Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
fanta

If you could win a state title, which state would it be??

Recommended Posts

PA has a very low rate of participation -- Illinois and PA have a similar population, PA is far bigger than NJ.

 

Oh, whats the participation rate in Colorado??  And don't tell me......You wish you could go back and win state in Colorado 1A, 2A, 3A, 4A, and 5A, all in the same year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While the NFHS participation data is the best we have to go by, it isn't always the most accurate. Just as an example, California's participation results are posted online and in 2015 they had one team with 288 members and 5 others with over 100. This year's data seems more typical with one team over 100.

 

http://cifstate.org/coaches-admin/census/index

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While the NFHS participation data is the best we have to go by, it isn't always the most accurate. Just as an example, California's participation results are posted online and in 2015 they had one team with 288 members and 5 others with over 100. This year's data seems more typical with one team over 100.

 

http://cifstate.org/coaches-admin/census/index

 

And a friend noticed several years ago that Pa's numbers always worked out to an exact integer per team and the same every year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While you were stating the obvious- that PA AAA may be the toughest state to win in,, a participant may believe that winning in a different state tournament would be more desirable.

 

For example, had I transferred as a senior from X state ( which I had not yet won a state championship) to Y state( which was a tougher championship to win) and won in that new state anyway, I would still feel some remorse for not winning in the state that I grew up in and knew my peers.

 

 

Also, just because California doesn't have the university AA's that PA does year in and year out, doesn't mean anything. California is a long way from everybody ( and ASU/Stanford are the only two D-1 schools near there with wrestling), and therefore limited exposure and schollies for D-1 recruitment. Their numbers will perk up with Fresno in the mix. Same with Texas- but that may take longer.

 

That's my logic.

 

 

 

what exactly do you beg to differ with?

 

# participants don't me jack. Texas has more than PA. is Texas better?

 

and attendance....what does that mean?

 

like 7 people are in the stands at JR Worlds. would you rather win a State title in Minnesota?

 

 

i don't follow the logic. 

Edited by BadgerMon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What state would I want to win the most? California, because that's where I've lived most my life. 

 

What is the toughest to win? Pennsylvania. If you created dual meet teams of the state champions of each state and entered those teams in a dual tournament, I believe Pennsylvania wins that tournament more years than any other state. That's how I'd gauge the toughest state to win. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's a corollary question:

 

Would you rather have a victory over someone who beat the daylights out of you in your hometown, or a win over a big name?

 

For me, vengeance was a bit more satisfying.

while revenge is definitely sweet and satisfying, if we're playing the hypothetical game with 20/20 hindsight, I might go with the big name. As a freshman 189lber, I was thankful at the time that my coach elected to put our starter out during the team state quarterfinals instead of bumping him up to 215 and throwing me in to wrestle this senior monster by the name of Roger Kish.

 

I was mediocre at best during my career and a career backup getting the occasional spot start, so even though there was no way I would have won, it would have been cool to have attempted to last 10 seconds on the mat with a future NCAA runner up. Lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PIAA AAA

 

Every single year, Pennsylvania produces the most NCAA D1 signees, NCAA championship qualifiers, and All-Americans.  Ergo, it's the toughest state by a mile. 

 

That said, California and New Jersey still get mad props for having a single class.  You win one of those, you're pedigreed tough. 

Edited by Frank_Rizzo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While you were stating the obvious- that PA AAA may be the toughest state to win in,, a participant may believe that winning in a different state tournament would be more desirable.

 

For example, had I transferred as a senior from X state ( which I had not yet won a state championship) to Y state( which was a tougher championship to win) and won in that new state anyway, I would still feel some remorse for not winning in the state that I grew up in and knew my peers.

 

 

Also, just because California doesn't have the university AA's that PA does year in and year out, doesn't mean anything. California is a long way from everybody ( and ASU/Stanford are the only two D-1 schools near there with wrestling), and therefore limited exposure and schollies for D-1 recruitment. Their numbers will perk up with Fresno in the mix. Same with Texas- but that may take longer.

 

That's my logic.

