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#41 wrestlingnerd

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 05:17 AM

I agree. I’m just pointing out that he has been on the mat as often as humanly possible and some would argue more than humanly possible. His ability to recover from surgery and come back better than before is unbelievable to me.

He does need to gather some hardware. Agreed. But those who say he’s much better than his resume suggests are also probably right.
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#42 mspart

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 05:29 AM

With 10 weights now, he should get his opportunity.

 

mspart


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#43 Peso

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Posted 25 December 2017 - 06:00 PM

I wonder if he has closed the narrow thin gap between him and Jordan?  I mean, he wasn't cutting an ounce, he was recovering still somewhat.  I like 10 weights even better, but he may be hard to get out of a world line-up by anyone if he gets a taste of blood.  I too am of the camp that believes he has that special ingredient we all want, the intangible.  I say this after taking DT virtually every time they wrestled.  He has won me over.  That highlight film is pretty freakin amazing.  His heel pick to the lace is a thing of beauty, and as mentioned, what a gut!  



#44 pennsyrules

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Posted 26 December 2017 - 06:01 AM

I love Dake and have been watching him since he was a youth but it seems like he's developing a pretty good fantasy game now!  To put him ahead of Cox is certainly a fantasy based on the last 2 years.


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#45 Peso

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Posted 26 December 2017 - 10:48 PM

Man, he looks very good.



#46 sgallan

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 05:05 AM

I agree. I’m just pointing out that he has been on the mat as often as humanly possible and some would argue more than humanly possible. His ability to recover from surgery and come back better than before is unbelievable to me.

He does need to gather some hardware. Agreed. But those who say he’s much better than his resume suggests are also probably right.

 

True but the world is full of people who are better than their resumes in all the strong wrestling countries. Got to find a way. I would suggest (Taylor included) how they lost, and reacted to losses, at this level, there is a bit of a hole in their mental game. Burroughs as a comparison, he utterly tanked at the Olympics after being a golden boy. No excuses. Picked himself up again and regained his status as the champ. Dake (and Taylor) haven't shown anything like that.   
 



#47 wrestlingnerd

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 05:55 AM

I get your point on Taylor, especially after his series with Cox, but are you really going to fault Dake’s MIND for losing a best of 3 against one of the three or four Americans GOATs after wrestling through a mini-tournament?? Ridiculous argument. He had nothing left in the tank by the third match. The mind had very little to nothing to do with it. Not to mention JB is JB, so any loss to him can very easily be explained by, he’s just better.
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#48 sgallan

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 10:06 AM

Whines too much and was mentally beaten by JB to the point match three the result was a forgone conclusion. His mind game versus mere mortals.... off the charts, but he has shown he can get rattled and it costs him in matches. He has shown he can beat JB but if he doesn't win in two it is all but over.

#49 wrestlingnerd

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 11:36 AM

OK. I guess compared to one of the dozen or so best wrestlers the world has ever seen, Dake is a pusillanimous mental midget then. Because he can only win one of three and doesn't like having his face boxed in during a wrestling match.



#50 Peso

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 05:54 PM

I like his chances in a fair tournament, but our trials format is far from that.  Jordan is unbelievable.  What an American Hero.  Truly inspires me as a human being.  His star will not fade when he quits, but quit he will one day.  As that day gets closer, I think Dake has probably caught him, and has a chance to string together a few championships himself.  



#51 PRyan2012

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Posted 29 December 2017 - 02:24 AM

As much as I love JB Dake has caught him. JB is lucky they added weights. Dake almost beat him after going through the mini which in same day wrestling is huge. Dake would have beat Burroughs if not for the bye in my opinion. Dake and Taylor had two great wrestlers to beat and nearly did it. As Varner almost did in 2016. I am against the bye and in my opinion it simply is not right. But it is what it is and we are probably going to have our greatest team in our history this year. I think we are actually the favorites. I have never said that before-ever!


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#52 NJWC

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Posted 29 December 2017 - 07:01 AM

As much as I love JB Dake has caught him. JB is lucky they added weights. Dake almost beat him after going through the mini which in same day wrestling is huge. Dake would have beat Burroughs if not for the bye in my opinion. Dake and Taylor had two great wrestlers to beat and nearly did it. As Varner almost did in 2016. I am against the bye and in my opinion it simply is not right. But it is what it is and we are probably going to have our greatest team in our history this year. I think we are actually the favorites. I have never said that before-ever!


Preposterous to say a guy without a world medal has caught a guy who is the reigning world champ, with 4 of the last five world golds.
Oh, and multiple head to head wins including the most recent WTT.
Dake is awesome. He's not, and never will be, JB.

