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SDSU vs. Oklahoma State

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From early season results Oklahoma State doesn't appear to be at the top of their game, but it is a long season and they could look totally different in March. 

 

I wonder if Okie State "trains through" these types of duals (Iowa, SDSU etc) rather than peaking each week. That might explain why they typically look flat (workout exhaustion) but peak towards the end of the year. I obviously have no clue if that is correct, but just one theory.

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I wonder if Okie State "trains through" these types of duals (Iowa, SDSU etc) rather than peaking each week. That might explain why they typically look flat (workout exhaustion) but peak towards the end of the year. I obviously have no clue if that is correct, but just one theory.

It would make sense.

 

This wasn't the case for the Iowa duel, but I would imagine for unranked teams they do that.

 

You can't peak that many times a year. It will lead to injury, burning out, etc.

 

The tournament, especially in wrestling, I what matters. Even the dual champion doesn't really matter.

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I think every team has their own strategy for peaking.  OSU has done well the last few Marches relative to expectation, but some of that could be due to their expectations being lower due to under performing in November.  Iowa likewise might not be underachieving as much as it looks in March, they might just be seeded to high from over achieving in November.

 

It's definitely an inexact science for every team and even for every individual.  Either way, it's easy for a fan to use "we trained through" as an excuse for looking bad.  But I'll trust John Smith knows what he's doing.

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SHP, Gimp, or any other rules expert....Still trying to figure out how the Hwt match is declared a "No Match", if the Flagrant Misconduct was after the match ended.. Mardsen wins then team pts deducted?  If the Flagrant was called with any time left in the match...a DQ?  How can it be scored a No Match?

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SHP, Gimp, or any other rules expert....Still trying to figure out how the Hwt match is declared a "No Match", if the Flagrant Misconduct was after the match ended.. Mardsen wins then team pts deducted? If the Flagrant was called with any time left in the match...a DQ? How can it be scored a No Match?

Great question. I thought it was a DQ prior to the match ending, which means y points to SDSU

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Roadkill, trying to find out myself. The Oklahoma State website lists it as "no match", whereas the South Dakota State website lists it as a DQ. Unless Macki did something to earn a flagrant misconduct penalty, it should have been a DQ win for him, and a team point deduction for Marsden, making the final score 20-15. (even if it was a double-flagrant misconduct, it should be 20-8, not 21-9)

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I didn't see the match but am having a hard time figuring out why it was declared a no match, unless for some reason there was a double flagrant call but I would think someone would have written about that.  Here is what the rules say regarding flagrant misconduct:

 

5.6 Flagrant Misconduct

 

5.6.1 Prematch, Match or Postmatch Period.

 

During the prematch, match or postmatch period, flagrant misconduct committed by either wrestler, such as intentionally striking an opponent, deliberately attempting to injure an opponent, or any act serious enough to disqualify a wrestler from an event, shall be penalized by the deduction of one team point, disqualification of that contestant, removal from the premises, declaration of the opponent as the winner and the award of six points to the opponent’s team. For tournaments, a team point shall be deducted from the offender’s team score, the opponent declared the winner and two team points awarded for advancement

 

Rule 5.6 Flagrant Misconduct

 

SITUATION 1:  The referee raises Wrestler A’s hand at the end of the match Wrestler A subsequently punches Wrestler B, and the referee calls flagrant misconduct.

 

QUESTION: What is the penalty and what effect does it have on the match?

 

RULING: Flagrant misconduct by the winner during the post-match period shall result in Wrestler A being disqualified, the deduction of one team point, the removal of the disqualified contestant from the premises and Wrestler B being declared the winner. A contestant so disqualified in a tournament is not entitled to placement points or an individual tournament award, nor will that contestant be credited with advancement and fall points earned before the incident. Further, the contestant shall be suspended from the team’s next date of competition.

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I think the ref and the table got the rule wrong.  If it was a Flagrant Misconduct post match then the ruling should be, DQ for OK ST, 6 points to SDSU, -1 pt for OK ST, and the match is recorded as an OK ST dq.  Think maybe these guys would have a rulebook handy or something.  Ive seen these sort of things happen in other duals and tournaments, they almost always get it wrong.  Each team needs to have a rulebook/wrestling nerd make sure they get this stuff right so that the coaches and wrestlers dont have to worry about that side of things other than not leaving the mat till they get it right.  Had teams done this it would have really changed things last year

Edited by barnbarn2000

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LkwdSteve, a double flagrant misconduct would mean a point deduction on both sides though.

I have no clue what the scoring was. No clue if points were deducted or not. the announcer said there was a flagrant. He never said anything about flagrants by both wrestlers. Did not see or hear a final score for that match or for the dual.

 

What I was responding to was this: "......why it was declared a no match, unless for some reason there was a double flagrant call". That statement sure seems to suggest that flagrants can somehow lead to a "no match".

 

The last three posts suggest that a "no match' cannot be a result of flagrants. and that the referee got it wrong.

 

The question now would seem to be if  the "no match" ruling is reversible.

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I think every team has their own strategy for peaking.  OSU has done well the last few Marches relative to expectation, but some of that could be due to their expectations being lower due to under performing in November.  Iowa likewise might not be underachieving as much as it looks in March, they might just be seeded to high from over achieving in November.

 

It's definitely an inexact science for every team and even for every individual.  Either way, it's easy for a fan to use "we trained through" as an excuse for looking bad.  But I'll trust John Smith knows what he's doing.

 

I'm hardly an OSU homer giving them an excuse, but like you mentioned they have done well in March relative to expectation, which leads to my theory of them training through duals. You're right though, I think JS has this covered :).

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I got asked this earlier.I'll paste what I said to drd.

The rules only talk about what to do during the match. Once it's over its unclear other than the team point and the ejection and he can't compete in next scheduled competition. During the match opponent is made the winner regardless of score, after only things mentioned are penalties for offender nothing mentioned about other guy to make him the winner, therefore no winner.

 

To clarify- once they leave the mat- the match is over. So if it happened then he does get 'dqed' and loses a team point and the next match. College specifies prematch, match, post match which basically means on the mat. HS kind of doesn't limit it- it says before during after.

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"During the match opponent is made the winner regardless of score, after only things mentioned are penalties for offender nothing mentioned about other guy to make him the winner, therefore no winner."

 

I'm not getting how the conclusion "therefore no winner" is being reached given the rest of the sentence. I do know that it appeared that at least one flagrant was called in the final couple of seconds. If both wrestlers were given flagrants in the final two seconds, what is the official ruling?

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I still haven't definitively heard that it happened before they walked off. If it was a double it could be ruled NC with penalties.

In a tournament if DDQ neither wrestler shall continue therefore NC. (3.22.4)

I had one in a tournament. Effectively I scored it a NC. It was a championship match which meant that there were two subsequent forfeits.

The NWCA didn't really know how to record it in the OPC.

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