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wrestlingnerd

DT will not be undersized at 86 kg

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I just listened to the great Flo interview of DT and his decision to move up: http://www.flowrestling.org/coverage/252297-adidas-Interviews/video/794915-David-Taylor-Makes-It-Official#.Vgst_flViko

 

A few key take-aways:

 

1. DT weighs 200 lbs now, and he's only been on his new diet and lifting program for something like 3-4 months.

2. He weighed 190 lbs during the summer right after the US Open while wrestling 74 kg.

3. He never lifted while wrestling 74 kg for fear he would gain weight.

 

This board has always thought DT was just a naturally lean guy who never struggled with weight. There was even talk of him cutting to 70 kg for a couple of years. Obviously, now that the truth is out, that was never going to happen in a million years.

 

The reality is DT is tall even for 86 kg (he has an inch or two on Ruth, who is about average to slightly above average for the weight) and was cutting a huge amount of weight. He was among the biggest 74 kg guys.

 

I think he easily puts on another 10 lbs by next summer and will be a solid-sized 86 kg'er. I really don't think size will be his issue, but rather, strength. Going from not lifting at all for several years to trying to get strong enough in less than a year is very difficult. Strength takes more time than size.

 

Anyway, DT will be awesome up a weight. He has the style to be a real threat at the weight because to beat him, you need to be able to do one of two things: control the tie-ups and shut him down, and/or finish your shots very quickly because his defense is so good. I don't see any American other than maybe "good" Ed Ruth (not the checked out version we saw this summer) having either of these traits, let alone both. I would pick DT against any of our 86 kg guys right now except good Ruth.

Edited by wrestlingnerd

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I hope so! I think he will immediately become a medal threat once he puts on the size.  He's definitely the favorite to represent the team in 2017 and beyond, but I'm not as sure as you are that he will have the horsepower to go with Herbert..Ruth sure didn't.  Either way, it will be fun to find out in a couple of months.  Remember, Cael wrestled 2kg lighter than this weight in 2004 and 2011...Cael.  

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Cael cut 5-7 lbs in  college. That's not even a cut. DT cut nearly 30 lbs to make it down to 74kg. I'm not saying DT is going to be big for 86 kg, but everyone had DT needing to pack on 20-30 lbs of muscle to be competitive. He is 11 lbs OVER right now and just started to lift and eat halfway decently for the first time in years.

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As someone else said, getting strong at that weight will be the bigger deal than getting big.  Functional strength takes a little more time...building bone density and getting all those neurons firing for muscle memory to the deepest muscle fibers (otherwise known as "man strength"--like when you wrestled a 28-year-old that physically controlled you even though he didn't seem any bigger than you and couldn't lift more than you when you were 17).  

 

But yeah, it's more and more clear he's going to have zero problems being a full-on 86 for the long term.  I've always heard researchers say that our age of greatest muscle capacity isn't until 35.  We've lost some speed, flexibility, and reflexes by then; but in terms of shear strength, we can build muscle far beyond DT's age.  There are zero lean professional athletes (meaning DT's perceived "thin" body structure) whose finely tuned bodies at 32 look anything like their bodies at 22.  Everyone of his build gets much bigger.  He'll be absolutely fine.

Edited by maligned

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I hope so! I think he will immediately become a medal threat once he puts on the size.  He's definitely the favorite to represent the team in 2017 and beyond, but I'm not as sure as you are that he will have the horsepower to go with Herbert..Ruth sure didn't.  Either way, it will be fun to find out in a couple of months.  Remember, Cael wrestled 2kg lighter than this weight in 2004 and 2011...Cael.  

 

you're silly.

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David Taylor is the most hyped wrestler since Brent Metcalf.  They both carried DI wrestling, even when they lost.  Being a big Metcalf fan, it hurts me to draw this parallel, but I think many can't believe such dominant and entertaining Folkstyle wrestlers won't find a way to medal.  I am very guilty of it.  As long as they stay 100% driven I will definitely continue my belief that they will get a World Level medal before they are done!

Edited by MSU158

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headshuck,

 

There were some INTENTIONAL parallels.  Although, I stated I BELIEVE Metcalf will win a medal.  Much of what Cletus types is accurate.  The problem is MOST of what he types he doesn't actually believe and he uses it to egg the Iowa faithful on.

 

I am not a big David Taylor fan.  Not his fault, but the Jenkins/Sanderson fiasco soured me from him and Sanderson.  Still, I respected his talent and willpower.  Since their careers were pretty similar, I think the comparisons hold and would truly like, and actually do expect, them both to win a medal before they are done.

