Jump to content
WillieBoy

3 years or 4 til ISU tops Iowa?

Recommended Posts

18 minutes ago, WF89 said:

Ok, I thought Askren and Dernlan were comparing Cenzo and Marsteller and saying they were both PA 4 timers.  Perhaps I misremembered what they said or it’s possible that they relayed bad information.

 

https://therudis.com/rudis-wrestling-podcast-22-southern-scuffle-and-midlands/

 

at 39:38 Dernlan says they were both 4x PA champs.  

Yea he was wrong. I actually left a comment on that podcast making the correction and how Cenzo was always smaller in hs. You need to be logged in to view and make comments there.

Edited by BigTenFanboy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, WF89 said:

Ok, I thought Askren and Dernlan were comparing Cenzo and Marsteller and saying they were both PA 4 timers.  Perhaps I misremembered what they said or it’s possible that they relayed bad information.

 

https://therudis.com/rudis-wrestling-podcast-22-southern-scuffle-and-midlands/

 

at 39:38 Dernlan says they were both 4x PA champs.  

Here are Cenzo's hs stats..

 

http://www.pa-wrestling.com/hs/teams/pittsburghcc/athlete_stats.htm?id=71972

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

.... why bash Iowa- they have their style, everybody knows it, and they still win- the "Brother's" paid their dues, and they fight for every point and every team member- and they are good for the sport and good for the "personna" of wrestling.........

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/21/2019 at 6:46 PM, VakAttack said:

It's a different world in wrestling. Gable never had anything like a strong Penn State program to compete with.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

That's an interesting topic: How would Gable's best teams compare with Cael's best teams?

I'm from the Gable era, but I think the technical skill of wrestlers has improved a lot over the last decade or two. I think Cael's got him beat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/21/2019 at 10:07 PM, cornercoach said:

.... why bash Iowa- they have their style, everybody knows it, and they still win- the "Brother's" paid their dues, and they fight for every point and every team member- and they are good for the sport and good for the "personna" of wrestling.........

 

To make the observation that Iowa ain't what they were under Gable is not bashing them, it's just admitting the truth. I think most of us in this forum would like to see Iowa , if not resume their "rightful position" at top, at least get closer to the team they were under Gable, just for selfish reasons (we love good team races at NCAAs).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

That's an interesting topic: How would Gable's best teams compare with Cael's best teams?

I'm from the Gable era, but I think the technical skill of wrestlers has improved a lot over the last decade or two. I think Cael's got him beat.

I doubt anyone would dispute that the technical skill of today's wrestlers is better. But Rob Koll once made the point to me: If a guy like Gable or Ironside (or whoever) was wrestling today he would pick up the techniques being used today. But what would set them apart today is the same thing that set them apart in the '70s or '80s: toughness, determination, athletic ability. There is no reason to believe that today's wrestlers are better in those areas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/21/2019 at 11:07 PM, cornercoach said:

.... why bash Iowa- they have their style, everybody knows it, and they still win- the "Brother's" paid their dues, and they fight for every point and every team member- and they are good for the sport and good for the "personna" of wrestling.........

I don't think that everyone would agree for you that they're "good for the sport" or good for the personna of wrestling.  But to answer the question of the thread, Iowa State probably needs to worry about passing UNI before they get in to the conversation about passing up Iowa. I'll make fun of Iowa all the time for basically being the high school prom king that's now sitting at the bar fat and talking to anyone that'll listen about the time he threw three touchdowns in a game. The sport has passed both the school and their style by. But they're still, for now at least, on the tier below the title contenders. Iowa State is a good two tiers below that currently. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/21/2019 at 11:07 PM, cornercoach said:

.... why bash Iowa- they have their style, everybody knows it, and they still win- the "Brother's" paid their dues, and they fight for every point and every team member- and they are good for the sport and good for the "personna" of wrestling.........

I'm not bashing Iowa so much as hoping ISU continues their path to improvement. Tom Brands is a very good Coach, but Iowa has slipped when you view the top dog, Penn State. For some reason Iowa does not exhibit the Gable Mentality - and that is a shame. Two coaches who were top drawer competitors from the Gable Stable and both end up with similar career trajectories. Win bit and then fall back. Zalesky is not doing that great at Oregon State and Tom Brands (though better) not that good at Iowa. Being continually in the running for second is not "The Iowa Way".

ISU getting better and pushing Iowa head to head would be good for the sport and good for Iowa wrestling. Yes, I do agree they have to get past UNI before Iowa is really in the picture. So far they look much improved. Hope they keep it up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is one of those rivalries that are good for the state and the schools involved (for recruiting purposes). One thing I appreciate is the cross-conference nature of the rivalry.

I think ISU is at least one, possibly two recruiting cycles (3-6 years) away from making it competitive. It will take some transfers to speed us this process. As mentioned above, they have a handful of guys that are going to be in the line-up for a few years. They'll need to make a splash soon in order to make ISU attractive for the next crop and that's when they will begin the process of pushing Iowa.

In the end, I'd like to see this dual meet grow in intensity.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, WillieBoy said:

I'm not bashing Iowa so much as hoping ISU continues their path to improvement. Tom Brands is a very good Coach, but Iowa has slipped when you view the top dog, Penn State. For some reason Iowa does not exhibit the Gable Mentality - and that is a shame. Two coaches who were top drawer competitors from the Gable Stable and both end up with similar career trajectories. Win bit and then fall back. Zalesky is not doing that great at Oregon State and Tom Brands (though better) not that good at Iowa. Being continually in the running for second is not "The Iowa Way".

Yes, Iowa has not lived up to that standard. However, to expect Iowa to win every year like they used to requires you to completely ignore the landscape of wrestling right now. PSU has won 7 of the last 8 titles. Ohio St. has emerged as a contender every year. Okie St, Michigan, NC St. Missouri, and Cornell are all trophy contenders every year. Look at Iowa's points from last year with 97 points. That point total would have been enough to win 2008-2011. Iowa has not slipped, the bar has been raised. Look at their team now. 9 ranked guys and they are not considered a legit contender. 

One thing has not changed. Iowa is one of the top teams every single year. They have not finished lower than 8th at nationals since 1972 I believe. Thats insane. Maybe Iowa has slipped when compared to PSU alone, but they have not really dropped under Brands too far. Their ability to stockpile talent these last few years leads me to believe that Brands is the best coach to keep them in that discussion, and possibly pick up a few more titles. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, WillieBoy said:

Should have seen Iowa State/Iowa the first half dozen years after Gable signed to coach at Iowa. Intensity is not a strong enough word for it.

I can only imagine what that was like. Perhaps pulling Metcalf and Zadik onto the Cyclone staff can relive some of the magic.

I think it would be more proper to first desire competitiveness, then intensity.

Edited by RealAmericanHero

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Iowa State is a ways off. They had a chance to take the dual this year which would have been incredible but it won't be close at NCAAs. Iowa has 2-3 title contenders and another 4-5 AA threats. They could fall way low of that but that core + healthy Kem and Stoll would be scary good. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×