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MSU158

Cole Konrad

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You are thinking of domination in the wrong context.  Konrad wasn't a 157lber, shooting sweep singles and lighting up the scoreboard.  A 300lber cutting to make 285 doesn't naturally move that way.  What they DO do, is hold position and control the mat.  He did that as well as ANY 285 I can remember!

 

I understand how HWTs wrestle. He was never dominating Mocco

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I understand how HWTs wrestle. He was never dominating Mocco

There was a pretty telling interview with Mocco talking about how hard it was to wrestle Konrad his Senior Year.  He was even bringing in OkState offensive linemen to try to move someone of his size.  Mocco KNEW that if he opened up on Konrad, he was in deep trouble.   So, he mainly played the wait for a mistake game and the one time he opened up, he ended up on his back.

 

Mocco was NEVER going to beat Konrad that year.  To me, that is domination!

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He never medaled; he beat Mocco, who never medaled. Snyder has 3 world titles; he beat Gwiz who has a world medal.

 

With what Coon was able to do against Snyder, I am further convinced that Konrad may be the best 285 DI has had.  

 

He had one of the all-time greats in Mocco at his weight(soph and junior yrs. with Rowlands and Cummins as a frosh) and after losing a heartbreaker to him as a sophomore, he dominated him the following year and then dominated the field as a Senior.

 

By his Junior year, he had matured to a point where he was bigger and stronger than everyone and was still as mobile.  I know we are going back over 10 years, but was he even taken down once over his last 2 seasons?

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...if you tell Kyle Snyder to --A. not worry about staying anywhere close to 213 pounds for freestyle purposes  B. let him train for six months= C. he majors Coon, Conrad, Tommy and "theThug"Mocco.  might even pin Mocco--- Kyle at 250-255 would be unbeatable.....

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...if you tell Kyle Snyder to --A. not worry about staying anywhere close to 213 pounds for freestyle purposes  B. let him train for six months= C. he majors Coon, Conrad, Tommy and "theThug"Mocco.  might even pin Mocco--- Kyle at 250-255 would be unbeatable.....

No way he majors Konrad

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...if you tell Kyle Snyder to --A. not worry about staying anywhere close to 213 pounds for freestyle purposes  B. let him train for six months= C. he majors Coon, Conrad, Tommy and "theThug"Mocco.  might even pin Mocco--- Kyle at 250-255 would be unbeatable.....

Kyle at 250-255 would NOT be close to his optimal weight.  The guy is about as muscle bound as he could be.  I do not see him heavier than 230 and being healthy.  Not one bit.  And majoring?  LOL.  Any bigger and he loses some of his quickness.  He already doesn't turn people.  So, you think a FATTER(that is the only way he gets to 250-255) Snyder gets about 6-8 takedowns on those guys?????

 

 

Edited to add:  He is 5'11.  250-255 would NOT benefit him in the LEAST!

Edited by MSU158

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The simple truth is, Freestyle DOES NOT transition smoothly into Folkstyle.  Add in that he is a tweener in the biggest weight range and his takedown only abilities don't take him nearly as far.  Coon winning wasn't an anomaly and Snyder gaining weight isn't going to magically change that.  His style and body type doesn't match up well with guys weighing 285.  Pretty simple.

 

Is he a better overall wrestler. Sure.  Is he a better 285lber?  Compared to Coon?  Slightly.  Compared to Konrad?  I don't think so.

Edited by MSU158

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...if you tell Kyle Snyder to --A. not worry about staying anywhere close to 213 pounds for freestyle purposes  B. let him train for six months= C. he majors Coon, Conrad, Tommy and "theThug"Mocco.  might even pin Mocco--- Kyle at 250-255 would be unbeatable.....

Except he loses one of his greatest assets, conditioning.  I doubt being 25 lbs heavier would help with the style he wrestles.  

 

Now if you just made his body magically 10% bigger and taller then yes, he handles all of those guys.  Probably not by pin since he has no top game, but he crushes them all.  Snyder is out of this world and is the best.  The fact that he can't walk around a blown up 225 and beat guys who walk around at 300 is not a knock. 

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He never medaled; he beat Mocco, who never medaled. Snyder has 3 world titles; he beat Gwiz who has a world medal.

The international weight limit when Konrad wrestled was 264.  If your argument is that Gwiz and Snyder are better than 264 lb Konrad then I agree.  But 285 lb Konrad with top and bottom wrestling has little to do with results from a 264 lb freestyle era.

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I remember him throwing Mocco around to his back fondly. Never was a Mocco fan, I remember him at the Ironman wrestling a kid from St Eds who was not even an average HVY ...Mocco did his stare down jersey shore act and hit a couple potentially dangerous moves 1 he kept cranking on the arm in a bar and the ref had to stop it physically. I mean there is no need for that, he clearly was ions better than this kid. Not to mention the fact what was Mocco almost 20 when he graduated?? Konrad became my favorite wrestler for a long while after he slapped him in the head a few times ..then finished it off by tossing him around for the stick!

