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Who's Gonna Pull the Austin DeSanto @ NCAAs

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Tom [Clum] was one of my heroes after that match. Clearly, Tom and his parents were winners at the bigger game.   I flew to Bloomington to watch him win his Big 10 Title in a 4 overtime thriller at the Big Tens.  Greatness comes in many forms in this beautiful sport....

The following Denver Post article discusses that final match of Tom Clum's high school career and how he moved on from that last second defeat.  It may have been a shocking defeat, but it certainly wasn't a devastating one for Tom, whose words and actions demonstrated a better perspective on wrestling and on life than most of the fans watching that night.  http://www.denverpost.com/2009/02/18/wrestlings-shocker-8-years-later/

 

I suspect that Spencer Lee, just like Tom Clum (and Dan Gable), will also move past this shocking loss just fine....

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In some sense, you are correct that you cannot tear an ACL that is already torn.  However, the key is exactly what you point out about the other ligaments/cartilage in the knee. The brace helps a bit, but in a wrestling match you are still going to put unnecessary stress/pressure on it. The ACL can be replaced, but serious damage to the knee beyond just the ACL can be career ending. 

 

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/sportsdoc/Do-I-need-an-ACL-to-play.html

With today's medical science, It's very rare that a knee is injured so badly that it is career ending. My point is that you cannot make the decision for Lee without knowing all the details. I get that a high school state title is not the pinnacle for Spencer Lee, but you all are underestimating the importance of it to Lee. I'm sure he had a goal of going down as the GOAT high school wrestler. Look how many people stil, talk about Kolat. Do you expect him to give that up for a very small chance of a worse injury? why would anyone wrestle in the first place if knee injuries are so horrible? I have torn both my ACL and meniscus and I can still move around and wrestle just fine

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Will anyone pull a Desanto @ NCAA's?  I believe having the deeper meaning of, "Will anyone knock off one of the untouchables at the NCAA's?"

2017 seems special in that many of the #1 seeds do seem rather untouchable at the moment.  I haven't felt this confident about #1 seeds winning the NCAA championship as I do this year. 


Out of the 10 weight classes, only 125 lbs seems questionable to me.  As much of a fan as I am of Joey Dance, I cannot ignore history and worry about his outcome. He's as good as anyone and he has the tools to bring home an NCAA title. Yet he could also fold and end up without a medal.  I'm not 100% sold on Gilman either. He showed his susceptibility against Lizak earlier this year, and not everyone is going to allow him to come back from such a deficit should it happen....especially at the NCAA's.  NDSU's Rodriguez, whoever he meets in the semis and even Kraisser in the second round will be unforgiving if a mistake is made. 

I'm also not sold on Tomasello winning the NCAA title either. I'm confident in him and he is my pick but Clark wrestled him well at the BIG 10's and he has yet to meet Gross on the mat. 


And the rest of the weights I'm pretty confident if not 100% confident 

Who touches Heil? He's had one loss in the last two years and that was a 3-1 s.v. against Joey Ward of North Carolina.  He'll have Ashnault in the semis and most likely either Jack or McKenna in the finals. I could forsee an upset out of any of those three, but still have Heil as the champion. 

Retherford? Unless he gets sick or injured, no one will even come close. 35-0 last year and thus far 23-0 this year. Don't see him getting beat again. 

Nolf? I'll say the same thing.  Unless he gets sick or injured, no one will even come close.  22-0 this year and in his 34-2 record last season, his only losses were to Isaiah Martinez. 

Which now leads me to Isaiah Martinez. He recently beat second seeded Massa 10-4 and has two wins over third seeded Joseph 5-2 and 8-5.  I don't see him being denied a third title.  Matter of fact, wouldn't be surprised if his loss to Nolf ends up being the only loss of his career. 

Zahid Valencia? The only thing going against him is that he's a freshman and he's never competed at NCAA's before. It's a whole new world and sometimes freshmen don't react well to it.  Max Askren anyone? Yet I think Valencia could.  Don't know, to me it'll be difficult to put together that many good matches against that many good wrestlers on that big of a stage. I see Bo Jordan or possible Realbuto getting him. So not 100% sold here.  

Dean? He's steadily improved every year.  I thought the junior Dean looked good at NCAA's last year, but I do believe if the Senior Dean were to wrestle the Junior Dean, that the Senior Dean would win by major decision. With that said it's interesting to note that his likely quarter-final match against Dechow has always been one of his closest matches.  Dechow knows how to wrestle Dean. Upset is unlikely, but when you're only ahead by a point...things CAN happen.  And his likely semi-final match is one to note too.  Likely opponent Nolan Boyd is the only wrestler the past two seasons to hand Dean a loss.  Still picking Dean though.  

Cox? Some think he's wrestled sluggishly this year but I think he'll be fine.  Pfarr or Moore with the upset? Not ruling it out but still think Cox will be fine. 

Snyder only wrestles a dozen collegiate matches per year, but it doesn't seem to effect him any. I think he could literally just wrestle BIG 10's and NCAA's next year and still win them both.  The guy is simply that talented.  Can anyone knock him off? Medberry? Kasper?  It'd take a throw out of nowhere and Snyder is just too good and too experienced to let that happen. 

I'm much more excited about the race for AA status in the quarterfinals and Round of Twelve matches than I am for this year's finals.  Nothing is a given in this sport and anything can happen but so many feel like shoe ins, sketched in stone already.  Takes the fun out of it for me. 

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The following Denver Post article discusses that final match of Tom Clum's high school career and how he moved on from that last second defeat.  It may have been a shocking defeat, but it certainly wasn't a devastating one for Tom, whose words and actions demonstrated a better perspective on wrestling and on life than most of the fans watching that night.  http://www.denverpost.com/2009/02/18/wrestlings-shocker-8-years-later/

 

I suspect that Spencer Lee, just like Tom Clum (and Dan Gable), will also move past this shocking loss just fine....