Don't forget Cal Poly & CSUB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

while revenge is definitely sweet and satisfying, if we're playing the hypothetical game with 20/20 hindsight, I might go with the big name. As a freshman 189lber, I was thankful at the time that my coach elected to put our starter out during the team state quarterfinals instead of bumping him up to 215 and throwing me in to wrestle this senior monster by the name of Roger Kish.

 

I was mediocre at best during my career and a career backup getting the occasional spot start, so even though there was no way I would have won, it would have been cool to have attempted to last 10 seconds on the mat with a future NCAA runner up. Lol

 

I was in a similar bucket tec87.  I'm an Ohio guy, wrestled D1, and at the time, in my bracket, was Joe Heskett (and yes... Joey was an absolute MONSTER, pinning his way to all of his Titles).  I was an average wrestler at best, and didn't physically "blossom" until my senior year, and even then, was held back because of a severe football injury to the old 'noggin'.  Having the ability to wrestle the "best", on the biggest stage, and in the best wrestling state is both an honor and a privilege, and why I continue be such a huge fan and supporter of our Youth, HS, Collegiate and Team USA wrestling. 

 

I too would prefer is Ohio would go to a single "division" individual tournament.  At one point, Logan Stieber (4x'er) and David Taylor (4x'er) would have needed to wrestle each other for the "single" championship.  Talk about prestige!  Yeah, they wrestled at Iron Man, but... one of those guys would NOT have been a 4x'er, guaranteed.  I think it would be better for the sport in the state of Ohio, and would subsequently force those who "make States" to be "that" much better.  If they become "that" much better, then NCAA wrestling talent increases, and in turn, increases our talent at the post-collegiate level.  It's all a cycle, and how we all determine to design this locomotive. 

 

I know we have the HS National Championships, Super 32, FloNats, etc., but wouldn't it be cool to have a single, "mandatory" tournament, paid for through donations/sponsorships/etc., where ALL 50 State Champions at each weight class come together to truly find "Who is #1"?  The vision of that future would assist in taking our sport, in this great nation, to heights never before seen. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was in a similar bucket tec87.  I'm an Ohio guy, wrestled D1, and at the time, in my bracket, was Joe Heskett (and yes... Joey was an absolute MONSTER, pinning his way to all of his Titles).  I was an average wrestler at best, and didn't physically "blossom" until my senior year, and even then, was held back because of a severe football injury to the old 'noggin'.  Having the ability to wrestle the "best", on the biggest stage, and in the best wrestling state is both an honor and a privilege, and why I continue be such a huge fan and supporter of our Youth, HS, Collegiate and Team USA wrestling. 

 

I too would prefer is Ohio would go to a single "division" individual tournament.  At one point, Logan Stieber (4x'er) and David Taylor (4x'er) would have needed to wrestle each other for the "single" championship.  Talk about prestige!  Yeah, they wrestled at Iron Man, but... one of those guys would NOT have been a 4x'er, guaranteed.  I think it would be better for the sport in the state of Ohio, and would subsequently force those who "make States" to be "that" much better.  If they become "that" much better, then NCAA wrestling talent increases, and in turn, increases our talent at the post-collegiate level.  It's all a cycle, and how we all determine to design this locomotive. 

 

I know we have the HS National Championships, Super 32, FloNats, etc., but wouldn't it be cool to have a single, "mandatory" tournament, paid for through donations/sponsorships/etc., where ALL 50 State Champions at each weight class come together to truly find "Who is #1"?  The vision of that future would assist in taking our sport, in this great nation, to heights never before seen. 

Right. http://www.the-review.com/sports%20local/2014/01/17/clovis-california-coming-to-28th-top-gun

 

I remember when a California team went into the middle of Ohio and won one of their premier tournaments.  Most of the excuses on the Yappi Sports forum were....

 

"Well, did you know California is a single division".......and "California's top 8 are as good as any nationally ranked kid".....and so on and so forth.

 

But yes, I think a single division in Ohio and PA would raise our level a couple notches!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The worse thing that ever happened to New York Wrestling was the D1 and D2 split.