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I remember him throwing Mocco around to his back fondly. Never was a Mocco fan, I remember him at the Ironman wrestling a kid from St Eds who was not even an average HVY ...Mocco did his stare down jersey shore act and hit a couple potentially dangerous moves 1 he kept cranking on the arm in a bar and the ref had to stop it physically. I mean there is no need for that, he clearly was ions better than this kid. Not to mention the fact what was Mocco almost 20 when he graduated?? Konrad became my favorite wrestler for a long while after he slapped him in the head a few times ..then finished it off by tossing him around for the stick!

Watch the FLO special, and I think you may be a bit more understanding as to why Mocco was the way he was.....

 

 

Edited to add:  Also, if you watch it you will get to see he is actually a pretty likeable guy and father!

Edited by MSU158

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Watch the FLO special, and I think you may be a bit more understanding as to why Mocco was the way he was.....

 

 

Edited to add:  Also, if you watch it you will get to see he is actually a pretty likeable guy and father!

 

Sometimes the guys who are bullies on the mat are only bullies on the mat. For example, Metcalf is actually a pretty cool guy, but if the only reference you have for him is the kid who threw his headgear and charged Caldwell...well, it's bound to hurt your opinion of him. I disliked him strongly for years after that, but after I started following his Twitter I realized he's just a blue collar guy who let his emotions get away with him, plus he's a smart, decent, hardworking guy.

 

We all did stupid stuff when we were young and full of piss and vinegar, didn't we? I know I certainly did.

Edited by TobusRex

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Sometimes the guys who are bullies on the mat are only bullies on the mat. For example, Metcalf is actually a pretty cool guy, but if the only reference you have for him is the kid who threw his headgear and charged Caldwell...well, it's bound to hurt your opinion of him. I disliked him strongly for years after that, but after I started following his Twitter I realized he's just a blue collar guy who let his emotions get away with him, plus he's a smart, decent, hardworking guy.

 

We all did stupid stuff when we were young and full of piss and vinegar, didn't we? I know I certainly did.

 

 

I hear ya ...But a lot of those who disliked Metcalf I think was more directed at Brands, they're just Iowa haters for life. Metcalf experienced a major tragedy himself losing his brother. Metcalfs shove at the end of the Caldwell match was more out of frustration than trying to be a Bully like Mocco. Trust me he was cranking on this kids arm and the ref had to literally get down on the mat and stop him, and this kid was not good at all, nor was he cocky, Mocco was probably 19 and a half years old and this kid was probably a 17 year old junior to top it off. Mocco did this stuff every time I saw him compete basically in high school...Funny he wasn't doing it to Konrad while flying through the air to get stuck. Personally I never tried to bully an opponent I was clearly better than .....I was taught differently than that. 

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I remember him throwing Mocco around to his back fondly. Never was a Mocco fan, I remember him at the Ironman wrestling a kid from St Eds who was not even an average HVY ...Mocco did his stare down jersey shore act and hit a couple potentially dangerous moves 1 he kept cranking on the arm in a bar and the ref had to stop it physically. I mean there is no need for that, he clearly was ions better than this kid. Not to mention the fact what was Mocco almost 20 when he graduated?? Konrad became my favorite wrestler for a long while after he slapped him in the head a few times ..then finished it off by tossing him around for the stick!

 

.... we were at the Worlds in Vegas, waiting in line to get into the venue-- JerseySteve promptly walked to the front of the line and walked in--

no need to wait when you are that ugly-- if it would have been at the grocery and he had too many items in the express line, I would have said something...but I wanted to watch wrestling and he would have broken me in half......

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Watch the FLO special, and I think you may be a bit more understanding as to why Mocco was the way he was.....

 

 

Edited to add: Also, if you watch it you will get to see he is actually a pretty likeable guy and father!

Steve’s a great guy, a great dad. The image many have of him is completely false.

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Konrad beats Coon 10 out of 10.  Coon had a single very specific advantage over Snyder that would be a disadvantage against Konrad.  The ability to defend leg attacks from a smaller man and be larger is not something that would help you against Konrad. 

 

Konrad is the biggest and baddest NCAA heavyweight of the weight class limit era.  That doesn't mean he is in Snyder's league as a wrestler.  

Why do you say this. Konrad lost twice to Rowlands at the US Open and WTT pretty easily. I don't think the matches were that close. He then went MMA because he was not going to sniff making the team against Rowlands, Tervel and Sigman who he also lost to. But he could beat Mocco. I don't think he would have beat Coon.  

Edited by PRyan2012

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