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Did Lesnar ever wrestle freestyle?


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#21 hammerlockthree

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 12:54 PM

The question is...how much of his success was do to being physically....out of scale. (thats not a PED comment it is a natural gifts comment. But both have diminishing returns)



#22 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 01:17 AM

The question is...how much of his success was do to being physically....out of scale. (thats not a PED comment it is a natural gifts comment. But both have diminishing returns)

 

Brock Lesnar himself would tell you that he was not a great "technical" wrestler. I would say almost of his success was due to being physically "out of scale" but does it really matter? Had he gone on to the international circuit I'm sure he could have had a decent amount of success. I am certainly not saying he would have been a World or Olympic Champion, but I'm sure he would have won a large amount of his matches. At the end of the day there's only 1 think that will combat perfect technique and that impossible superhuman physical strength and stamina. In terms of our sport he had it to a certain degree which is why he won as much as he did. Imagine how great he would have been had he actually developed good technique!

 

With that said, he chose to go a different route and I'll say hes done pretty darn well for himself.


Edited by BigTenFanboy, 26 October 2017 - 01:25 AM.


#23 wrestlingnerd

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 01:31 AM

The scariest thing about Lesnar was the combo of muscle and cardio. I don’t know if that many big guys who could go a full 7. He’s obviously a great athlete, so his upside in technical development would’ve been rare for a guy with his credentials getting started in freestyle.
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#24 Tofurky

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 02:20 AM

BtQOIsnIEAA5lEf.jpg

 

This one will make you poop your pants...

 


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#25 hammerlockthree

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 01:28 PM

Brock Lesnar himself would tell you that he was not a great "technical" wrestler. I would say almost of his success was due to being physically "out of scale" but does it really matter? Had he gone on to the international circuit I'm sure he could have had a decent amount of success. I am certainly not saying he would have been a World or Olympic Champion, but I'm sure he would have won a large amount of his matches. At the end of the day there's only 1 think that will combat perfect technique and that impossible superhuman physical strength and stamina. In terms of our sport he had it to a certain degree which is why he won as much as he did. Imagine how great he would have been had he actually developed good technique!

 

With that said, he chose to go a different route and I'll say hes done pretty darn well for himself.

 

why does the lesnar faction get to "what if" about technique but no one ever "what ifs" about being a freak athlete? 


Edited by hammerlockthree, 26 October 2017 - 01:31 PM.


#26 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 02:08 PM

why does the lesnar faction get to "what if" about technique but no one ever "what ifs" about being a freak athlete?

First of all it has nothing to do with being part of a Lesnar faction if such a thing even exists. With Brock Lesnar technique is his missing piece, but I'll jump on your question. If George Carpenter was a super freak athlete like Lesnar I'll be willing to say he probably would have AA'ed this past March. If you turn anyone into a freak athlete they probably will do very well in whatever sport they compete it. Certainly better than they current do now. Kinda sounds like common sense to me which is why no one ever "what ifs" about being a freak athlete.

Do you think any athlete in any sport currently competing would actually perform better if their strength, speed, agility, and coordination decreased?

Edited by BigTenFanboy, 26 October 2017 - 02:21 PM.


#27 hammerlockthree

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 02:47 PM

I am going to ignore that last question.

 

My point is that it is naive to assume a freak athlete who is modest at learning can learn as well as a modest athlete who is good at learning. 

 

Talents aren't all in the biceps. 


Edited by hammerlockthree, 26 October 2017 - 02:48 PM.


#28 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 02:53 PM

I am going to ignore that last question.

My point is that it is naive to assume a freak athlete who is modest at learning can learn as well as a modest athlete who is good at learning.

Talents aren't all in the biceps.

Absolutely, but again all of this is speculation. IF a freak athlete learned good technique he would perform much better. It's not naive at all to make that statement, it's common sense. It's not saying that the athlete is capable of learning that technique. It's naive to believe everyone is capable to learning, but that's not what was being said at all.

Do you disagree that if Lesnar learned better technique he would have been a much better wrestler? Or are you going to again ignore this common sense question?

Edited by BigTenFanboy, 26 October 2017 - 02:54 PM.


#29 hammerlockthree

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 02:58 PM

No you're right I don't question it, just pointing out that people admire the talents that they can see on the mat and ignore the ones they can't. 


Edited by hammerlockthree, 26 October 2017 - 03:00 PM.


