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KTG119

over/under on Penn St national champs next season

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Right, all I said was of those three "Suriano, Joseph, and Hall" they would all lose in the QF or SF. Meaning I think one Joseph will lose in the QF, and Hall and Suriano will lose in the SF.

So none of those three even make finals in your view? I would think otherwise.

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So none of those three even make finals in your view? I would think otherwise.

I very well could be wrong, PSU certainly surprised us this year, so we never actually know when it comes to NCAAs. I just think 165 is too deep, 174 I think people will catch up to Hall, figure out to get past him, and 125 we are always seeing the top guys go down (Dance, Gilman, Tomasello, Garrett) (2016).

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I very well could be wrong, PSU certainly surprised us this year, so we never actually know when it comes to NCAAs. I just think 165 is too deep, 174 I think people will catch up to Hall, figure out to get past him, and 125 we are always seeing the top guys go down (Dance, Gilman, Tomasello, Garrett) (2016).

Ok. I hear what you are saying. I disagree on the total conclusion but I do hear ya.

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I love the offseason discussion. It's the only time of year fans can speculate because once the season starts everyone sees the stark reality and goes back to. "Wait till next year!"

 

Give me a break "catching Hall". Dude has world class technique and will be stronger

 

Suriano won't have a close match all year unless NATO is down

 

Joseph is a pickem but until he gets knocked off by someone next year he still the favorite

 

Always interesting to me how as time goes bye PSU wrestlers get worse on the message boards

 

 

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It's got to be 4.5

 

If you set it at 5 that's almost free money on the under, since 5 would be a push.  That means that all 6 guys with a chance have to be healthy and win for the under to lose.  Under would be the easiest bet ever in that situation.

 

If you set it at 4.5, then there's a winner and a loser and no push in play to protect the better.  I'd say 4 is slightly more likely than 5, but you set a line to promote betting, not to correct predict outcomes.  I bet 4.5 would convince bettors on both sides.  That is if betting on wrestling really existed.  

 

And it's a testament to PSU that you couldn't set the line at 2.5 for any other school.  You couldn't even set the line at 4.5 for any other conference of schools if you take PSU out of it.  

 

PSU 4.5

BIG 10 (minus PSU) 3.5

Big 12 1.5

Edited by boconnell

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I love the offseason discussion. It's the only time of year fans can speculate because once the season starts everyone sees the stark reality and goes back to. "Wait till next year!"

 

Give me a break "catching Hall". Dude has world class technique and will be stronger

 

Suriano won't have a close match all year unless NATO is down

 

Joseph is a pickem but until he gets knocked off by someone next year he still the favorite

 

Always interesting to me how as time goes bye PSU wrestlers get worse on the message boards

 

 

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Except for David Taylor. He is now 367-0 against Dake, Cox, Gable, Baumgardner and the rest in fantasy wrestling. Even beat Rocky 5 times!

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Except for David Taylor. He is now 367-0 against Dake, Cox, Gable, Baumgardner and the rest in fantasy wrestling. Even beat Rocky 5 times!

 

Lol. Almost accurate. It's 367-1. Remember no one beats Pico in fantasy wrestling

 

 

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Edited by pish6969

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I'm not quite following why everyone is so "wishy-washy" on Mark Hall and his ability to repeat.  I have zero inside info, but my gut is telling me that Zahid is going 184 (for future FS success reasons most likely, and to simpy stay away from his fellow JR. WT Member in Hall).  Stylistically, the matchup between Zahid/Nickal favors Zahid more than his matchup vs. Hall. 

 

Also... Hall is going to have another JR. WC experience under his belt, is in that nasty PSU room improving, and is most likely going to have the opportunity to train with the top Sr. 74's this summer. 

 

Given all this, and that BoJo is most likely riding the pine of fatherhood and not pursuing anything beyond his final year at tOSU, Hall becomes more of a lock than is true freshman year and it's result.  After he wins his 2nd NCAA title next year, please do consider putting him in the same category as Zain/Nolf/Nickal, because, quite frankly, he's effectively there.

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The feeling isn't exclusive to Hall. People were even more "wishy washy" with Myles Martin. Both had great runs as Freshman, but looked very beatable at times. Plus, I don't think many are picking him to finish far from 1st. In fact, I would bet just about everybody still expects top 3.

 

Again, a lot of it depends on whether or not Hall and Joseph are switching weights. They both had great tournaments, but, like Martin, that one tournament performance doesn't fully negate losses during the season.

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Hall is a totally different type of talent than MyMar.

And yet their TF results were quite similar. Still, the point wasn't to directly compare the two. It was to show there is precedent for picking against a less than fully dominant TF champ. Hell, Schlatter was way more dominant than both of them his 1st year and he didn't win it the following year. It happens.

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And yet their TF results were quite similar. Still, the point wasn't to directly compare the two. It was to show there is precedent for picking against a less than fully dominant TF champ. Hell, Schlatter was way more dominant than both of them his 1st year and he didn't win it the following year. It happens.

That season (aside from Disalvo loss) My favorite TF performance ever. Beat espo like he stole something. Looked liked he'd never lose again.

 

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I'm not quite following why everyone is so "wishy-washy" on Mark Hall and his ability to repeat.  I have zero inside info, but my gut is telling me that Zahid is going 184 (for future FS success reasons most likely, and to simpy stay away from his fellow JR. WT Member in Hall).  Stylistically, the matchup between Zahid/Nickal favors Zahid more than his matchup vs. Hall. 

