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Jason_L._Jackson

Jake Ryan got screwed

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@fishhook

 

Go start a thread about how you've got a problem with how stalling is called then.  Go start a thread about how folkstyle rules should change to make the transition to freestyle easier.

 

Stop your pissing and moaning about how it was applied in this match.  You make this match sound like Churella-Hendricks or Miller-Realbuto, but it was just another run of the mill match where stalling calls were made.  After 2 periods of collar-ties and backing up, Ryan has no one to blame but himself.

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the stalling calls were ,imo, correctly called he was asking to be called and a ref SHOULD have the balls to make those calls or stay home.

JoJo may have had a bit of a nerve issue. Ryan's gassing may have had something to do with nerves as well. Certainly possible.

GREAT tourney so far.

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@fishhook

 

Go start a thread about how you've got a problem with how stalling is called then.  Go start a thread about how folkstyle rules should change to make the transition to freestyle easier.

 

Stop your pissing and moaning about how it was applied in this match.  You make this match sound like Churella-Hendricks or Miller-Realbuto, but it was just another run of the mill match where stalling calls were made.  After 2 periods of collar-ties and backing up, Ryan has no one to blame but himself.

  @Fishook??  I am not nor will I ever be a tweeter.  So, you don't like me complaining about how the rules were applied to this match, but prefer I talk about a match from years past?  The implementation of the rules does indeed upset me.    I am not playing the blame game as you would want me to do.  I just think that match was ugly.  Ryan has been doing that all year. Smith is much further away than I thought from being any threat in freestyle and such.  He looked REALLY bad.  But Ryan looked worse in the third. 

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  Ryan wasn't going anywhere in this tournament. Everyone knew that.  I am shocked at how poorly Smith wrestled.  Really bad.  If Smith gave Nolf a good match last time....based on this match I am shocked.  Smith looked like a high school junior.  Thank god for that ref. 

You seem more worried about Smith than Ryan.  Smith wrestled like a freshman  Ryan coasted for two periods.

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@fishhook

 

Go start a thread about how you've got a problem with how stalling is called then.  Go start a thread about how folkstyle rules should change to make the transition to freestyle easier.

 

Stop your pissing and moaning about how it was applied in this match.  You make this match sound like Churella-Hendricks or Miller-Realbuto, but it was just another run of the mill match where stalling calls were made.  After 2 periods of collar-ties and backing up, Ryan has no one to blame but himself.

I've drank two coffees, so I can't stop pissing.  The pisses feel so good,after waiting too long as to not miss any matches , that I can't help but moan too.   

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You seem more worried about Smith than Ryan.  Smith wrestled like a freshman  Ryan coasted for two periods.

First time I have seen him wrestle. His dad is John Smith. His uncles are Pat Smith and Leroy Smith. His cousins are the Perrys.  And there has been some hype on JoJo this year.  Nolf had a close match with Smith as I recall. So I was shocked to see him so out of position the whole match. Even in the second and third period, as he dictated the action, his motion and his positioning wasn't very impressive.  I have watched Ryan all year and know how much work he needs before he AAs.   But Smith comes in as a guy that I thought might make noise here and possibly overseas. He still could, but I am flabbergasted as to how bad he looked.  

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I'm a tOSU guy and I'm not going to sit here and make excuses. Stalling is called when someone is not making an attempt to score. JoJo may not have looked his best as far as his motion goes, but he was still making the effort to score. Even if it was just a half shot to make an impression on the official he was still doing what he needed to do. Ryan kept his butt to the edge and backed up ALOT. The majority of his scores came from offensive attacks from JoJo and like someone previously posted I can appreciate a really solid defense or tactical stalling, but he was being deliberate in his stalling.The right call was made and the better wrestler won. Props to Ryan for keeping it close and even bigger props to JoJo for pulling out the win.

Edited by broyles_152

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First time I have seen him wrestle. His dad is John Smith. His uncles are Pat Smith and Leroy Smith. His cousins are the Perrys.  And there has been some hype on JoJo this year.  Nolf had a close match with Smith as I recall. So I was shocked to see him so out of position the whole match. Even in the second and third period, as he dictated the action, his motion and his positioning wasn't very impressive.  I have watched Ryan all year and know how much work he needs before he AAs.   But Smith comes in as a guy that I thought might make noise here and possibly overseas. He still could, but I am flabbergasted as to how bad he looked.  

It maybe that it was his first match of the tournament. I was no D1 NCAA level wrestler, but back in the day my first match of the day was almost always my worst.