 

They were very clearly given MANY options to create a process and situation where MORE wrestlers could have been involved in the state tournament... but the powers at be literally pushed for 2 divisions so their schools would get a state champion, which they never had with one division.  

 

It had NOTHING to do with having more kids involved.  It had everything to do with getting some of their kids to the "top" (even though we know it is not).

 

The did finally get a few D2 champs, but it has completely watered down the event.  Just terrible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PIAA AAA

 

Every single year, Pennsylvania produces the most NCAA D1 signees, NCAA championship qualifiers, and All-Americans.  Ergo, it's the toughest state by a mile. 

 

That said, California and New Jersey still get mad props for having a single class.  You win one of those, you're pedigreed tough. 

Is there any correlation between what you said and the fact that the state of PA currently has 11 Division 1 programs available to offer in state tuition to PA high school kids?  

 

I have to imagine that if there were 11 D1 programs in OH, IL, CA, NJ, etc...that they would have a lot more D1 signees, qualifiers, and AA's.

 

More opportunities = more success

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there any correlation between what you said and the fact that the state of PA currently has 11 Division 1 programs available to offer in state tuition to PA high school kids?  

 

I have to imagine that if there were 11 D1 programs in OH, IL, CA, NJ, etc...that they would have a lot more D1 signees, qualifiers, and AA's.

 

More opportunities = more success

No question about it.  If CA had 11 D1 programs, they'd have a ton of AA's.  NJ has three D1 programs, and one of them (Princeton) is among the toughest schools in the country to gain admissions.

No offense to Penn or Cornell, but those schools make significant exceptions for kids to get into their athletic programs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was in a similar bucket tec87.  I'm an Ohio guy, wrestled D1, and at the time, in my bracket, was Joe Heskett (and yes... Joey was an absolute MONSTER, pinning his way to all of his Titles).  I was an average wrestler at best, and didn't physically "blossom" until my senior year, and even then, was held back because of a severe football injury to the old 'noggin'.  Having the ability to wrestle the "best", on the biggest stage, and in the best wrestling state is both an honor and a privilege, and why I continue be such a huge fan and supporter of our Youth, HS, Collegiate and Team USA wrestling. 

 

I too would prefer is Ohio would go to a single "division" individual tournament.  At one point, Logan Stieber (4x'er) and David Taylor (4x'er) would have needed to wrestle each other for the "single" championship.  Talk about prestige!  Yeah, they wrestled at Iron Man, but... one of those guys would NOT have been a 4x'er, guaranteed.  I think it would be better for the sport in the state of Ohio, and would subsequently force those who "make States" to be "that" much better.  If they become "that" much better, then NCAA wrestling talent increases, and in turn, increases our talent at the post-collegiate level.  It's all a cycle, and how we all determine to design this locomotive. 

 

I know we have the HS National Championships, Super 32, FloNats, etc., but wouldn't it be cool to have a single, "mandatory" tournament, paid for through donations/sponsorships/etc., where ALL 50 State Champions at each weight class come together to truly find "Who is #1"?  The vision of that future would assist in taking our sport, in this great nation, to heights never before seen. 

That would never happen. Michigan, in fact, specifically prohibits its wrestlers from participating in any supposed "National Championship" event, or else they'd lose some eligibility (I believe a year, but the MHSAA handbook is not available online unless you fork over money that I have no intention of forking over to them). Granted, seniors could participate, but they'd lose eligibility to participate in a spring sport, and wrestlers in other grades would lose a full year of eligibility.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The worse thing that ever happened to New York Wrestling was the D1 and D2 split.

 

They were very clearly given MANY options to create a process and situation where MORE wrestlers could have been involved in the state tournament... but the powers at be literally pushed for 2 divisions so their schools would get a state champion, which they never had with one division.  

 

It had NOTHING to do with having more kids involved.  It had everything to do with getting some of their kids to the "top" (even though we know it is not).

 

The did finally get a few D2 champs, but it has completely watered down the event.  Just terrible.

 

 

There are people in California that want to split up the state meet here too. May it never pass. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...