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mattchristensen112

BYU Dropping Wrestling Club - Sign Petition

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On 9/26/2018 at 2:13 PM, JasonBryant said:

I've e-mailed the school spokesman and the Student Life department to get more info on it. Odds they reply are slim, but I haven't had a good argument with a school in a while, so I might just have to poke a stick into the cage and see who I can annoy. 

Start with Ty Detmer is overrated and you can't share the national title....that should get them to reply. Then slip in some wrestling. 

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1 hour ago, westfan said:

How do you drop a club sport? I thought they were self funded and separate from anything the athletic department does.

 

I have no idea what happened. However, you might have answered your own question to the extent that there's no guarantee enough kids came out for the club. Also, they aren't generally completely self-funded. I'm involved with the Ultimate Clubs at Lehigh. The kids pay dues and if they make Nationals (which has happened several times recently) they usually need to fund raise with the alums. But the school does chip in. I'm not sure how much that is but it's well more than the $25 we got back in '75. I vaguely recall some figure into the thousands even back in the 80s.

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2 hours ago, westfan said:

How do you drop a club sport? I thought they were self funded and separate from anything the athletic department does.

 

You generally need a faculty sponsor for a club sport.  If the University put pressure on some of the faculty sponsorship to drop their club then those club would likely end.  Maybe the school did something like this to intentionally cut out a few different clubs and similar organizations.  A way to trim the fat and eliminate some of the things they have to monitor from behind the scenes.  

Edited by MadMardigain

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It is very difficult for club sports (glorified intramural) , especially wrestling, to have committed athletes on par with official university sports unless the premise is to move that direction

This reason (and others) results in failed club wrestling

The failing of a club sport is then used as ammunition for the sport to never be instated as an official sport - it already failed in their minds

Keep this all in mind as fans celebrate the new wrestling club sport as a solid move to adding the sport at the school. 

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If you read the article, BYU is not dropping their club. They do not have an official wrestling club and haven't in two years. The school is telling a group of students to stop using the BYU name for an unofficial club team. It doesn't make things better for these wrestlers, but it may help with the discussion here.

 

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On 9/29/2018 at 8:30 PM, IronChef said:

If you read the article, BYU is not dropping their club. They do not have an official wrestling club and haven't in two years. The school is telling a group of students to stop using the BYU name for an unofficial club team. It doesn't make things better for these wrestlers, but it may help with the discussion here.

 

I wonder what their reasoning is here - I'm sure its a liability-esq thing? If a group is using their name and they have no "real" oversight on it then it then I could maybe understand why they'd be wary of it. Not saying I agree necessarily, but I could see that viewpoint.

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1 hour ago, iGranby said:

I wonder what their reasoning is here - I'm sure its a liability-esq thing? If a group is using their name and they have no "real" oversight on it then it then I could maybe understand why they'd be wary of it. Not saying I agree necessarily, but I could see that viewpoint.

I work with the Ultimate (frisbee) club at Lehigh. We have a sports club coordinator. Even as an official, long standing (1975), well-funded club we have to be careful when we say Lehigh University and when we don't. For example, summer and spring break events are on their own. They can't say Lehigh University. They have to run their official uniforms past the coordinator.

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They competed at the club nationals the last two seasons, but it sounds like it may have been under the table (without their school sanctioning it).  The students say they formed a club 6 years ago, and the University says they haven't chartered a wrestling club since April 2016.  I don't know one way or the other, but it's possible that they were non-compliant in some way and the school shut them down.

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17 minutes ago, UsedToBe103 said:

They competed at the club nationals the last two seasons, but it sounds like it may have been under the table (without their school sanctioning it).  The students say they formed a club 6 years ago, and the University says they haven't chartered a wrestling club since April 2016.  I don't know one way or the other, but it's possible that they were non-compliant in some way and the school shut them down.

Very possible. I might parse the words - haven't chartered.. since 2016 - to ask do they need to charter every year?

https://universe.byu.edu/sports/club-sports/#1455909478970-892bd121-b986

This page from their newspaper shows wrestling as a club sport. On the one hand, this appears to be an up-to-date page in many regards but the wrestling post was from 2016.

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I graduated from BYU.  I don't consider giving them money because they dropped wrestling years ago.  They haven't had a club in 2 years?  More ammo for me not to give.

mspart

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Pressed again and got what is just a questionable response from their University Communications guy

"BYU dropped its NCAA-competing collegiate wrestling program 18 years ago, in 2000. Our Student Life division has not chartered a wrestling club since April 2016. This group is not officially affiliated with the university.

To answer your question, all clubs must meet all policies in place for student clubs. As per BYU policy, clubs are not allowed to engage in any level of competition with other colleges, universities or sporting entities. This policy is necessary in order to protect the University’s Title IX compliancy with athletics."

 

What's confusing is BYU has a TON of club sports, have some touting themselves as national champions, etc. They compete against a ton of other schools. My thought is there is some differential between the club sports and what is under their student life clubs. The language is goofy. The Title IX compliance response is bunk and I told them as much. Let's see how they respond. 

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So further correspondence has led to a few things. 

BYU has extramural sports, where most people define them as "club sports," BYU does support those teams. Wrestling isn't on that level. I'm not sure what it would take for them to be on that level, but apparently a Student Life club isn't designed for sports competing outside of the college boundary. I asked, and if I were to guess, if they wanted to form a wrestling club that competed internally against other students within BYU, that could be allowed. I'm waiting for confirmation. 

So therein lies the rub. BYU does have club sports options, but as far as trying to create a student-run wrestling club that could compete within the NCWA, they apparently don't allow it. It stinks these guys can't wrestle against other teams anymore, but part of this story is ... did they actually research what they could and couldn't do before starting off and trying to compete representing the school as a club? I've got an e-mail out to the NCWA as to why they were competing, because I remember a time when some people at ODU wanted to start a club team and the Rec Sports department had to sign off on it, and that never happened. 

I feared this was mostly semantics as I dug deeper. Still waiting for some backstory to fill in the blanks. 

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