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I'm a tOSU guy and I'm not going to sit here and make excuses. Stalling is called when someone is not making an attempt to score. JoJo may not have looked his best as far as his motion goes, but he was still making the effort to score. Even if it was just a half shot to make an impression on the official he was still doing what he needed to do. Ryan kept his butt to the edge and backed up ALOT. The majority of his scores came from offensive attacks from JoJo and like someone previously posted I can appreciate a really solid defense or tactical stalling, but he was being deliberate in his stalling.The right call was made and the better wrestler won. Props to Ryan for keeping it close and even bigger props to JoJo for pulling out the win.

I agree with most of this.  BUT and this is a pretty big BUT, earlier in the round Thomasello was all over a dude from ISU like a dog on a bone for 3 minutes, a stall call may have finally been called at the 2:00 mark or later.  I Myself wasn't calling for stalling, even though it was obvious.  My whole thing is to score or wear on a guy until you do. But I hate using the stall call for the score.  So those two were tied in the first period and almost no stalling is called.  Then you flip to the Ryan match and it gets called 3 times in the third period. So it would appear that stalling calls are becoming more and more situational things that benefit the wrestler who is wrestling from behind on the score board.  Either that or the ref was calling it in favor of Oklahoma St, not so much in the Ryan match, but those calls weren't going to the Ohio State wrestlers as much during the earlier portion of the round ( I don't really think that, but the ref is a human and ha likes and dislikes). So they called it different in that match.  Tom Ryan was freaking out on one level because of that. Then you throw in it is his son. Then you throw in the fact that Tom Ryan was a wrestler who nearly beat Pat Smith for the NCAA title, or at least fell short to him and you have added history. Throw in the fact that this is two head coaches son's going at it and you can see why this match will be looked at for some time, even if Ryan isn't a show stopping wrestler and Smith shows signs of greenness.    Ryan did deserve some stall calls, but they need to call it consistent from match to match, from the first period to the third, with the wrestler leading or losing getting the same attention.  This is impossible, you see....which is why another way needs to be done. A shot clock? How many times a guy shoots?  Actual steps taken backwards added on some clicker?  Of course not.  Not for Tom Ryan nor Jake, nor me, but just our wrestlers in general...we need to look at how stalling is called.   

Edited by Fishhook

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Fishhook, you keep making applications between this match and Freestyle.  There are no applications between this match and Freestyle.  It doesn't matter what these wrestlers looked like in a Freestyle context.  

 

You also keep combining the argument that stalling is wrong and hurts American Freestyle with the argument that Ryan deserved to win because stalling should not be worth points.  And yet in Freestyle Ryan would have given up about a dozen pushout points and been put on the shot clock at least once.  But again, this wasn't Freestyle, so trying to make an argument of who deserved to win based on Freestyle would be dumb of me.  

 

I don't disagree with anyone saying it was a bad call.  It's a completely judgement call that can and does go either way.  I can't celebrate it too loudly here because I'm sure it will go against OSU some other time.  But nobody got hosed or screwed here, and the match does not indicate some deeper truth about Freestyle vs Folkstyle wrestling.  It only indicates the results today under current Folkstyle rules with that particular ref and those particular athletes. 

 

Good luck to both guys tomorrow.  

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Guest Kingsland

Fishhook, you keep making applications between this match and Freestyle. There are no applications between this match and Freestyle. It doesn't matter what these wrestlers looked like in a Freestyle context.

 

You also keep combining the argument that stalling is wrong and hurts American Freestyle with the argument that Ryan deserved to win because stalling should not be worth points. And yet in Freestyle Ryan would have given up about a dozen pushout points and been put on the shot clock at least once. But again, this wasn't Freestyle, so trying to make an argument of who deserved to win based on Freestyle would be dumb of me.

 

I don't disagree with anyone saying it was a bad call. It's a completely judgement call that can and does go either way. I can't celebrate it too loudly here because I'm sure it will go against OSU some other time. But nobody got hosed or screwed here, and the match does not indicate some deeper truth about Freestyle vs Folkstyle wrestling. It only indicates the results today under current Folkstyle rules with that particular ref and those particular athletes.

 

Good luck to both guys tomorrow.

Ryan lost in the consis he's not wrestling tomorrow.

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I prefer a wrestler to actually execute points rather than rely on the ref. 

Collar ties and wrestling from your ass are not what I would consider "executing points". Ryan shut down after the first period, and he paid the price for it. 

 

Just my view from the cheap seats

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this match reminds me of Hawkeye matches at carver, except there is no crowd influence on the refs to call stalling.

 

Except that JoJo actually has set-ups and legitimate attacks.  He's not some inbred moron headbutting, shoving, and aimlessly hand-fighting.

Edited by ohcomeon

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