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russelscout

Does The Bull stall?

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I just listened to to Askren tell everyone on his Rudis podcast that he is not biased against Iowa and then went on a tangent about how Marinelli just pushes and doesn't shoot, using his match against Gunther as an example. Umm, is that really the wrestler he is going to use as an example? The Bull IMO has one of the highest attack rates in the country. You want to talk about Stoll? Ok I get it. Kaleb Young? Yeah, he doesn't do a lot. However, stalling is pervasive in college wrestling, and Askren is concerned with the way Marinelli wrestles?  Please.

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Interested to see how this young group develops the next couple of years.  If Tom can't win it in 2021 when they will be the overwhelming favorite, you have to put him below Zalesky.  So far a bunch of mixed results for the push stallers. 

Edited by LemonPie

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3 minutes ago, LemonPie said:

Interested to see how this young group develops the next couple of years.  If Tom can't win it in 2021 when they will be the overwhelming favorite, you have to put him below Zalesky.  So far a bunch of mixed results for the push stallers. 

What does this have to do with the original post?

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2 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Does The Bull stall?

100 percent yes. Emphatically YES. The rule book states that pushing someone out of bounds is stalling. Marinelli pushes people out of bounds, a LOT! Therefore, Marinelli stalls. 

He also scores a lot of takedowns and gets plenty of falls. Those don't matter? I'm guess you are able to look the other way when your boy Hall pulls off the patented double collar tie. He really pushes the pace with that.

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I think there are a lot of wrestlers that don’t shoot and just wait to attack on someone else’s shot.  It happens a lot.

 

But to use The Bull as an example, isn’t it the responsibility of the wrestler being pushed to push back?  I don’t think Marinelli is stalling doing this as he will still shoot, he just won’t take a bad shot if the opponent is backing up.

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5 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Does The Bull stall?

100 percent yes. Emphatically YES. The rule book states that pushing someone out of bounds is stalling. Marinelli pushes people out of bounds, a LOT! Therefore, Marinelli stalls. 


Pushing is part of what Marinelli DOES. Wearing down an opponent. The fact he works for TDs shows he's not stalling, imo.

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2 minutes ago, russelscout said:

He also scores a lot of takedowns and gets plenty of falls. Those don't matter? I'm guess you are able to look the other way when your boy Hall pulls off the patented double collar tie. He really pushes the pace with that.

Of course those things matter, but that isn't the question you asked. You asked if Marinelli stalls. YES, he stalls. A LOT. 

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1 minute ago, TobusRex said:


Pushing is part of what Marinelli DOES. Wearing down an opponent. The fact he works for TDs shows he's not stalling, imo.

I don't care that he pushes opponents in bounds. I care that he pushes opponents out of bounds. By rule that is stalling. He should be called for it. So should Sam Stoll or any other wrestlers who is obviously pushing their opponent out of bounds in an attempt top get the ref to call the opponent for stalling when in fact it is they who are stalling. 

Pushing may be effective in wearing your opponent down, but trying to induce stall calls when you are the one pushing the opponent oob is not wrestling. If they want to add in a push out rule, then things will be different. Until then, pushing your opponent OOB is stalling. 

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2 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Of course those things matter, but that isn't the question you asked. You asked if Marinelli stalls. YES, he stalls. A LOT. 

Oh, Gotchya. So then when it comes to Mark Hall stalling, that is also 100 percent yes. Emphatically YES? 

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11 minutes ago, russelscout said:

Oh, Gotchya. So then when it comes to Mark Hall stalling, that is also 100 percent yes. Emphatically YES? 

YES, emphatically, I would say a very high number of wrestlers stall at certain points in a match without getting called.

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Just now, Mpchillin said:

YES, emphatically, I would say a very high number of wrestlers stall at certain points in a match without getting called.

There are 2 wrestlers who wrestle pretty much non-stop with no caution in Nolf and Nickel. I can't really think of anyone else.

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14 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

 

I did NOT. Did he stall like crazy in that one?

He gave up 2 stalling points, and should have been dinged for more.  He basically went into par terre defense with Wick on top.

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He applies a lot of pressure without doing much, last year I was telling anyone who listens he has no attacks, he just forces the other guy to attempt something and spins behind, this year he's been better about being offensive against lesser wrestlers, I'm sure he's gaining confidence off last years results. 
And he fires off a shot or 2 against the top guys. 
He's the Pletcher of 165. Capable of scoring when he needs, but really depends on position and counters to score during the majority of the match. 

He's good for top 6 this year. 

Edited by spladle08
wanted to change cans, to lesser wrestlers. And wanted to add thoughts

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Marinelli did stall in the wick match but as a whole I dont think he does. That muay thai double collar penn state started using this season is definitely a stall tactic and should be called

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9 minutes ago, spladle08 said:

He applies a lot of pressure without doing much, last year I was telling anyone who listens he has no attacks, he just forces the other guy to attempt something and spins behind, this year he's been better about being offensive against cans. 

When he wrestled Wick he scored on 2 of his own shots in the first period. Yeah he got hit for stalling in the second, but are we just going to ignore the fact that Wick is very good on top and sat in a cross body ride without even getting close to trying to score himself? He was just waiting for Marinelli to try to come up and wrap up a cradle the entire period.  What would you do? Its not like Wick was a huge risk taker there.
 

12 minutes ago, spladle08 said:

He's the Pletcher of 165. 

Except for the fact that he does get bonus points all the time.  The Bull has a 73% bonus rate this year, but was only 28% last year. Pletcher is 44% this year, and 12% last year. Maybe you should find a better comparable.

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