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Housebuye

Junior Worlds 2018

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Can we talk about Mekhi Lewis winning a world title in his third freestyle tournament ever? I was on the fence with this kid before but am now a believer. He’s a legit title threat at NCAA’s.

Is this a joke? Third freestyle tournament ever? Holy crap. Pls confirm this is true. I have a hard time believing it. Freaking amazing if true.

Edited by nom

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First was Vegas, 2nd was UWW Junior Trials, third was the World Championships. 

As far as the stream, that's provided to Track by UWW. It's the responsibility of the company producing the stream to provide it to its foreign vendors. TW isn't the only spot that receives the stream from UWW. There's other countries where the streams are sent that aren't through UWW directly. There are several points of failure in the chain, in this instance, the origin point cracked streams around the world, not just on TW. The overall stream quality sport-wide, is a moving target. Having essentially created USAW's full streaming stuff in 2009, minimizing points of failure is crucial, but sometimes human error and a big foot can cause big problems even as simple as the problem that caused them. If someone kick's Flo's main pipe, for example, and it takes them 15 seconds to realize it, plug it back in and restart the streams ... that's part of it. We aren't talking about multi-million-dollar production teams providing this. 

But yes, it's a different topic to spend time on. I've been on the inside, outside and every side of it. It's quite a different discussion every single instance, because it's never the same issue. 

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On 9/22/2018 at 7:51 PM, ConnorsDad said:

I was wondering that myself. As more and more countries make headways into wrestling and women's wrestling becomes more and more popular, the Japanese are dominating even more than they did 10 years ago. If they were a men's team the amount of publicity they get at least on this message board would be 10 times what it is now. Taking what another poster started, giving them 10 points for a pin, I looked at all of Japan's matches from the recently-completed junior worlds. In 39 matches they scored 356 points while surrendering 35. They went 35-4. 6 gold medals, a silver and three bronze. Even the upper weights which are their weakest area still saw them get a gold and three bronze in the top four classes. Their 6 gold medalist avg. scores were 10-0, 10-0, 9-0, 8-0, 11-1 & 12-1. Even the non-gold medalists had avg. scores of 9-1, 8-2, 7-2 & 8-2. All of this against the best in the worlds. Ungoddamnbelievable!

Dominating for sure.  Actually, all of the wrestling nations around the world had a womens freestyle camp this year in Japan right after the Womens World Cup in Japan.   I remember seeing a lot of video and here's a youtube video:

 

 

If you watched the video about Yoshida and Icho during the Rio Olympics, almost ALL of the top womens wrestlers(sr to cadets) all train at the Ajinomoto National training center in Japan.  As we all say...Iron sharpens iron.

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Still going through the matches. Only saw some of the medal matches live.

Couple of quick comments: Magomedov looked fantastic dominating the 97kg bracket. Really strong, lightening quick and black belt freestyle technique. Almost like another Sadulaev.

Congrats to the "freestyle rookie" Lewis on his gold medal run. Thought his post tournament interview on track was hilarious. Really enjoyed what he had to say. 

 

Ok, since Jason Bryant posts here with us, gotta give him props for another excellent job with the play-by-play and commentary.

 

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Interesting note:

Russia beat the USA 182-115

We had a fantastic tournament. 3rd best ever for junior freestyle. With that said, if we performed to our absolute best (like we did last year in both juniors and seniors)

57kg

fix winning is the best case scenario. He did it last year, he was just sht this year. Maybe the Russian would’ve beaten him in the finals, but I think it’s reasonable to give Fix the win 

Russia 177 (Russian loses in finals, -5)

USA 125 (+10 for Fix gold from bronze)

61, 65 - unrealistic to medal here  we had our 4th stringer at 61. Femas is a Greco guy  Yianni would’ve been a gold contender  in fact (no offensive Gomez), Vito and Yianni here would’ve been two gold contenders. I can’t include any additional points though  

70 Berge got smoked by the Russian  he did about as  as he could. Props, but no extra points

74 can’t do better than gold  Congrats 2019 NCAA 165 champ!

79 Brooks wrestled really well, even in his loss  he clearly can beat the Japanese guy (who is insanely good btw - hope we see him again)  

Russia 177

USA 130 (+5 Brooks gold)

86 Deprez was solid. He is a very good wrestler but realistically wasn’t one of the best guys in the tournament. No points

92 Warner way underperformed. He was penciled in to medal and was a dark horse gold. Maybe he is overhyped, maybe it was a bad draw. He showed he is at least on the level for the Azeri guy, who is pretty good. I feel ok with giving Warner a bronze as his ceiling based on previous results  

Russia 177

USA 145 (0 to bronze, +15)

 

97 kg - Elam way overperformed. He put himself on the map. Maybe Kerklevit would’ve won gold, but that Russian guy is world class. I honestly think he could medal at worlds with the right draw. I’m glad it worked out with Elam there because we got to see a new guy get recognition and he helped the team. No extra points here  

125 kg - Gable made a dumb mistake that he will never make again  this is his first ever international loss. Everyone makes mistakes. Everyone loses. I don’t know the guy but I get the impression he is incredibly mentally tough and will use this as motivation  If they wrestle the tournament again today, Gable takes gold without ever being in danger of losing

Russia 167 (-10 for gold moving to bronze. Still gave him bronze, could be minus 15 if he placed 5th)

USA 164 (Gable scored 6, now 25 +19)

It’s late and I don’t want them check my math but it seems like even with a best case scenario for the US, we were still going to love to Russia most likely. They had an absolutely insane tournament. They went 5 for 6 in the finals and 1 for 3 for bronze. They had one weight score only 2 points. Other than that, they all showed up. Most of their team made the finals. 

