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Wow, his perspective of Gilman isn't 100% wrong, but damn he took it to an extreme that simply isn't there.  Is what Gilman did unsportsmanlike?  Probably.  Was it egregious? Not at all.  When reading Foley, you also have to remember that he hates Football.  Football is America's sport.  Football encourages ALL of the items he dislikes.  It is a culture that will fall over into every sport no matter what. Every first down there is a celebration. Sacks. Turnovers.  Tackles for loss.  Break up a pass.  Etc. I don't see it taking over in such a family centered sport, but you will still see it.  

 

I will definitely take his dollars and hand him my donuts!  Gilman is undefeated and wrestling better than ever.  Saying he should just abandon his chip on the shoulder, roughneck mentality is all fine and altruistic.  But to say he would definitely do better if he did is laughable.  It is also laughable to say his angry bravado is somehow a substitute for technique.  I am sure he is working as hard on technique as anyone.  In fact, I think he has made a big step up from last year in that department.

 

Finally, questioning his quality as a brother, son and teammate based on his on the mat techniques is borderline slanderous.  How in the hell does he know if Gilman isn't the best man on the planet in all 3 categories?  Foley is a smart writer and has solid writing skills.  This article makes him come of like a pompous jack ass........................

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Perhaps the douchiest article ever written.  One time AA Tim Foley lecturing Thomas Gilman on how to win more wrestling matches.  Classic.  And "intimidation as his main wrestling skill" is just hilariously wrong and an attempt to bolster his "point".  BTW, "psychological warfare" is a pretty classic sports technique, ESPECIALLY in combat sports.  This article is pretty much the height of pretentiousness.

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How many AA's does Gilman have?

 

You don't have to be more successful to give good advice about something.

 

If you want to lecture someone on how to win, you should probably have won more than them.  Thomas Gilman is currently undefeated with a 4th place finish as a sophomore.  Tim Foley took 8th as a senior.  What has TR Foley ever shown that he can lecture Gilman about being a more successful wrestler?  He was an inferior wrestler and has no coaching credentials.  Whoops.

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I guess my point is lost.

 

So Tom Ryan had no good advice for Logan Stieber cause he wasn't as successful.

 

Gilman = 1 AA to date

Foley = 1 AA

 

Tom Ryan is a coach with a lot of success and credibility.  TR Foley writes for Intermat.  What does he have to show that he is qualified to give any advice on how to win more than Thomas Gilman other than douchey prose?

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The psychological warfare bit would mean something if he didn't do it when the match was already over.

I don't care if Gilman does it, but it doesn't help him any more than it helps his opponents get fired up to wrestle him.

 

Gilman's push the head down move is a douche move.

Although Foley's article chastising it over and again is a little much as well.

 

Let's not pretend all is great just because Gilman is undefeated.

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The psychological warfare bit would mean something if he didn't do it when the match was already over.

I don't care if Gilman does it, but it doesn't help him any more than it helps his opponents get fired up to wrestle him.

 

 

Regarding psychological warfare, I wasn't speaking about specifically this match, just like Tim Foley wasn't.  Here Gilman just got up and put his hands on the guys head.  It happens ALL the time.  This wasn't even fase mushing.  If you want face mushing, again, look at Metcalf-Schlatter at Big 10s.

 

Let's not pretend all is great just because Gilman is undefeated.

 

 

I'm not sure what you mean here by "pretend all is great".  Could you clarify?  I don't think anyone is pretending that Gilman is some kind of enormous favorite to win a title, if that's what you're getting at.

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Hate it all you want, but it IS psychological warfare when it happens at the end of a match.  The Brands were known for it as well.  They did(Gilman does as well) everything they could to make every single opponent they face NEVER want to go on the mat with them again.  Did it always work?  Absolutely not.  But, did many of their opponents look forward to wrestling them?  Absolutely not.  I am not condoning it.  It isn't a tactic I would preach.  But, what works for one may not work for others.  It really isn't a big deal to me and those making it such a big deal need to go play badminton or sit in an orchard and meditate.........................

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Interesting turn of events...

 

The Hawk fans were all aglow when Christian Pyles wrote that this thread was all about Iowa hatred.

But, then comes T.R. Foley writing in agreement with the OP's argument and they go all apoplectic.

 

Oh well...so much for those earlier posts about Hawk fans not caring what others think of them. 

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It's way beyond Gilman; I hate the never-ending Brands crap.  I have no affinity to PSU, although we never see their team do anything Iowa-like after 7:00.  Every Brands presser is a low-brow borderline psycho event characterized by a lack of class.  This is a college sport for chrissakes.  It's not war and these are kids. It's not even the UFC and you see better sportsmen in the octagon at bout end than Iowa is putting out.  

