faithful to your words in the post, that hawktalk3 quoted. 

 

While your words were "priceless and leadership" and "actually being part of the team", Gable's words were (allegedly)"presence" and "tremendous effect on those freshman performances". Tremendous effect? Hawk fans may wish that were true, but I disagree with it almost completely. As I said above I think those three would have placed as they did with or without Logan.

 

In the history of Big Ten wrestling it may have been unprecedented to have three freshman captains. The team did that by vote. Finally,  Kyle Snyder didn't need Logan to beat Jake Varner for the top USA senior spot; I don't think he needed him to finish as a NCAA runner up a few months earlier.

 

 

 

 

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Figures as soon as I post that, I venture over to both Penn State's and Iowa's boards and after reading through 20+ page threads there I saw it... Many mentions of Lee possibly to OSU.

 

What I found interesting is that it was more Penn State posters who alluded to the possibility and Iowa's seemingly not wanting to acknowledge it. After reading further it made sense why... A well known poster/insider on the Iowa board gave the old 'big news coming' cryptic post with Suriano connotations (to where he later admits it was him) and the board is taking the Suriano verbal to Penn State hard, really thought they had Suriano. When this happens the next natural thing to happen is talk about whose next and how much you only need that kid and how the one you lost you didn't expect nor really need either (lot of that).

 

Iowa is literally all in on Spencer and post on there like if you didn't know better.. Lee lived in Iowa City and it makes no other sense for he to head anywhere but Iowa... They are gonna be sick if he selects anywhere else.

 

Besides the entertainment I'll have reading their boards about Lee, a few posters did mention the possibility of Lee to OSU and both heavily mentioned their belief with Hall to OSU. One poster said it just turn the lights off, party is over if Hall selects OSU in October, and Lee follows him to Columbus. (Didn't think bout his history with Pletcher either til I saw it mentioned) can you imagine that Bucks lineup what would be Lee's freshman year with Tomasello, Hayes, Micah and Bo Jordan, Mark Hall, Myles Martin, Kollin Moore, Luke Pletcher, Thomas Haines etc..... What an all time loaded lineup that would be!!

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