Tom Clum = Major Class Act and incredible outdoorsman too!

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With today's medical science, It's very rare that a knee is injured so badly that it is career ending. My point is that you cannot make the decision for Lee without knowing all the details. I get that a high school state title is not the pinnacle for Spencer Lee, but you all are underestimating the importance of it to Lee. I'm sure he had a goal of going down as the GOAT high school wrestler. Look how many people stil, talk about Kolat. Do you expect him to give that up for a very small chance of a worse injury? why would anyone wrestle in the first place if knee injuries are so horrible? I have torn both my ACL and meniscus and I can still move around and wrestle just fine

 

That's great to hear, and a bit less worrisome than I originally thought. 

 

I was always the impression that competing through ACL or meniscus injuries could result in damage that impacts basic mobility down the road.  Like, we hear sometimes about football players that tear their ACL and continue playing (or return too early), but can no longer walk once they retire. And there was a college basketball player this year who tore his ACL three times and was forced to retire from the sport due to the extent of the damage.  My mother in law also had her meniscus surgically repaired many years ago and she hasn't been fully mobile since.

 

Beyond competing in college and the Olympics, it would have been awful for Spencer Lee to incur a potentially life-altering injury because he wrestled with a torn ACL.  I was being a worry wart about the situation without knowing all the details, but I think people were expressing the need for SL and his coaches to be smart about the injury since the consequences could be dire.

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I am Tom Clum, I lost my last match just like Lee. I was turned onto this post from a friend. I was nowhere near the wrestler Lee is, he's one of my absolute favorite high schoolers.

 

Dan Gable approached me in Vegas a few weeks after my loss. He told me that high school would be meaningless to me, and to go have a great college career. He was right.

 

(By the way I won that Vegas tournament which was my biggest win at that point in time, fresh off the most devastating loss of my life)

 

Spencer will most likely go on to achieve some rare feats. He already has. He'll probably have the same regrets that every wrestler of all time has had. Not sure I know anybody that is fully satisfied with their career, no matter what level they finished at. I think I should have accomplished more, same with the guys that finished ahead of and behind me.

 

I do know one thing, no matter what, wrestling ends. I think life is much sweeter now. Wrestling was fun. I have nothing to prove anymore. I am fully satisfied.

 

Spencer Lee will not be harmed in any way, shape or form. If anything, the loss will probably end up being a positive event in his life. Maybe not now, but soon.

 

Now time to get ready for the drive to St Louis!

 

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

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That's great to hear, and a bit less worrisome than I originally thought. 

 

I was always the impression that competing through ACL or meniscus injuries could result in damage that impacts basic mobility down the road.  Like, we hear sometimes about football players that tear their ACL and continue playing (or return too early), but can no longer walk once they retire. And there was a college basketball player this year who tore his ACL three times and was forced to retire from the sport due to the extent of the damage.  My mother in law also had her meniscus surgically repaired many years ago and she hasn't been fully mobile since.

 

Beyond competing in college and the Olympics, it would have been awful for Spencer Lee to incur a potentially life-altering injury because he wrestled with a torn ACL.  I was being a worry wart about the situation without knowing all the details, but I think people were expressing the need for SL and his coaches to be smart about the injury since the consequences could be dire.

Agree it would be horrible for Lee to have a "life-altering injury" but my point is the chances are very slim and he, his parents, and his doctor can weigh that risk. There is a risk for permanent injury to every athlete that competes and I'm guessing Lee's chances were not much greater than the avg wrestler without a preexisting injury. He can defend himself quite well and for every example you an come with up about a football player that cannot walk (I'm not familiar with any), there are likely thousands of successful athletes who have had ACL tears. Lee was on his first, not his third so that bball example is irrelevant.

 

I'm guessing those those who say the risk is not worth it, have never worked nearly as hard as Lee to accomplish a goal. I know I worked extremely hard to try to reach my wrestling goals, and to me a slight increase in a risk of injury would not deter me from my goals. If it were a concussion, that's a different story, but it is very, very rare for a high school kid to injure a knee so badly there is permanent damage. Lee had a chance to make history and be remembered forever. That is not something one should give up easily

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Agree it would be horrible for Lee to have a "life-altering injury" but my point is the chances are very slim and he, his parents, and his doctor can weigh that risk. There is a risk for permanent injury to every athlete that competes and I'm guessing Lee's chances were not much greater than the avg wrestler without a preexisting injury. He can defend himself quite well and for every example you an come with up about a football player that cannot walk (I'm not familiar with any), there are likely thousands of successful athletes who have had ACL tears. Lee was on his first, not his third so that bball example is irrelevant.

I'm guessing those those who say the risk is not worth it, have never worked nearly as hard as Lee to accomplish a goal. I know I worked extremely hard to try to reach my wrestling goals, and to me a slight increase in a risk of injury would not deter me from my goals. If it were a concussion, that's a different story, but it is very, very rare for a high school kid to injure a knee so badly there is permanent damage. Lee had a chance to make history and be remembered forever. That is not something one should give up easily

What history would he have made? There have already been 4 time undefeated state champs, even in Pennsylvania. Lee will be remembered "forever" as a High school wrestler anyway. One more state title wasn't going to change that. He made it to the #1 p4p ranking before his senior year, and held that ranking for the better part of the last two years. He's already in the elite of the elite in HS wrestling. Someone with Lee's goals won't care too much about HS if he lives up to his own expectations. I know this is hard for some to believe, but a lot of wrestlers (and other elite athletes) don't care at all about accomplishments that most would die for. As Mr. Clum said Coach Gable told him: "High School wrestling would be meaningless..."

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