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ESPN reporting on wrestling referee incident

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6 hours ago, ugarte said:

neither "racist" (protected opinion, also he was previously suspended for using the n-word in anger so...) nor "forces wrestler to cut his hair" (substantially true, since the wrestler had the choice of haircut or forfeit) are grounds for a defamation claim. if he sues it will be dismissed without a trial.

I’m no lawyer but he’s already filed a notice of tort claim. Haven’t seen anything since then however. 

 

https://www.inquirer.com/news/new-jersey/andrew-johnson-wrestler-hair-dreadlocks-cut-buena-new-jersey-civil-rights-probes-20190319.html?utm_campaign=Philly.com+Facebook+Account&cid=Philly.com+Facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com

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last year my team was at the georgia prep slam in atlanta...they wouldnt even let my kids weigh in if they didnt pass the hair test...i had to give two of them, including my own son, a dumb and dumber straight cut...hair length rules have been enfoforced in wrestling since i was a kid in the early 80’s...in the semis in that same tourney a coach called out the opponent from Fla. after the 2nd period...when no one had scissors and injury time ran out, the kid got dq’d...two things 1-all were white kids 2-if it doesnt get picked up in weigh ins, it should be incontrovertible and the matches should be wrestled...period....no racism but let the kids wrestle

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On 9/19/2019 at 10:44 PM, RED said:

This ref is going to make millions on the lawsuit!  And he should.  These moronic liberals.  God forbid we follow rules and in the end some poor minority doesn't benefit.  I am not a Trump fan, but the liberals, for the most part are so pathetic.

I am a "moronic liberal" and I agree with you. So what does that make you?

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On 12/21/2018 at 10:49 PM, BigTenFanboy said:

Agreed. Enforcing rules like this to the letter of the law is only asking for trouble. I can understand if the kid didnt have a hair cover at all, but the kid had one. He could have easily allowed the kid to use it this time and said "before you're next match get the new hair cover that attaches to the headgear."

wonder how many times he had already been told that.

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On 9/22/2019 at 10:08 AM, denger said:

I've explained this several times to my outraged liberal friends (and I personally lean left):

First, this should have been handled between the kid and his coach in October/November when the kid reported to practice. It's the coaches' responsibility to communicate the rules to the wrestlers, and the school's responsibility to procure proper equipment. The coach should have known from the beginning whether the equipment was legal. I suspect that the equipment was furnished by the kid and his family rather than the coach/school. Either way, this should be the first point of discussion. I don't know who usually pays for special equipment these days, but it seems to me that it's in the schools' legal interest to do so. 

Next, if there was an equipment problem, then it should have been handled after weigh-ins. If the kid had illegal hair and wanted to wear special equipment, then that should have been approved at the same time as skin check, etc., in a locker room out of sight, between the kid, the coaches and the ref. It seems to me that this is where the ref screwed up. Or, if it IS within the rules to get past this stage without addressing the situation, then a rule needs to change so it doesn't happen again. 

Honestly, I first explain to my outraged friends that mat-side haircuts have a longer history affecting white kids - think about the hairstyles of the 70s and 80s. Cultural norms aside, if the rule is interpreted objectively, then this was within the rules and not unprecedented. Whether there should have been a more culturally-sensitive interpretation is a different discussion. Whether the ref had demonstrated racist behavior in the past is also a different discussion. Whether the rule should be changed is also a different discussion. When viewed objectively, this action was discriminatory of hair but not of race, despite the optics. Rather, it shows how a lackadaisical approach to interpreting rules can meet an unfortunate outcome.

 

It seems to me that the question is not about hair, natural state or whatever, but rather about equipment. I don't think a governing body can write rules about how people wear their hair without discriminating, so they should leave that alone. They can certainly write rules about what interferes with athletes' ability to compete, and the refs' ability to observe action - I'm thinking of Fix v Gilman and the no-call head gear grab: when challenged, the video evidence was not clear because Gilman's hand was not clearly visible within Fix's massive hair.

 

this

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1 hour ago, Plasmodium said:

There were multiple counter examples of others with long hair wrestling in NJ.  Robert Howard, for example.  This kid was singled out, so that gets addressed.  They changed the rule so it doesn't happen again.  Change the channel.