#30 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 03:13 PM

No you're right I don't question it, just pointing out that people admire the talents that they can see on the mat and ignore the ones they can't.

Cool. Nice to see us being able to have a civil discussion. Progress!

In my earlier post I didn't mean to disrespect George Carpenter, but the fact of the matter is he is what many would consider a "room guy" and probably never would have made the lineup had Cortez not get injured. He probably is an outstanding practice partner as hes proven hes very difficult to pin. Thats something like you said many people don't see.

Edited by BigTenFanboy, 26 October 2017 - 03:14 PM.


#31 LoStNuMbEr

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 08:29 AM

I am going to ignore that last question.

 

My point is that it is naive to assume a freak athlete who is modest at learning can learn as well as a modest athlete who is good at learning. 

 

Talents aren't all in the biceps. 

 

I think the difference is that good technique is a learned skill while being a freak athlete is inherent. So with a freak athlete that doesn't have the technique nailed down, in theory its possible to teach them that technique.  Whereas someone with good technique and no athletic abilities cannot necessarily increase his athletic capacity in the same manner.  


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#32 TripNSweep

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Posted 30 October 2017 - 06:00 AM

It seemed to me from the few videos I've seen of Lesnar wrestling, that he rescued himself by being super athletic and strong. Against Neal he should have lost by more and he definitely should have lost to Hand in the NCAA finals.
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls. Contrary to what you've just seen, war is neither glamorous nor fun. There are no winners, only losers. There are no good wars, with the following exceptions: The American Revolution, World War II, and the Star Wars Trilogy. If you'd like to learn more about war, there's lots of books in your local library, many of them with cool, gory pictures.

#33 headshuck

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Posted 30 October 2017 - 06:54 AM

Doesn’t everyone “rescue” themselves with something?

#34 TripNSweep

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Posted 30 October 2017 - 08:44 AM

In a couple of instances pretty much 99% of people who aren't Brock Lesnar would have given up points where he managed to avoid getting scored on.
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls. Contrary to what you've just seen, war is neither glamorous nor fun. There are no winners, only losers. There are no good wars, with the following exceptions: The American Revolution, World War II, and the Star Wars Trilogy. If you'd like to learn more about war, there's lots of books in your local library, many of them with cool, gory pictures.

#35 Plasmodium

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Posted 30 October 2017 - 01:35 PM

Does anybody else keep tripping over the elephants trunk in this thread?

#36 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 30 October 2017 - 01:59 PM

In a couple of instances pretty much 99% of people who aren't Brock Lesnar would have given up points where he managed to avoid getting scored on.


Probably greater than 99%. More like 99.999%

It's getting redundant but Brock Lesnar is a freak of nature. The typical rules of technique didn't apply to him due to his being such a freak athlete. His size, strength, and athleticism is something you can't teach.
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#37 TripNSweep

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Posted 30 October 2017 - 04:53 PM

You definitely cannot coach the natural ability he had. However given that I don't think he would have made a world or Olympic team. Too many guys at that weight then were either just as big and strong or light years ahead in terms of ability. Or both.
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls. Contrary to what you've just seen, war is neither glamorous nor fun. There are no winners, only losers. There are no good wars, with the following exceptions: The American Revolution, World War II, and the Star Wars Trilogy. If you'd like to learn more about war, there's lots of books in your local library, many of them with cool, gory pictures.

#38 headshuck

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Posted 30 October 2017 - 05:23 PM

Yeah, I think he would have adapted to whatever level he needed to. Although while successful at the top levels of most everything he tried, his time in the NFL was short-lived.

#39 PRyan2012

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Posted 31 October 2017 - 12:00 AM

If Lesnar could not even make 3rd string in the NFL what  a freak Neal must have been to become a pro bowler and super bowl champ. And given the fact they wrestled in the NCAA finals was truly special looking back on it.



#40 BigTenFanboy

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Posted 31 October 2017 - 12:26 AM

If Lesnar could not even make 3rd string in the NFL what  a freak Neal must have been to become a pro bowler and super bowl champ. And given the fact they wrestled in the NCAA finals was truly special looking back on it.

 

The 1999 NCAA Final turned out to be two of the biggest success stories to come out of the collegiate wrestling world to make it in the mainstream world. On one side you have a future World Champion Freestyle wrestler and NFL Pro bowler, Superbowl Champion and on the other side you have a future UFC World Champion and WWE Championship Superstar wrestler. 






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