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Kolat on redshirting

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Just take it the logical one step further.

 

4 years to compete. Period.

 

And I agree with starting first year of eligibility as the school year in which the kid starts in college or the year in which the student is 19 years old. Whichever is earlier.

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Just take it the logical one step further.

 

4 years to compete. Period.

 

And I agree with starting first year of eligibility as the school year in which the kid starts in college or the year in which the student is 19 years old. Whichever is earlier.

So you don't mind hurting a kid that legitimately is held back or started late because of learning issues or simply being a rambunctious 5 year old. The same people that skirt the rules to hold a kid back will probably go to the same extent in college if forced to. Those parents are the type that would likely "send" their kid on a mission or make them sign up for a year stint in the Army to get them older.

 

It is interesting that you point out kids held back when Nolf, Retherford, and I think Nickal were all younger for their grade.

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Kolat's rule doesn't make sense.  Could football players compete in the regular season all 5 years, but then pick 4 when their team makes important bowl games?

 

This is Kolat's issue.  He is only looking at it from the wrestling prism.  I don's see the NCAA crafting different RS rules for each sport.

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So you don't mind hurting a kid that legitimately is held back or started late because of learning issues or simply being a rambunctious 5 year old. The same people that skirt the rules to hold a kid back will probably go to the same extent in college if forced to. Those parents are the type that would likely "send" their kid on a mission or make them sign up for a year stint in the Army to get them older.

 

It is interesting that you point out kids held back when Nolf, Retherford, and I think Nickal were all younger for their grade.

 

How old were grajales, hall, and stieber, when they all started their "freshmen season"....

 

Dake was 18

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NCAA rules are and have always been geared to serve basketball and football.  Redshirting originally was created for injured players--that was corrupted into squeezing an extra year of development out of a completely healthy kid.  It was further corrupted by the Olympic redshirt concept (keeping some kids around for six years).  His idea makes sense for wrestling, which is why it has no shot with the NCAA.

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Why stop there?

 

Why don't we only count seasons of eligability for guys that qualify for the NCAA tournament.  Oh, wait... Suriano.  How about just guys that qualify and compete have used their eligibility?

 

But maybe that isn't really far enough.  I mean, All-American honors are really what wrestling is all about right?  Andrew Alton shouldn't have had to burn his freshmen season when he only made the Round of 12.  We should probably only count seasons where guys get on the podium.

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How old were grajales, hall, and stieber, when they all started their "freshmen season"....

 

Dake was 18

Here is the truth to the matter, people will skirt the rules to get advantages. No rule will prevent that kind of stuff from going on.

 

Many educators recommend holding boys back early on. In most cases this is done when the kid wants to be a firetruck and has no clue if he'll be the next college football/baseball/wrestling star.

Edited by BobDole

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Yeah, wouldn't it be great if Penn State and Oklahoma State could have every guy in their wrestling room available for them in each event throughout the year and then at the conference tournament they could decide who they wanted to save for another year after they helped ensure they dominated all year in the team competitions?

 

Great idea, Kolat!  You're going to hurt the small schools like yours even more...

 

But seriously, he titled his post 'End Redshirting' which is the right thing to do but his proposal actually expands redshirting and makes it more available than ever.  That is not ending redshirting.  Ending redshirting would be great though.

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I wouldn't mind seeing a redshirt be used for the Freshman only. And have it start the year after HS graduation to avoid someone taking a year off to get an additional year in. That wat it's available to help those student-athletes that need a year to mature and/or get used to college (academics, training, etc...) rather than just an additional year off. If you feel the Freshman is ready to start than you feel it's worth giving up the redshirt. Medical and Olympic Year RS being separate from this though.

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NCAA rules are and have always been geared to serve basketball and football.  Redshirting originally was created for injured players--that was corrupted into squeezing an extra year of development out of a completely healthy kid.  It was further corrupted by the Olympic redshirt concept (keeping some kids around for six years).  His idea makes sense for wrestling, which is why it has no shot with the NCAA.

 

I think people misunderstand the redshirt and how it came about.  

 

There is a reason a redshirt is not awarded until the end of the season.

 

Freshmen were not permitted to compete in varsity competition for many years.  When freshmen started competing and athletes could have four years of competition, it was understood that many freshmen were not mature enough and ready for varsity competition.  As a result, a rule was developed that if the season finished and an athlete was not used by the program in competition, the athlete's season would not count against their eligibility.  The rule colloquially became known as the redshirt rule because of quarterbacks who wear a redshirt (so that people know they aren't allowed to hit them in practice) needing a year to learn the playbook and system and thus not being put into a game as a freshmen.

 

The rule has always been one that is designed to be applied retroactively.  A coach is expected to put their best team forward for each competition and if at the end of the year an athlete was never used in competition (or sustained a season ending injury) they could have a redshirt season applied to that season.

 

Wrestling is the only sport I know of where the redshirt is planned and expected.  The redshirt drastically perverts the sport of wrestling and changes the incentives.  Actually, the redshirt itself is not the problem.  Redshirting is fine.  It is the fact that the individual is still able to compete, and not only compete but also have their results impact who becomes a national qualifier.  The system benefits the redshirting individual at the expense of the team in which they compete for and the field nationally.

 

Personally, I think a lot of planned redshirts are actually a failure in a coach's fiduciary duty to the program.  They are not putting their best team on the mat and there are many instances where coaches are willing to take a forfeit rather than using an athlete that could compete because they are redshirting them.  This is not good for the sport.

 

I see many athletes who redshirt not even finishing out their college careers and the longer athletes compete the more likely they are to have a career ending injury.  Redshirting doesn't stop training and competition which leads to injuries, it just means that the program won't benefit from their service.

Edited by Pinnum

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