You have no idea what you are talking about. For atleast the past 30 years ,kids in nj have had to cut there hair in the locker room or mat side regardless of race or hair style and no one cared, 1 person posted a video saying that’s racist and people who have reelection campaigns in NJ took it as an opportunity for a photo shoot. The kid had been warned literally a week prior, his teammates and coaches didn’t have a problem with what happened, the only people that did are people that don’t follow wrestling or have any clue of the rules and how they are applied. This whole thing is embarrassing for NJ wrestling and 1 guy lost his job and another is suspended 2 years for literally following the rules. You probably shouldn’t speak with such certainty about things you clearly don’t know much about.

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2 hours ago, Antitroll2828 said:

You have no idea what you are talking about. For at least the past 30 years ,kids in nj have had to cut there hair in the locker room or mat side regardless of race or hair style and no one cared, 1 person posted a video saying that’s racist and people who have reelection campaigns in NJ took it as an opportunity for a photo shoot. The kid had been warned literally a week prior, his teammates and coaches didn’t have a problem with what happened, the only people that did are people that don’t follow wrestling or have any clue of the rules and how they are applied. This whole thing is embarrassing for NJ wrestling and 1 guy lost his job and another is suspended 2 years for literally following the rules. You probably shouldn’t speak with such certainty about things you clearly don’t know much about.

This is accurate with one exception.  40 years ago they generally made 2 or 3 guys cut their hair at just about every meet.  You chopped off pieces until they grunted and then kept moving.  No sympathy.  It was pretty funny seeing what you could get away with.  Dull, blunt tape scissors.   I didn't realize they were being ra**st bas**rds. 

 

 

 

Edited by TFBJR

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5 hours ago, Antitroll2828 said:

You have no idea what you are talking about. For atleast the past 30 years ,kids in nj have had to cut there hair in the locker room or mat side regardless of race or hair style and no one cared, 1 person posted a video saying that’s racist and people who have reelection campaigns in NJ took it as an opportunity for a photo shoot. The kid had been warned literally a week prior, his teammates and coaches didn’t have a problem with what happened, the only people that did are people that don’t follow wrestling or have any clue of the rules and how they are applied. This whole thing is embarrassing for NJ wrestling and 1 guy lost his job and another is suspended 2 years for literally following the rules. You probably shouldn’t speak with such certainty about things you clearly don’t know much about.

When this incident occurred,  there were multiple pictures of people wrestling last season in NJ with hair as long or longer than his.  It is not a question of knowing anything, it is simply acknowledging reality.   Nothing to see here.

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22 hours ago, Plasmodium said:

When this incident occurred,  there were multiple pictures of people wrestling last season in NJ with hair as long or longer than his.  It is not a question of knowing anything, it is simply acknowledging reality.   Nothing to see here.

Unless they were also being refereed by the ref in this case, that’s not really relevant.  Some refs are more lenient with the hair rule in general than others.   I also believe Howard cut his hair during the season so chances are someone might’ve said something to him about it.  

Edited by 1032004

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5 hours ago, Antitroll2828 said:

You have no idea what you are talking about. For atleast the past 30 years ,kids in nj have had to cut there hair in the locker room or mat side regardless of race or hair style and no one cared, 1 person posted a video saying that’s racist and people who have reelection campaigns in NJ took it as an opportunity for a photo shoot. The kid had been warned literally a week prior, his teammates and coaches didn’t have a problem with what happened, the only people that did are people that don’t follow wrestling or have any clue of the rules and how they are applied. This whole thing is embarrassing for NJ wrestling and 1 guy lost his job and another is suspended 2 years for literally following the rules. You probably shouldn’t speak with such certainty about things you clearly don’t know much about.

Actually the guy that posted the video didn’t even say it was racist, he said the kid was being a team player.  And yet even that guy got shamed into apologizing for “not seeing the [alleged] racism.”

Edited by 1032004

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On 12/26/2019 at 5:02 PM, Plasmodium said:

When this incident occurred,  there were multiple pictures of people wrestling last season in NJ with hair as long or longer than his.  It is not a question of knowing anything, it is simply acknowledging reality.   Nothing to see here.

100%.  I was going 80 in a 50 one time.  I told the cop - there was another guy going as fast or faster than me.  Still got a ticket.  Clearly the cop was just a racist. 

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20 minutes ago, TFBJR said:

100%.  I was going 80 in a 50 one time.  I told the cop - there was another guy going as fast or faster than me.  Still got a ticket.  Clearly the cop was just a racist. 

Yep.  I was following you. I know that cop.  He has a checkered past and we both saw the cars flying by us.

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