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Jimmy Cinnabon

Is Jason Nolf overrated?

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No doubt he is an amazing wrestler.  Aggressive, creative, daring...loads of fun to watch, even for the most casual fan.

However, at best, he can only be a 3x champ and has taken multiple losses in his career (albeit to another great in IMar).  He also is not an accomplished freestyler and it is TBD if he can develop in that discipline.

As far as a wrestler he would not be in the top 5 all time greatest (e.g. in no particular order I think Cael, Dake, John Smith, DT, Uetake would all be above him).

So the question is...is Jason Nolf very very good, but overrated?

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6 minutes ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said:

Do you moonlight as a buzzfeed writer?  Not every thread has to be clickbait.  

Fitting an absurd top 5 into the topic was a nice touch though.  Someone will for sure take the bait.  

What's absurd about that top 5?  Of course I meant top 5 in the US.

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5 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

No I actually don't.  Seriously.  PM me if you don't want to spell it out here.

I can't start my first post with "someone will take the bait" and then proceed to take the bait myself.  I'll pass on both counts.  

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35 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

No doubt he is an amazing wrestler.  Aggressive, creative, daring...loads of fun to watch, even for the most casual fan.

However, at best, he can only be a 3x champ and has taken multiple losses in his career (albeit to another great in IMar).  He also is not an accomplished freestyler and it is TBD if he can develop in that discipline.

As far as a wrestler he would not be in the top 5 all time greatest (e.g. in no particular order I think Cael, Dake, John Smith, DT, Uetake would all be above him).

So the question is...is Jason Nolf very very good, but overrated?

 

Lol. Some guy did his own US freestyle rankings on the Int'l. board. For the 70Kg weight he had James Green, Jason Chamberlain, Alex Pantaleo, Ryan Deakin and I forget who else. Nolf has beaten all of them, sometimes badly, including shutting Chamberlain out in freestyle. The only guy he hasn't beat was Green and he has twice come damn close even though their last meeting came when Nolf had just finished his soph. year and Green was a defending world medalist. That was a 1 point loss.

Nolf may not be "accomplished", if that is how you want to put it, but he's going to be good if that's his intent.

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I think part of the problem with these discussions is that in this era everyone wants to group college and international together. They have to be separate when discussing this. Something to remember with Nolf as well is that he had a win over IMAR in the same season, and the B10 and NCAA matches were super close. Had he been blown out, you might have a case there. I would say he is definitely not overrated. He obviously won't be the best of all time, but you could make the argument he is right there with Zain in terms of best in a three year span. The other bummer with Nolf is there is a good chance on Olympic years he gets caught between 65 and 74.

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1 hour ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

No doubt he is an amazing wrestler.  Aggressive, creative, daring...loads of fun to watch, even for the most casual fan.

However, at best, he can only be a 3x champ and has taken multiple losses in his career (albeit to another great in IMar).  He also is not an accomplished freestyler and it is TBD if he can develop in that discipline.

As far as a wrestler he would not be in the top 5 all time greatest (e.g. in no particular order I think Cael, Dake, John Smith, DT, Uetake would all be above him).

So the question is...is Jason Nolf very very good, but overrated?

Yes, he is very overrated!!  I kid, he is a stud and this thread is ridicules!!

Also, I love the bold.  In no particular order however this is coming from a guy who would smell Cael's farts for him and he just has to list Cael first. 

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2 hours ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

No doubt he is an amazing wrestler.  Aggressive, creative, daring...loads of fun to watch, even for the most casual fan.

However, at best, he can only be a 3x champ and has taken multiple losses in his career (albeit to another great in IMar).  He also is not an accomplished freestyler and it is TBD if he can develop in that discipline.

As far as a wrestler he would not be in the top 5 all time greatest (e.g. in no particular order I think Cael, Dake, John Smith, DT, Uetake would all be above him).

So the question is...is Jason Nolf very very good, but overrated?

You need more real friends.

But OK, you drop a lot of oddities.  Your title is "Is he overrated"?  That implies a personal rating.  What is your rating?  Most rating services rate Nolf as the most dominant wrestler at NCAA 157 pounds, the top pound for pound wrestler, and front runner for the Hodge this year.  So do you think your assessment is overrated?

