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Molinaro, Ruth, Wright without Cael


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#1 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 09:08 AM

Some critics of Cael Sanderson claim that PSU is so good because Cael recruits so well, not becuase he can actually coach. How do you think Molinaro, Ruth and Q.Wright (who were already commited to PSU before Cael came on board) would have done for PSU if Cael and Co never came. Would they still have won National Titles?

#2 Zebra

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 09:39 AM

Well all were great wrestlers on the HS level and Q was an AA as a true freshman. 



#3 BRGuy

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 10:11 AM

got yall covered

if cael dont come he dont cancel the penn state open so ruth doesnt get a dwi the kid was a talent who could win on his own

wright got himself on the podium with a coach who struggled in a wrestling hotbed he was winning on his own


molinaro doesnt choose down


if recruiting aint nothin then how did dernlan use his recruiting at penn state to land the clarion then binghamton jobs he wasnt even a coach at penn state

#4 HawkFanactic1

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 10:52 AM

They all have similar careers with or without Cael...proves he does a whole lot of developing huh?

#5 TBar1977

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:21 AM

They all have similar careers with or without Cael...proves he does a whole lot of developing huh?


Who to believe? 6 of last 7 NCAA Titles or some random p'd off Iowa fan?

This is a toughie. Except it isn't.

I have set aside funds to have six Green Bay Packers be my pall bearers, that way they can let me down one final time. 


#6 Plasmodium

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:35 AM

Carl was instrumental in PSU putting together a great atmosphere. That didn't hamper their progress.

#7 paboom

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 12:04 PM

I would love to run an experiment.

1st. Hire the high school custodian with zero wrestling experience as the new high school head coach.

2nd. Stock all 14 weights with kids who placed top 3 at PJW junior high states.

3rd. Sit back and watch what happens.

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#8 redblades

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 12:08 PM

I would never have been a national champion without Kale.


Edited by redblades, 19 May 2017 - 12:08 PM.


#9 HawkFanactic1

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 01:30 PM

I would never have been a national champion without Kale.


I did it with spinach

#10 Joe24

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 01:32 PM

Some critics of Cael Sanderson claim that PSU is so good because Cael recruits so well, not becuase he can actually coach. How do you think Molinaro, Ruth and Q.Wright (who were already commited to PSU before Cael came on board) would have done for PSU if Cael and Co never came. Would they still have won National Titles?

 

I would guess yes, at least one of them would.  This said, Cael is the standard. It is a bit pathetic that many grasp at straws. 



#11 Joe24

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 01:33 PM

Are you serious?

 

They all have similar careers with or without Cael...proves he does a whole lot of developing huh?



#12 Joe24

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 01:35 PM

I would never have been a national champion without Kale.

 

...don't forget the roofies. 



#13 HawkFanactic1

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 02:56 PM

Are you serious?


TBar/21 Guns...either one of them, go to bed

#14 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 09:53 PM

I would love to run an experiment.
1st. Hire the high school custodian with zero wrestling experience as the new high school head coach.
2nd. Stock all 14 weights with kids who placed top 3 at PJW junior high states.
3rd. Sit back and watch what happens.
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IMO in the short term the team would be successful, however the team would lack organization, structure as the program would not progress to an elite level. Egos amongst the team would probably be difficult to manage and there would be a lot of infighting. Close calls by the refs would get missed and not called. Close dual meets that would be winnable via strategy would be lost. Kids would have to rely on themselves for motivation as well as have to look elsewhere for advice and guidance. Over time the team would fall apart. I've seen HS teams that were handed top level talent and by the end due to lack or organization and poor coaching the team fall apart. I've seen well coached teams with less talent beat poorly coaches teams with great talent. When you put the two together, that's when magic happens.

Yes, Cael gets great talent, but what makes him a great coach is how he maximizes and gets the most out of that talent as well as positions them to be as successful as possible. He seems to have the ability to take great wrestlers and get them to the next level. He creates a winning mindset and an environment where his wrestlers can be successful. This is all things the Cael haters tend to "forget" or "ignore."

IMO without Cael
Molinaro probably is a 4x AA but doesn't win a national title.
Ruth probably doesn't win 3x... Maybe 2 or 1.
Wright maybe wins 1.

Edited by BigTenFanboy, 19 May 2017 - 10:01 PM.

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#15 cjc007

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 10:07 PM

IMO in the short term the team would be successful, however the team would lack organization, structure as the program would not progress to an elite level. Egos amongst the team would probably be difficult to manage and there would be a lot of infighting. Close calls by the refs would get missed and not called. Close dual meets that would be winnable via strategy would be lost. Kids would have to rely on themselves for motivation as well as have to look elsewhere for advice and guidance. Over time the team would fall apart. I've seen HS teams that were handed top level talent and by the end due to lack or organization and poor coaching the team fall apart. I've seen well coached teams with less talent beat poorly coaches teams with great talent. When you put the two together, that's when magic happens.

Yes, Cael gets great talent, but what makes him a great coach is how he maximizes and gets the most out of that talent as well as positions them to be as successful as possible. He seems to have the ability to take great wrestlers and get them to the next level. He creates a winning mindset and an environment where his wrestlers can be successful. This is all things the Cael haters tend to "forget" or "ignore."

IMO without Cael
Molinaro probably is a 4x AA but doesn't win a national title.
Ruth probably doesn't win 3x... Maybe 2 or 1.
Wright maybe wins 1.

Ed Ruth wins 3 titles if he wrestled for Sacred Heart. Yeah, he's a folkstyle phenom.

Molinaro would have won two titles if he didn't run into the Dake Buzzsaw.

Wright would have won at least 2 titles. He's showtime in March.


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Edited by cjc007, 19 May 2017 - 10:08 PM.

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#16 redblades

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 10:24 PM

Hmmm... I wonder - would Leen, Simaz, or Bosak have been as successful if they hadn't wrestled for Koll?  Garrett or Dean?

 

Would Dake have been a 4 timer wrestling for someone else?


Edited by redblades, 19 May 2017 - 10:28 PM.

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#17 Flying-Tiger

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 10:40 PM

I would throw Matt Brown's name out there. He was ranked in the 70s out of high school and was a national champ, 2 time finalist and 3 time AA (behind Ruth freshman year). Now Matt had an incredible work ethic so he would of been successful anywhere however I do think the coaching staff played a big part in him becoming a finalist caliber wrestler. 


Edited by Flying-Tiger, 19 May 2017 - 11:06 PM.

A Kinder, Gentler Machine Gun Hand

#18 TBar1977

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 10:54 PM

Fantasy careers are even better than fantasy matches.

I have set aside funds to have six Green Bay Packers be my pall bearers, that way they can let me down one final time. 


#19 cjc007

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:00 PM

I would throw Matt Brown's name out there. He was ranked in the 70s out of high school and was a national champ, 2 time finalist and 3 time AA (behind Ruth freshman year). Now Mat had an incredible work ethic so he would of been successful anywhere however I do think the coaching staff played a big part in him becoming a finalist caliber wrestler.

He's a great guy and a good role model as well. I always enjoyed talking to Matt after the matches. Very polite and unassuming young man.

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#20 paboom

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:48 PM

People forget that just a couple of years prior to Cael that PSU took 3rd at NCAA'S with a champ and another finalist.

Molinaro and Wright would've been fine but I disagree with Ruth. Yes he was a folkstyle phenom but I do believe it was Cael's demeanor, environment and leadership that allowed him to stay focused and maximize his outrageous ability.

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