 

Even so, with our best team, we could’ve won 

57

Fix or Lee - both possible gold 

61

Fix, Arujao or Gomez - all gold contenders 

65

Yianni - two time cadet champ and NCAA true freshman champ...he clearly jumped levels since winning cadets  gold contender for sure  

70

Berge - not sure we can improve on this guy right now

74 

Lewis...gold

79

Brooks - Gold

86

Duprez 

92

Warner, but he shows up

97

Elam or Kerklevit - Kerk is a gold contender, minimum silver 

125

Gable

Thags a team with 7 pontential finalists and 9 potential medalists, all of whom have world medals now (besides Gomez). 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, pennsyrules said:

What is the difference between junior world championship and U23? Is either more prestigious?  We saw the Rutgers kid win a gold and he came up short at NcAa.

Junior worlds is more prestigious at this point, because we have a track record of junior world champs having some level of success at seniors. We know the level of the guys there. Also, countries tend to send their best person under 20. For U23s, most countries don’t send their best, because their best is on the world team. In the US, many are on the national team and don’t even go to U23 trials. 

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Thanks for the info.  One could argue that when you open up the U23 to kids three years older, you bring in more competition , no?  I get that the world team members (for us, it would only be Snyder, right?) would be excluded, but why wouldn't everyone else compete in the U23?

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U23 is just a rebadged university, yes?

 

everyone who knows a little about a little knows universities was an also ran... still wrestling, but, not the tip...

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Well in beginning in 2013, when we had a multiple medalists (Gold Medalist in Snyderman, and a Silver medalist in Dieringer), we ( meaning our MFS Juniors ), have been on an uptick ever since. And I was wondering what everyone thinks are the reason(s) for this uptick? And what will it take for our Greco guys and WFS to duplicate this success? 

Also I know it gets discussed from time to time that being a success on the Junior Level does not automatically equate Senior Level success, but the thought here is, can you really be a success on the Senior Level in this day and age without first the benefit of Junior/Cadet experience and success? 

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5 hours ago, LJB said:

U23 is just a rebadged university, yes?

 

everyone who knows a little about a little knows universities was an also ran... still wrestling, but, not the tip...

University has kind of jumped the shark at this point with the institution of U23.  Many of the foreign "university" participants weren't enrolled in what Americans would call traditional colleges; they were in sports academies training all day with little if any academic requirements.

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6 hours ago, Coach_J said:

University has kind of jumped the shark at this point with the institution of U23.  Many of the foreign "university" participants weren't enrolled in what Americans would call traditional colleges; they were in sports academies training all day with little if any academic requirements.

ofc! if USA doesn't have NCAA or folkstyle USA will be #1 in any wrestling greco/fs/womens etc! the whole system of colleges is to blame! stop....Fix and other guys no compete in folk anymore, they train so hard in Colorado springs and his clubs!  

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6 minutes ago, Abdullahgadzhi Khuzin said:

ofc! if USA doesn't have NCAA or folkstyle USA will be #1 in any wrestling greco/fs/womens etc! the whole system of colleges is to blame! stop....Fix and other guys no compete in folk anymore, they train so hard in Colorado springs and his clubs!  

Khuzin for FILA president!

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3 minutes ago, Coach_J said:

Khuzin for FILA president!

i respect folk. NCAA made this sport so impressive, a million fans watching final NCAA every year! It looks like the Olympic Games finals! But! Folkstyle very...VERY good base for FS! many rules like in fs....only not gut wrench and some other things but not there are not many differences! i like folk! very hard sport! I think folk is not the main reason why USA no good in fs (usa is good in wrestling) i think just problem in training athletes, coaching staff is not so good. Each wrestler in the US is trained in his state. In Russia, 50% train in Dagestan, there is very heavy competition. In general, my opinion - a weak coaching staff and there is not one common leader in the United States. In  Russia there are Chechnya, Dagestan and a couple of Buddhist republics in Siberia. In Iran there is Mazandaran. Thats my opinion! 

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On 9/26/2018 at 6:54 PM, Housebuye said:

Junior worlds is more prestigious at this point, because we have a track record of junior world champs having some level of success at seniors. We know the level of the guys there. Also, countries tend to send their best person under 20. For U23s, most countries don’t send their best, because their best is on the world team. In the US, many are on the national team and don’t even go to U23 trials. 

It is true that Juniors is more prestigious, but I would argue that U23's last year had a very strong level of talent--better than university worlds have had. I think that with most nations sending guys who are in their top few guys for the senior level, the medalists last year were a stronger collective bunch than the junior worlds medalists (meaning they would have beaten them straight up despite the junior guys being perhaps better long-term prospects). Anyone who medals is no joke. 

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