#53 AnklePicker

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Posted 29 December 2017 - 07:47 AM

As much as I love JB Dake has caught him. JB is lucky they added weights. Dake almost beat him after going through the mini which in same day wrestling is huge. Dake would have beat Burroughs if not for the bye in my opinion. Dake and Taylor had two great wrestlers to beat and nearly did it. As Varner almost did in 2016. I am against the bye and in my opinion it simply is not right. But it is what it is and we are probably going to have our greatest team in our history this year. I think we are actually the favorites. I have never said that before-ever!


I guess you're forgetting that they both competed in the US Nationals, both made the finals and Burroughs won allowing him to sit.
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#54 PRyan2012

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Posted 29 December 2017 - 05:35 PM

I guess you're forgetting that they both competed in the US Nationals, both made the finals and Burroughs won allowing him to sit.

I agree with you. However Dake won that match, (ref gift) he simply did, and then took one from JB in the best of three. They are razor close but I think the new weights gave JB a chance to beat/tie John Smith's record. Otherwise Dake would have knocked him off. Dake will not be as great as JB for the career but right now it is a dead heat with the pendulum weighing in Dake's favor but they may never wrestle again. 



#55 PRyan2012

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Posted 29 December 2017 - 05:37 PM

Preposterous to say a guy without a world medal has caught a guy who is the reigning world champ, with 4 of the last five world golds.
Oh, and multiple head to head wins including the most recent WTT.
Dake is awesome. He's not, and never will be, JB.

He has caught JB but will never match that career I agree. 



#56 WillieBoy

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Posted 30 December 2017 - 09:51 AM

I agree with you. However Dake won that match, (ref gift) he simply did, and then took one from JB in the best of three. They are razor close but I think the new weights gave JB a chance to beat/tie John Smith's record. Otherwise Dake would have knocked him off. Dake will not be as great as JB for the career but right now it is a dead heat with the pendulum weighing in Dake's favor but they may never wrestle again. 

Hey may match or beat the overall numbers but he can't do 6 in a row. Smith was magic without a lapse when it was all on the line. His signature move worked his entire freestyle career and only got better as time marched on. Burroughs blast double has slowed down and is now almost gone.

Burroughs is an all time great but John Smith is the greatest this nation has ever had. Six in a row and Master of Technique, Wrestler of the year  even beats Baumgardner's haul of hardware.



#57 wrestlingnerd

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Posted 30 December 2017 - 10:40 AM

Hey may match or beat the overall numbers but he can't do 6 in a row. Smith was magic without a lapse when it was all on the line. His signature move worked his entire freestyle career and only got better as time marched on. Burroughs blast double has slowed down and is now almost gone.

Burroughs is an all time great but John Smith is the greatest this nation has ever had. Six in a row and Master of Technique, Wrestler of the year  even beats Baumgardner's haul of hardware.

 

Also beat Sergei Beloglazov, who I consider one of the two or three best ever. It was an exhibition match and up a weight for Sergei, but that match showed me something.



#58 straggler

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Posted 30 December 2017 - 12:32 PM

I guess you're forgetting that they both competed in the US Nationals, both made the finals and Burroughs won allowing him to sit.

Except Dake outwrestled him and wins without the ref's favoritism. 



#59 straggler

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Posted 30 December 2017 - 12:47 PM

Whines too much and was mentally beaten by JB to the point match three the result was a forgone conclusion. His mind game versus mere mortals.... off the charts, but he has shown he can get rattled and it costs him in matches. He has shown he can beat JB but if he doesn't win in two it is all but over.

The problem with this is viewpoint is that it fails to recognize how absurd our qualifying system is currently. Guys like Dake are getting screwed, so they have a very legitimate reason to whine. And as much as I have praised JB's mental toughness, the field is always titled in his favor during qualifying and he does not hestitate to take full advantage because he knows he will get away with it. I guess that is being smart. So Dake has to endure a direct physical disadvantage, knows he will lose every 50/50 and probably 60/40 call, knows his opponent will be given a huge lattitude to put his hands in his eyes, knows that if he even thinks about taking a backward step he will be put on the clock while other guys get to flee all the way across the mat with no consequences, etc. The whole affair is a mental beating. But the third match was just physical exhaustion. 



#60 Billyhoyle

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Posted 30 December 2017 - 06:27 PM

The problem with this is viewpoint is that it fails to recognize how absurd our qualifying system is currently. Guys like Dake are getting screwed, so they have a very legitimate reason to whine. And as much as I have praised JB's mental toughness, the field is always titled in his favor during qualifying and he does not hestitate to take full advantage because he knows he will get away with it. I guess that is being smart. So Dake has to endure a direct physical disadvantage, knows he will lose every 50/50 and probably 60/40 call, knows his opponent will be given a huge lattitude to put his hands in his eyes, knows that if he even thinks about taking a backward step he will be put on the clock while other guys get to flee all the way across the mat with no consequences, etc. The whole affair is a mental beating. But the third match was just physical exhaustion.

Dake is not getting screwed. You can say that he's unlucky being the 2nd best wrestler in a system that only rewards the best. However, that's the game he signed up for.
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