Why is our par terre so bad?

[CoachWrestling 327]

What are the technical deficiencies that are stopping the U.S. from having good par terre?

[LJB 1,626]

folk

[boconnell 1,503]

folk

Yep.  Whether you like or hate folk there is no denying it's the reason we are awful in par terre.  

[de4856 361]

I have to think it's because we don't train it enough, and we don't have some of the technical skills some overseas wrestlers have.

[spladle 179]

It isn't a folk vs free issue, we just do not place a high priority on par terre scoring.

[Lurker 1,475]

It isn't a folk vs free issue, we just do not place a high priority on par terre scoring.

It's not necessarily that it's folk vs free, it's just that we split time between the two while other nations don't. While we're training spirals and bars, escapes, hip heists, other nations still training guts laces and defending them. The hours add up...

[boconnell 1,503]

It isn't a folk vs free issue, we just do not place a high priority on par terre scoring.

It is a folk vs free thing.  Being good on the mat in the 2 sports is completely opposite. 

 

The goal of bottom in freestyle is a violation in Folk (textbook stalling).  The goal of top in freestyle is a violation in folk (locking hands to start almost every top move in freestyle). 

 

The goal of bottom in folkstyle (getting away) puts you in huge danger in free.  The goals on top in folkstyle (control on top and control when he's on his back) has no value in freestyle.  

 

Muscle memory is hard to overwrite, and the majority of our guys were folk first and freestyle later.  The key is to allow elite guys to develop FS first or at least simultaneously.  Almost like how much easier it is for kids to learn foreign languages because the pathways in their brains are more flexible.  

[wrestlingnerd 2,755]

I agree it's a folk vs. free issue.

 

That said, Dake and DT have damn good par terre, so the shtty par terre epidemic isn't absolute in the US.

[jcjcjc 114]

I try to coach tilts and guts the same way and reference the other when teaching either. It'd be a fun USA Wrestling project to be involved with to come up with a guide for cross referencing skills in folkstyle and freestyle.

 

I feel like we could make better connections between the "stand alone" skills of folk and free, but it is difficult. 

 

Tilts, stand-ups, sit-outs, ankle rolls,

 

guts, lifts, hiding legs on single finishes, chest wraps, laces, 

[LJB 1,626]

the problem is folk allows kids to get away with not finishing clean (can get you killed in free) and the technical aspects of top and bottom par terre are incredibly critical with the limited time you get on the mat in the real styles... you have to get on it quick and effeciently... when you dont train that all day err day it puts americans at a disadvantage when wrestling internationally...

 

plus, it never ceases to amaze me at hopw a bunch of coaches think they understand free/greco and clearly they dont have a clue, but, ego and whatnot keeps them from really continuing to learn, which, is essential for superior coaching 

[jcjcjc 114]

Finishing clean in freestyle is the biggest factor for improving folkstyle if you are playing that game to promote freestyle. 

A mediocre freestyler can expose a good shot not finished quickly. In folkstyle you need a great finish to finish a shot against a pretty good scrambler.