 

Also... Hall is going to have another JR. WC experience under his belt, is in that nasty PSU room improving, and is most likely going to have the opportunity to train with the top Sr. 74's this summer. 

 

Given all this, and that BoJo is most likely riding the pine of fatherhood and not pursuing anything beyond his final year at tOSU, Hall becomes more of a lock than is true freshman year and it's result.  After he wins his 2nd NCAA title next year, please do consider putting him in the same category as Zain/Nolf/Nickal, because, quite frankly, he's effectively there.

If Valencia is up then Hall is a clear favorite over the field.  As soon as we see Valencia up the wishy-washy goes away for everyone who doesn't have an agenda.

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If Valencia is up then Hall is a clear favorite over the field. As soon as we see Valencia up the wishy-washy goes away for everyone who doesn't have an agenda.

Clear favorite over BoJo? I don't think picking Jordan any where near 50/50 is agenda worthy in the least.

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Clear favorite over BoJo? I don't think picking Jordan any where near 50/50 is agenda worthy in the least.

BoJo isn't beating Hall next year.  He certainly isn't 50/50.  I don't believe for 1 second that you would bet even money on BoJo.  He's not catching a true freshman who's biggest problem a year ago is he needed to grow into the weight.

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BoJo isn't beating Hall next year. He certainly isn't 50/50. I don't believe for 1 second that you would bet even money on BoJo. He's not catching a true freshman who's biggest problem a year ago is he needed to grow into the weight.

With two fully healthy feet and the freedom to train and vigorously pursue that last chance Championship, yes I believe I would get him even money. Now, I would need to know that to be certain, but I definitely think that would offset any gains that Hall could/may/will make.

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I love the offseason discussion. It's the only time of year fans can speculate because once the season starts everyone sees the stark reality and goes back to. "Wait till next year!"

 

Give me a break "catching Hall". Dude has world class technique and will be stronger

 

Suriano won't have a close match all year unless NATO is down

 

Joseph is a pickem but until he gets knocked off by someone next year he still the favorite

 

Always interesting to me how as time goes bye PSU wrestlers get worse on the message boards

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So, has NATO gotten worse the past two years since he has had two heartbreaking SF losses? I never said they were gonna go 2-15 and 0-2 at NCAAs, just simply predicted they might all not make the finals.

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BoJo isn't beating Hall next year.  He certainly isn't 50/50.  I don't believe for 1 second that you would bet even money on BoJo.  He's not catching a true freshman who's biggest problem a year ago is he needed to grow into the weight.

 

The thing is that BoJo is a helluva wrestler and would probably be a big favorite and returning champion under normal circumstances. Problem is he's go two wunderkind at his weight (Hall/Zahid).

 

I give Hall 50%, Zahid/BoJo 25% each.

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So, has NATO gotten worse the past two years since he has had two heartbreaking SF losses? I never said they were gonna go 2-15 and 0-2 at NCAAs, just simply predicted they might all not make the finals.

NATO? I never said anything negative about him. I said Suriano won't have a close match all year unless NATO is down at 125. Who's talking negative about NATO? Meaning if NATO goes 133, Suriano cruises. If he goes 125 that's a pickem.

 

The comment that made no sense from you is when you said people will "catch up with Hall". How will people exactly catch up? Besides Snyder he may possibly be the most gifted wrestler technique wise in the country. The only reason he had close matches was the weight he gave up.

 

So if you said "Hall will lose because he giving up too much strength and weight," I can accept that as an argument against him winning. When you say people "will catch up" that implies people can match his skillset and overcome that. NOT HAPENNiNG!

 

 

 

 

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Edited by pish6969

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NATO? I never said anything negative about him. I said Suriano won't have a close match all year unless NATO is down at 125. Who's talking negative about NATO? Meaning if NATO goes 133, Suriano cruises. If he goes 125 that's a pickem.

 

The comment that made no sense from you is when you said people will "catch up with Hall". How will people exactly catch up? Besides Snyder he may possibly be the most gifted wrestler technique wise in the country. The only reason he had close matches was the weight he gave up.

 

So if you said "Hall will lose because he giving up too much strength and weight," I can accept that as an argument against him winning. When you say people "will catch up" that implies people can match his skillet and overcome that. NOT HAPENNiNG!

 

 

 

 

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I would argue with you that Bob Evans can match that any time and would wager heavily that Bob is far superior on Sundays!

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I would argue with you that Bob Evans can match that any time and would wager heavily that Bob is far superior on Sundays!

Lol

 

Now corrected

 

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Edited by pish6969

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I would set the over/under at four.  Nolf & Retherford are almost locks, Nickal is close to being one too.  Martin has beaten him, but Bo is a solid favorite IMO.  If Valencia goes up, then he could make it more interesting.

 

Joseph improved so much during last season who's to say he won't continue to greatly improve?  He is a strong candidate to repeat although IMar and Massa will have their say.

 

I predict Hall to be much improved because as noted by others, he will have a full season to train, get bigger and there will be no speculation of a redshirt.  I think this is the year he separates himself even further.  If Valencia stays at 174, then obviously, he along with Jordan will be tough to beat again, but I believe next year's version of Hall will be much, much better than this past season. 

 

Suriano is a very strong candidate and could have won it last year. The big ? is Tomasello and where he's going.  Of course, Cruz will be tough too although Nick handled him pretty well in an early season dual.

 

There could be six PSU champs and if that happens, I would not be surprised. I think at least four is a safe bet though.

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