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John Smith's take on the rules of the "leg pass"

John Smith Okie St Cowboys Dellgado funk askren abass marky mark folkstyle rules

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#1 GranbyTroll

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 03:59 AM

John Smith has a video up rbehind the FloWrestling paywall. He brings up a good point on how officials inconsistently call takedowns in scramble or funk situations (specifically the leg pass), and proposes a few solutions.

 

Smith points out that right now no two refs call leg pass situations exactly the same, and that someone from the NCAA should objectively define what the criteria for a takedown vs stalemate are in this situation. One ref will award the attacking wrestler with a takedown and back points, while another will gift the leg passer a stalemate in the exact same position. This is a problem. Currently, folkstyle has clear definitions for takedowns in several situations ("wrong leg in," locked hands in a cradle, one hands touches the mat- are all specific criteria) that take the subjectivity out of reffing. The leg pass situation has no clear definition as the rules have lagged behind the technique of the last decade. 

To Smith, it boils down to two simple criteria: 1) Land on your inside him with both of your knees on the same side, and 2) Stop the leg passer from rolling the other direction and hold him in nearfall criteria. 

 

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Here's an example: Delgado attempts to leg pass Nashon Garrett. Garret goes with the roll, but lands on his inside hip with both of his knees together and holds Delgado on his back with a crossface. As soon as Garrett holds Delgado in a position that he can't leg pass out of, Garrett is in control and should be rewarded (he was the attacking wrestler after all). 

Regardless if the NCAA adopts Smith's criteria, he feels that they need to do something. Right now, the subjective discretion that refs have in this situation is a major problem with folkstyle wrestling. The interpretation of this position changes on a ref-by-ref basis and does not reward the wrestler who takes a risk and attacks. He sums up his feelings on this position nicely by urging refs to "put points on the board!"


Edited by GranbyTroll, 25 September 2015 - 05:36 AM.

Iowa fans are still arrogant; it's just that their team isn't as good.


#2 LJB

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 04:42 AM

not that this makes anything above any less relevant, but, you keep saying "right now"... this video is several years old 



#3 GranbyTroll

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 05:35 AM

not that this makes anything above any less relevant, but, you keep saying "right now"... this video is several years old 

I'll remove the initial "right now" in reference to the age of the video, but the others reflect that the problem is current in NCAA wrestling. 


Iowa fans are still arrogant; it's just that their team isn't as good.


#4 BobDole

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 05:38 AM

<Insert snide remark that only freestyle rules are confusing.>



#5 wrestlingnerd

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 08:03 AM

John Smith is a true master. His advice on defending the leg pass is pure gold and must-view for every folkstyle coach in the country.

 

I completely agree with his view of when to award control. If the passer is stuck, back exposed, and unable to move because the original attacker caught him mid-pass, that should be two and backs. This is different than a traditional leg pass stalemate where both guys are in 50/50 positions and unable to move without risking control.


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#6 crablegs

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 10:53 PM

Askren's video is the best on the leg pass. It has multiple counters and counters to the counters.

That said, I agree the rule is not called consistently. IMO it should be a takedown if the wrestler is stuck and cannot pass the leg right away or get back to their base.





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: John Smith, Okie St, Cowboys, Dellgado, funk, askren, abass, marky mark, folkstyle, rules

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