Edited by MSU158

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headshuck,

 

There were some INTENTIONAL parallels.  Although, I stated I BELIEVE Metcalf will win a medal.  Much of what Cletus types is accurate.  The problem is MOST of what he types he doesn't actually believe and he uses it to egg the Iowa faithful on.

 

I am not a big David Taylor fan.  Not his fault, but the Jenkins/Sanderson fiasco soured me from him and Sanderson.  Still, I respected his talent and willpower.  Since their careers were pretty similar, I think the comparisons hold and would truly like, and actually do expect, them both to win a medal before they are done.

I also think Taylor will win a world medal before he is done.  Probably not this year (although it's poassible), but I think he grows into the weight by the next cycle.  Metcalf is another story...It's very possible he's not on the team this year with James Green moving down.  I'm not sure he has committed to going another cycle.

 

 

it doesn't really matter who DT can beat domestically. He will still need to figure out a way to handle Sadulaev, which isnt happening!

Nobody thinks he will beat Sadulaev...They give out 4 medals per weight though, and we are talking about winning one in his career.  He's already committed to wrestling through 2020.  

Edited by Billyhoyle

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Just wish I could find the post I made right when he got out of college saying he should go up immediately to have time to grow in before the Olympics, which I got roasted for on here haha.  Glad to see him making a healthy decision for his mind and his career.  David Taylor will flourish in freestyle when he can open his arsenal again, and I'm sure he has an amazing strength and conditioning team at NLWC.

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I don't see how DT goes up a weight and is a medal threat when he was barely a medal threat (if one at all) at 74kg. Even allowing that he grows perfectly and fully into the weight class isn't this all a bit overoptimistic?

 

 

It assumes he isn't wrestling his best at 74 kg, and he will be at 86 kg.   The logic also probably follows a line of thinking that medaling at 86 kg is probably not as difficult as it is at 74 kg.   I don't know i believe that latter.  

 

I've seen Taylor destroyed by the truly elite guys at 74 kg (Tsargush for example) and I'd expect the same t o happen when he runs into Sadulaev, but other than him,  I am excited fr the prospect of Taylor at 86 kg.   I don't know that he places, but he certainly has a legit shot at making the team.   At 74 kg he wasn't going to make the team.  

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Boy MSU, that sounded a tiny bit like Cletus...

 

Lol, stop it.  

 

I'll give credit, MSU is actually a pretty informed fan and reasonable when it doesn't have to do with Michigan wrestlers.   Freeze is another one 2ho suffers terribly from extreme homerism.   

 

The problem with MSU is his emotions are far too vested.   We basically went head to head on knowledge and ability to forecast result during worlds, with his predictions failing miserably, and mine essentially resembling the results sheet, following the tournament.   

 

Brent Metcalf is very easy to predict.   He's very basic in his approach and he hasn't changed a thing in years.   I didn't just get lucky when I called his exact win/loss performance and subsequent DNP, it was simple math.   

 

MSU brings some positives to the site, and we need more like him.   I think we just need to take his outlandish predictions with a grain of salt.   I can almost picture him in his man cave with about 5 or 6 monitors all around, wearing a singlet under his shorts and over his T shirt, and likely even donning his unsnapped head gear as he watches intently and posts in support of Flo's terrible coverage.   

 

Truth be told, I enjoy his posts, if for nothing else, for a few laughs now and then.   He seems like a nice enough guy, perhaps needs to get out a little more often, maybe a little dorky, but certainly someone I'd have a beer with at nationals or an AGON event.   Certainly better than some of the trash we have floating around in the cesspool this site has deteriorated to.   I'll send him a friend request here in a minute, he really is ok. 

 

Now about Taylor, that kid is going to light it up at 86 kg.  If we could just find a weight class for Dake, I truly believe we'd be fielding America's strongest line up with them in the mix.   

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Taylor is an exciting wrestler and who knows maybe he lights the world on fire or maybe he's never really a threat. But let's not act like he hasn't already successful jumped weight classes like this in his career....twice. Hs senior he went from 112-135 And took all comers. College he went from lanky 157 to nearly being an undefeated freshman. Who knows but the history is there.

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We "could" see a parallel with K. Snyder.  Here's at least a little case study. 

 

Snyder, True Frosh... "cuts" to 197 and gets pinned by Gadson in the NCAA finals (i.e. no worse than DT his RS Frosh year).  Snyder then "bumps up" to 97kg, and wins a World Championship.  

 

Could DT, because of his "cut", be in a similar position or situation?  I think it could be interesting, as DT's style will be very much different to much of the 86kg class (at least in the US).  he could become a man-beast and astonish us all, or just be another number in the 86kg revolving door.  

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