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Eagle26

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The number of combined points in Nahshon Garrett's semifinal and final! That's crazy! You don't see that in a folkstyle tournament!

Yeah the lack of defense is disappointing, I thought he had a pretty high ceiling a few years ago, but it's becoming more apparent he's alright giving up 10 to attempt to score 11, and it's just not how you win at this level.

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I still think his ceiling is high but he needs to have a more strategic approach. When you can score nearly at will like he can, there's no need to get into a gunslinging match. He could use a page out of JB's book. It's weird to see him throw caution to the wind like this because that was not the way he wrestled in college at all. He had very solid defense and match strategy then.

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It's hard to blame Nahshon for letting loose after what he's been through. In the OTT semis he was up 3-0 very early to Tony Ramos, sat on the lead, and lost on a 1-pt stalling penalty with ~10 seconds left in the match. He could very well have been in the Olympics if he hadn't shut down his offense. Next year, up 4-0 early to Alan Waters at WTTs, wrestles defensively, and loses the match.

 

Maybe Nahshon is taking it a bit too far by letting the points fly - he should balance his offense with defense and controlling the center of the mat - but you can sort of see why he might want his scoring to do the talking, rather than defend and rely on subjective passivity calls.

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but you can sort of see why he might want his scoring to do the talking, rather than defend and rely on subjective passivity calls.

Well in no way do I advocate him taking the Ramos approach and depend on scoring last yadda yadda, his offense will always be undeniable, but i think if he just took the "I know I can get 4 takedowns over 6 minutes" approach, that guys like James G. do, he would benefit greatly. 

But it feels like his mindset is "We're in neutral I'm incredible, you're not, watch how many times I can score on you' 

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I can remember when people on this forum griped about lack of attacks or fear of attacking.

We abhorred the lack of scoring.

We yearned for the 70's when scores were 17-12.

 

Now we say it's lack of defense.

So basically we have never had any.

Until we got conservative.

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GockeS, there's a big difference between a  guy who wins 2-2, criteria, 1-1 criteria, 2-1, 1-0 shot clock point..... and a guy who puts up football scores. I don't hear anyone saying Team USA should try to eke out 1-pointers while staying in perfect position for 6 minutes. But if you watched Garrett at the US Open (and frankly, at any point in his senior FS career so far), you'd be un-American to suggest he should keep doing what he's doing. He may be the most talented guy at the weight, but he's not going to do squat internationally unless he decides to sprawl and handfight once in a blue moon.

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I can remember when people on this forum griped about lack of attacks or fear of attacking.

We abhorred the lack of scoring.

We yearned for the 70's when scores were 17-12.

 

Now we say it's lack of defense.

So basically we have never had any.

Until we got conservative.

The rules were different back then, of course. Significantly.

 

If you weren't pressing the attack, either a stalling flag and/or par terre was indicated.

You could get DQ'd if you were stalling. Four or five flags,and you were dunbar.

Now they just assign ( somewhat puzzling at times) a shot clock.

 

Matches were 3-3-3, and people got tired,and that contributed to high scores as well.

Because the matches were so long ( 1980 ), and the threat of getting DQ'd was real,high scores were commonplace.

Personally, I had a match that was 13-9, and both of us were on our last stall.

SWEATY!!!!  Yet, had to keep pummeling.

 

Also,TDs were worth 1 lousy point, unless you went feet to back. Then it might be 2 or 3, depending upon which year it was. To get the 4th point for amplitude was RARE.  And...a "hand to hand" lace leg was only worth 1 point.

 

At one time, we couldn't use the same turn consecutively, which caused us to learn more than one turn.

 

Still, someone scoring 20 in a match ( or both in the teens or more) was NOT uncommon. There were no tech falls for quite some time-not sure which year they changed it.

I watched Andre Metzger put up 63 on a guy in 1979 in Madison WI at the Open.

 

John Smith, in my opinion, helped change the game from "always keeping contact" to his general aggressiveness allowed him to stay caution-free while a a distance. His influence is still evident in today's neutral position, though I'm sure most of today's wrestlers have no idea.

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all good points.

but what I'm saying is that people wanted more scoring. like those old days.

 

four or five flags? did we see that many called in the entire tourney? 

 

and with one point TD's they must have had to shoot quite a bit.

Edited by GockeS

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