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NJDan

How Good are Women

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It's not an irrelevant or sexist question. When I was in college, a woman could make the woman's hockey team having never played hockey before. I doubt that's true anymore. Women still cannot beat men in hockey, but the level of their play has improved. It's a fair question to discuss how good women wrestlers are compared to lower level men.

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Liberals want to scream that the sexes are equal across the board.

The best in the world would get dominated by solid Hs wrestlers.

It’s not just strength either. To the person who said the most skilled American wrestler is female, lol.

 

The talent pool is tiny. There simply aren’t many female wrestlers. Few competitors means weak overall talent.

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Most of you who say that the average high school kid is just as good as the world team member or world medalist you're pretty spot on.  I had this discussion with a women's wrestler who at one point was ranked in the top 5 at her weight, and she flat out told me that the average high school kid at her weight would beat her. She said that if she wrestled an average high school kid a weight below her it would probably be more competitive.  There's a reason that there have been VERY few cases of women playing in major men's professional sports.  The only 2 I can think of who ever got a real shot at it.  

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Most of you who say that the average high school kid is just as good as the world team member or world medalist you're pretty spot on.  I had this discussion with a women's wrestler who at one point was ranked in the top 5 at her weight, and she flat out told me that the average high school kid at her weight would beat her. She said that if she wrestled an average high school kid a weight below her it would probably be more competitive.  There's a reason that there have been VERY few cases of women playing in major men's professional sports.  The only 2 I can think of who ever got a real shot at it.  

 

When was this?  And "top 5 (in the US I presume)" is different than an Olympic Champion.  As mentioned, Maroulis was already beating "average high school kids" when she was in high school, so I think it's safe to say she would still beat them now, with 10 additional years of experience.   Especially in freestyle where most of the average to above average to even some very good wrestlers don't have much experience.

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When was this?  And "top 5 (in the US I presume)" is different than an Olympic Champion.  As mentioned, Maroulis was already beating "average high school kids" when she was in high school, so I think it's safe to say she would still beat them now, with 10 additional years of experience.   Especially in freestyle where most of the average to above average to even some very good wrestlers don't have much experience.

 

About 6 years ago.  And I don't want to specifically say who it was, but top 5 and a handful of international medals is how good she was.  I don't think Maroulis would get easily handled by an average high school kid, but she probably would against a good to great state placer from a tough state.  If she wrestled somebody like RBY it wouldn't even be close.  

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Liberals want to scream that the sexes are equal across the board.

The best in the world would get dominated by solid Hs wrestlers.

It’s not just strength either. To the person who said the most skilled American wrestler is female, lol.

 

The talent pool is tiny. There simply aren’t many female wrestlers. Few competitors means weak overall talent.

What are you talking about? I’m a liberal and I’ve literally never heard that claim from a rational person. You seem to have an image of what a liberal is in your mind and decided to argue with your fictitious creation.

 

No rational person claims that women and men are identical. The claim is that women and men should be given equal opportunity.

 

Do you also think women are bad at math?

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At the last meeting of the liberals that I attended, we discussed why men still can't give birth. We unanimously decided that women are being held back by the patriarchal oligarchy and men are now counter productive to society. #metoo

 

I am actually a bit skeptical that a HS kid can beat HM. When she is competing, the eye test says she more than meets the physicality threshold for wrestling and surely her technique and drive is superior.

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Women wrestle differently than men.  Just like they do about everything different from men.   Where they are now compared to where they were 10-15 years ago is light years of difference.  I have noticed a great deal of technical competence from the women that I didn't see 10-15 years ago.  That is really the measure we should have.  Being that there is a definite strength difference and body composition difference and many other differences, they really should not be compared to the men at all.  They should be compared to themselves. 

 

mspart

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What are you talking about? I’m a liberal and I’ve literally never heard that claim from a rational person. You seem to have an image of what a liberal is in your mind and decided to argue with your fictitious creation.

 

No rational person claims that women and men are identical. The claim is that women and men should be given equal opportunity.

 

Do you also think women are bad at math?

I don’t know much about women, politics or math, but I can still remember my first short pants learnin’ lesson. Way back in the day, when growing up in Wyoming, I got soundly schooled on a creek bank, by a pal, at the age of five. That’s when little “Petey” Harmon (the undisputed boss of the sand box) took her tiny plastic shovel and put knots on my noggin faster than I could count ‘em or wipe ‘em off. She apparently gave herself the opportunity to vent and me an equal opportunity to lose my first argument. To this day, 60 years later… I haven’t forgotten that message.

Edited by OKnowwhut

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I am actually a bit skeptical that a HS kid can beat HM. When she is competing, the eye test says she more than meets the physicality threshold for wrestling and surely her technique and drive is superior.

I have watched it happen on numerous occasions.  I would agree her drive far exceeds that of highschoolers, even other elite athletes.  Same with her preparation.

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To try and understand what equivalent level the top women would be in the men's divisions. Isn't that obvious?

You of all people should know that it is impossible to simultaneously know a wrestler’s gender and level. The act of measuring one makes it impossible to measure the other. Edited by Billyhoyle

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Honestly, I don't care if Maroulis, or Gray, can't beat the local high school kid, we should be celebrating the fact that we have some great female stars like the aforementioned Maroulis or Gray.

Should females be given equal opportunity? Sure, despite the fact that there are likely thousands of male wrestlers for every female wrestler.

Should we pretend that they are equal In any way? THat their accomplishments are comparable to men? Come on.

The best in the world wouldn’t place in the HS tournaments in the better states.

There is a TINY talent pool in which these women compete. How many junior wrestlers are there in PA? 10k? 50k? How about in CA? 100k? 200k?

Now how many junior female wrestlers are there in the world? Less than either of those states I would guess.

 

I’ve coached two kids that train at a local RTC that has a few females come in occasionally. They really won’t even roll with the better Hs kids. They get killed.

 

It’s cool they have a path to compete, but the “Helen Maroukis is the best wrestler in the US” line is absurd.

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According to the NWCA there are almost 15,000 female HS wrestlers in the US. So I’d bet there are more than 10k female junior wrestlers in the world.

How many more male HS wresters? 200k. 500k?

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