We see no teams nor coaches pulling this crap on a regular basis like you see from the Brands Bros. Can't remember once for Cael, Jackson, Robinson, Smith, Douglass, et. al. Compare that to every single match.  And wrt the Gilman / Clark / Stache / Metcalf comments over the years that you see on here - It's hard to even blame the student athletes - this is how they are coached.   Again, just my opinion.   No one in the corn state is going to like it but you can't refute the spectacles.

 

Hard to disagree with this of course the same coach that raped a girl in his home state with his brother by his side.

 

Oh well at least porn stash graduated - although it was fun watching the Mormon dominate him.

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Hard to disagree with this of course the same coach that raped a girl in his home state with his brother by his side.

 

Oh well at least porn stash graduated - although it was fun watching the Mormon dominate him.

 

Jesus.  Pretty slanderous coming from a fan of a school that has the recent history of yours...also factually inaccurate throughout the first line of your post...

Edited by VakAttack

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If you want to lecture someone on how to win, you should probably have won more than them.  Thomas Gilman is currently undefeated with a 4th place finish as a sophomore.  Tim Foley took 8th as a senior.  What has TR Foley ever shown that he can lecture Gilman about being a more successful wrestler?  He was an inferior wrestler and has no coaching credentials.  Whoops.

 

 

 

Foley has a lot more life experience than does Thomas Gilman. Andrew Long was also more accomplished at NCAA wrestling than Foley, but I think Foley could have given him some good advice about how to handle himself as a man not too many years ago. 

 

Being good and doing good are two separate things, the wisdom of that perhaps not shining just yet on young Mr. Gilman. 

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Foley has a lot more life experience than does Thomas Gilman. Andrew Long was also more accomplished at NCAA wrestling than Foley, but I think Foley could have given him some good advice about how to handle himself as a man not too many years ago. 

 

Being good and doing good are two separate things, the wisdom of that perhaps not shining just yet on young Mr. Gilman. 

 

Awesome.  So now we're talking about life advice and comparing Thomas Gilman to a guy who was charge with rape.  Jesus...

 

So now Foley is qualified to tell Thomas Gilman how to be a better person in a non-sporting context even though I doubt he's ever met Gilman on a personal level.

Edited by VakAttack

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Vak - You got to let it go man.  

  • What Gilman did was bush and it's too frequent to let it pass like you would with other sophomores.
  • He learns to be a D**k and an A**hole from his coach - verbatim straight from his coach's mouth.  

I don't think F. Lee Bailey could argue those 2 points to a draw.  

 

Peace & Love - It's Friday and everyone has a chance to redeem themselves.  

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Vak - You got to let it go man.  

  • What Gilman did was bush and it's too frequent to let it pass like you would with other sophomores.
  • He learns to be a D**k and an A**hole from his coach - verbatim straight from his coach's mouth.  

I don't think F. Lee Bailey could argue those 2 points to a draw.  

 

Peace & Love - It's Friday and everyone has a chance to redeem themselves.  

 

Let it go?  You started the thread man.  Man, the delusional struggle is real.

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Awesome.  So now we're talking about life advice and comparing Thomas Gilman to a guy who was charge with rape.  Jesus...

 

So now Foley is qualified to tell Thomas Gilman how to be a better person in a non-sporting context even though I doubt he's ever met Gilman on a personal level.

 

 

Sure, Foley can give advice to Gilman in the same way that anyone with more life experience can give advice to someone younger and less experienced who is acting out in an immature way. 

 

Do you think JRob can give advice to young wrestlers? If you do then you agree with me, and if you don't then what is all that "I want to be somebody" all about if not trying to show them a better way? 

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Sure, Foley can give advice to Gilman in the same way that anyone with more life experience can give advice to someone younger and less experienced who is acting out in an immature way. 

 

Do you think JRob can give advice to young wrestlers? If you do then you agree with me, and if you don't then what is all that "I want to be somebody" all about if not trying to show them a better way? 

 

There is so much wrong with this... I mean Justin Beiber is older than Gilman he should give Gilman advice...

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Sure, Foley can give advice to Gilman in the same way that anyone with more life experience can give advice to someone younger and less experienced who is acting out in an immature way. 

 

Do you think JRob can give advice to young wrestlers? If you do then you agree with me, and if you don't then what is all that "I want to be somebody" all about if not trying to show them a better way? 

 

Anyone can give anyone adivce, that doesn't make them qualified.  For instance, if you want to give someone advice on how to be a BETTER PERSON, you should probably know them as a person and not presume that you are somehow capable of making them a better brother, son, etc.  Example:  I think you're an insane homer who says inane things on an internet message board.  Does this make me qualified to give you advice on your personal life?  No.

Edited by VakAttack

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