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Billyhoyle

Rule idea: push out

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Some people want to add the push out to college wrestling. I tend to be in that camp, but even if you’re not, how about the following:

 

Pushouts get you 1 point in OT. This will help avoid the drawn out/stalling OTs we see, where it can come down to who can stall from neutral and then force a scramble from top in the 30/30 ride out. This way, they are forced to wrestle in the first OT.

Edited by Billyhoyle

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Some people want to add the push out to college wrestling. I tend to be in that camp, but even if you’re not, how about the following:

 

Pushouts get you 1 point in OT. This will help avoid the drawn out/stalling OTs we see, where it can come down to who can stall from neutral and then force a scramble from top in the 30/30 ride out. This way, they are forced to wrestle in the first OT.

I like it. I am all for anything to do with adding push outs to college. It’s made freestyle so much better. Another idea might be to hit the guy who stepped out with stalling. Two push outs equals a point. That way it wouldn’t be quite as impactful as in freestyle but would still be enough to keep action in the center and make the out of bounds rules way more cut and dry.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Some people want to add the push out to college wrestling. I tend to be in that camp, but even if you’re not, how about the following:

Pushouts get you 1 point in OT. This will help avoid the drawn out/stalling OTs we see, where it can come down to who can stall from neutral and then force a scramble from top in the 30/30 ride out. This way, they are forced to wrestle in the first OT.

If you're going to add push out to over time, add it to everything. I dont like the idea of scoring working 1 way during regulation and another way during overtime.

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Just give a point for a pushout. Copy the freestyle rule.

 

There is way too much ambiguity when it comes to whether the person was pushed, stalling, or it was just action. This leads to refs deciding matches.

 

Also, wrestling at it’s core has to do with control. If you can control the May and force your opponent out, you should be rewarded.

 

It will lead to more action, less controversy and better freestyle

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I very much like the idea of a step out point in folkstyle. Not only for the sense of keeping action on the mat, but in terms of time. You eliminate a lot of dead time in coming back to reset. May not seem like much over the course of one match, but cumulative over the course of a full day or two day tournament...

Edited by Lurker

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Absolutely yes to pushouts - OOB stalling is a total failure.  DO NOT introduce any new rules that rely on "ref discretion" - they simply do not and will never work.  Have hard-set rules such as the five count, danger, etc.  Refs do not and never will want to call points on a judgement call to decide the match.  That will NEVER change, so stop trying in that department. 

 

I'm not blaming the refs at all but I'm tired of the "if only refs will call...." arguments.  Stop, refs don't want to make the call.  They never will.  It's the rules that need adjusting, not every single wrestling referee.  If a ref makes or doesn't make a stall/judgment call to decide a match, there is ALWAYS hatred.  Don't give them the option, they like it and the fans will accept it.  Well, mostly for the fans. 

 

I'd much prefer TDs be 3 points and pushouts be one, so they aren't the same after an escape.  But I'll accept either option. 

Edited by Gantry

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It can’t be called the push out. Even in Freestyle you can’t simply “push” your opponent off the mat. There has to be technical wrestling involved. Calling it a “step out”, most times, correctly penalizes the guy with his back to the edge and rewards the aggressor in that situation.

 

 

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I actually really enjoy the scrambles that happen at the edge of the mat.  Some of the best shot defense I've seen has occured near the edge.  The scramble this year between Zahid and Hall was one of the best I have seen in a long time and that would've never happened if there was a pushout rule.

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I actually really enjoy the scrambles that happen at the edge of the mat. Some of the best shot defense I've seen has occured near the edge. The scramble this year between Zahid and Hall was one of the best I have seen in a long time and that would've never happened if there was a pushout rule.

Extremely valid point.

 

But I think big picture, you see a lot more using the line to defend than you see good scrambles. So while I agree the current rule allowed that particular scramble to happen, overall I think a step out rule would be better.

 

Then again, if utilized just as it is in freestyle, it only scores if they go out on their feet. So maybe best avenue is implement it just as is, combined with current out of bounds rule when down on the mat. Best of both worlds?

Edited by Lurker

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Extremely valid point.

 

But I think big picture, you see a lot more using the line to defend than you see good scrambles. So while I agree the current rule allowed that particular scramble to happen, overall I think a step out rule would be better.

 

Then again, if utilized just as it is in freestyle, it only scores if they go out on their feet. So maybe best avenue is implement it just as is, combined with current out of bounds rule when down on the mat. Best of both worlds?

Yes exactly.

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Extremely valid point.

 

But I think big picture, you see a lot more using the line to defend than you see good scrambles. So while I agree the current rule allowed that particular scramble to happen, overall I think a step out rule would be better.

 

Then again, if utilized just as it is in freestyle, it only scores if they go out on their feet. So maybe best avenue is implement it just as is, combined with current out of bounds rule when down on the mat. Best of both worlds?

 

Really nice idea right there!  

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I actually really enjoy the scrambles that happen at the edge of the mat.  Some of the best shot defense I've seen has occured near the edge.  The scramble this year between Zahid and Hall was one of the best I have seen in a long time and that would've never happened if there was a pushout rule.

 

that was a scramble for the ages........ props to both wrestlers.

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I actually really enjoy the scrambles that happen at the edge of the mat.  Some of the best shot defense I've seen has occured near the edge.  The scramble this year between Zahid and Hall was one of the best I have seen in a long time and that would've never happened if there was a pushout rule.

Guys could still scramble, just inside the circle where wrestling should take place. 

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I believe to make it happen, we need a zone indicated on the mat like freestyle. We also need mat sizes to be consistent and all matches need two refs

and we need second ref to be better than DF’s description (that was pretty funny post )

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OH GOD NOT THIS AGAIN.

 

IT"S NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN IN FOLKSTYLE.

 

 

Hate to shout but man this stupid idea will just not go away.

I’m not saying it will happen, but why so confident it won’t? And why is it stupid?

 

HS already has fleeing the mat which isn’t terribly far off from a push out rule. It’s just not enforced very well and involves subjectivity, which a push out rule would eliminate.

 

And it’s not like pretty significant rule changes haven’t happened. The 4-point near fall was pretty significant - essentially a 66% increase in NF points/second compared to 3 points for 5 seconds. Heck the rule not requiring a singlet is pretty significant.

Edited by 1032004

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OH GOD NOT THIS AGAIN.

 

IT"S NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN IN FOLKSTYLE.

 

 

Hate to shout but man this stupid idea will just not go away.

The point of my suggestion is that it should only be implemented in overtime as part of the sudden death rule in order to shorten matches and force action.

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OH GOD NOT THIS AGAIN. 

 

IT"S NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN IN FOLKSTYLE. 

 

 

Hate to shout but man this stupid idea will just not go away. 

 

Perhaps you're stupid for calling it stupid.

 

It's been wonderful in freestyle. I love it.

 

Implement it now.  It will work in folkstyle. How could it not?

 

And it will get our wrestlers better prepared for freestyle. 

 

It won't take away scrambles, but will initiate more of them. 

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With folk out of bounds rules another point that isn’t mentioned much is that the four corners of the mat allow for more area to wrestle than do the sides. Refs tend to call the wrestlers out sooner on the sides and let the action go longer in the corners, especially if the mat is adjacent to the hardwood. A step-out rule largely solves this.

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