Deeper ... he has lost twice to IMar in awesome matches in his freshman year.  He also took a loss in his Junior year as an INJ default.  That's it.  And to say that he "can only be a 3x champ" ... well, that is pretty awesome.  Also "he isn't acomplished freestyle" ... OK this again goes to your assessment.  I think he is the best folkstyle wrestler in the NCAA today.  Most accomplished, and most dominant.  Then you go into "not top 5 all time" ... wow, you must have a pretty high opinion of him.  Maybe I need to come up to your level.

 

I guess you confuse me!

 

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I think the only real knock on Nolf is lack of competition over the last three years. Kinda reminds me of Askren after Pendleton left and he only had Herbert. Except Nolf doesn’t have a Herbert. 

Which is a shame because it would be great to see how he would match up with Dake or Taylor in college at that weight. 

No doubt one of the all time greats though. Probably one of the slickest I’ve ever seen.

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1 hour ago, MDAlum said:

You need more real friends.

But OK, you drop a lot of oddities.  Your title is "Is he overrated"?  That implies a personal rating.  What is your rating?  Most rating services rate Nolf as the most dominant wrestler at NCAA 157 pounds, the top pound for pound wrestler, and front runner for the Hodge this year.  So do you think your assessment is overrated?

Deeper ... he has lost twice to IMar in awesome matches in his freshman year.  He also took a loss in his Junior year as an INJ default.  That's it.  And to say that he "can only be a 3x champ" ... well, that is pretty awesome.  Also "he isn't acomplished freestyle" ... OK this again goes to your assessment.  I think he is the best folkstyle wrestler in the NCAA today.  Most accomplished, and most dominant.  Then you go into "not top 5 all time" ... wow, you must have a pretty high opinion of him.  Maybe I need to come up to your level.

 

I guess you confuse me!

 

You bring up an interesting angle, MD.  Who is the best ever at 157?  I do not know myself but in the last 15 years I will say for argument it’s Kyle Dake.  (Heck, throw in Imar, too, this this next part.). What were his bonus statistics at 157?  How does Jason stack up?  I don’t know that answer either but my gut feel is that Jason is right there with the best ever if he is not better by statistics.  

That, of course, means nothing when you speak of freestyle potential.  Few of the PSU alums were active at the world level last year but we expect them to be this year.  That will tell us a lot and I think Jason will be in the mix for the 70 kg spot this year.  But where he goes after that could be more problematic.  Maybe he has a great great grandfather that visited Jamaica and he can represent them in 2020... : )

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 Now that they have same-day weigh ins nolf doesn’t have that far to go  to be a 74 kg wrestler.  Surely someone with his focus can add a few lbs of lean muscle to his frame.  Bulking up has never been an option for him due to Penn State’s lineup. He should be right there in the mix in 2020 and well beyond.

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4 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

Not to rain on anybody's parade, but I think Nolf would've beaten Dake at 157.  Nolf is a lot squirrellier than David Taylor was (Taylor was a fine scrambler..but Nolf is a freak), and I think that gives Nolf a leg up on Taylor (vs Dake).

Well we also all thought that David Taylor was going to beat Dake Bc He was a lot more dynamic and dominating

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13 minutes ago, BBB4PSU said:

You bring up an interesting angle, MD.  Who is the best ever at 157?  I do not know myself but in the last 15 years I will say for argument it’s Kyle Dake.  (Heck, throw in Imar, too, this this next part.). What were his bonus statistics at 157?  How does Jason stack up?  I don’t know that answer either but my gut feel is that Jason is right there with the best ever if he is not better by statistics.  

That, of course, means nothing when you speak of freestyle potential.  Few of the PSU alums were active at the world level last year but we expect them to be this year.  That will tell us a lot and I think Jason will be in the mix for the 70 kg spot this year.  But where he goes after that could be more problematic.  Maybe he has a great great grandfather that visited Jamaica and he can represent them in 2020... : )

Lee Kemp

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