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Cassar vs Stoll

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3 minutes ago, Dr. Novak said:

Cassar is much stronger.  Stoll is lardy.

I doubt that anyone at the weight is stronger than Stoll.  But I'm still picking Cassar.  I'm intrigued to see how he handles geetting caught in those double underhooks, since his go to shot is a double leg.

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I think it depends on where the match is wrestled. If Stoll is able to keep his hands on him and slow it down, I think he can win the match on the mat. Cassar has struggled on bottom in the past and Stoll is one of the best at the weight on top. With that being said, it's hard to see Stoll keeping Cassar off his legs, especially not being 100%. I'll say Cassar picks up 2-3 takedowns and wins by a couple points while being relatively dominant despite the close score.

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1 hour ago, VakAttack said:

I doubt that anyone at the weight is stronger than Stoll.  But I'm still picking Cassar.  I'm intrigued to see how he handles geetting caught in those double underhooks, since his go to shot is a double leg.

If no one is stronger than Stoll, he shouldn't have been ridden like a rented mule by Jensen.

If this occurs, I see Cassar in a very controlled, 6-2 style match.  I see Stoll not being able to pull anything off, and Cassar getting 3 TD's in the process.  Granted, Cassar may get ridden as well... but he wins the TD match. 

Edited by treep2000

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If they wrestle I could picture Cassar getting a couple first period TD's. He'll go real hard on that freight train double and Stoll will instinctively try to protect his knee which will require him to bail out. 2 for Cassar. Anthony then chooses neutral if its his choice and tries to repeat the process. Cassar is not the guy anyone with a bum knee should want to wrestle.

Edited by TBar1977

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10 minutes ago, treep2000 said:

If no one is stronger than Stoll, he shouldn't have been ridden like a rented mule by Jensen.

If this occurs, I see Cassar in a very controlled, 6-2 style match.  I see Stoll not being able to pull anything off, and Cassar getting 3 TD's in the process.  Granted, Cassar may get ridden as well... but he wins the TD match. 

This implies that nobody who is the strongest at a weight can be ridden, and that's just not true.  Especially a guy who has knee injuries.

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46 minutes ago, treep2000 said:

If no one is stronger than Stoll, he shouldn't have been ridden like a rented mule by Jensen.

If this occurs, I see Cassar in a very controlled, 6-2 style match.  I see Stoll not being able to pull anything off, and Cassar getting 3 TD's in the process.  Granted, Cassar may get ridden as well... but he wins the TD match. 

It's not like Jensen held him down with a spiral ride. He's a leg rider at a weight class where nobody rides legs. Stoll clearly was uncomfortable in that position on top of the fact he has a bum knee. Great ride by Jensen, but it doesn't demonstrate a lack of strength by Stoll. Agree with your analysis of the cassar match up though the score could be closer due to a bunch of Stoll escapes and late stalling calls a la the Clark/Garrett national final. Could see an 8-5 or 8-6 final with 4 Cassar takedowns and 5 stoll escapes.

Edited by qc8223

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24 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

This implies that nobody who is the strongest at a weight can be ridden, and that's just not true.  Especially a guy who has knee injuries.

I got ridden out by a guy when I was a Jr who probably wasn't as strong as  I was. He was just a better wrestler.

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2 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

I got ridden out by a guy when I was a Jr who probably wasn't as strong as  I was. He was just a better wrestler.

Sure.  And Metcalf once got ridden for a whole period by Lance Palmer.  It happens that way, too.

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2 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

Sure.  And Metcalf once got ridden for a whole period by Lance Palmer.  It happens that way, too.

Leg riding can ice a period against anyone, no matter how good or strong. If a good leg rider, like Palmer, got the boots in, you pretty much had to hope the official bailed you out with a stalemate. Same thing at play in the stoll match. Once that leg came in, the game was over.

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54 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

This implies that nobody who is the strongest at a weight can be ridden, and that's just not true.  Especially a guy who has knee injuries.

I wonder if Jensen will ride Gable that way?  Parris?  Cassar?  Dhesi?  

Your original post implied that he was/is the strongest at the weight.  One element of strength is the ability to break rides.  This is a known thing, because clearly, Micah Jordan is weak as hell, per all the threads stating as such.  

More than anything, this points out that if a guy can take Stoll down, and is a decent rider, Stoll will lose.  Jensen just simply isn't top tier, and Stoll, bum knee or not, isn't top tier this year.  Sure... he shot himself... but... Yianni has no triceps.  So... what's the difference?

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4 minutes ago, treep2000 said:

I wonder if Jensen will ride Gable that way?  Parris?  Cassar?  Dhesi?  

Your original post implied that he was/is the strongest at the weight.  One element of strength is the ability to break rides.  This is a known thing, because clearly, Micah Jordan is weak as hell, per all the threads stating as such.  

More than anything, this points out that if a guy can take Stoll down, and is a decent rider, Stoll will lose.  Jensen just simply isn't top tier, and Stoll, bum knee or not, isn't top tier this year.  Sure... he shot himself... but... Yianni has no triceps.  So... what's the difference?

Sure.  Easy peasy.  If someone is better than Stoll in 2 of 3 positions, they will beat him.  Damned insightful.

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2 hours ago, treep2000 said:

I wonder if Jensen will ride Gable that way?  Parris?  Cassar?  Dhesi?  

Your original post implied that he was/is the strongest at the weight.  One element of strength is the ability to break rides.  This is a known thing, because clearly, Micah Jordan is weak as hell, per all the threads stating as such.  

More than anything, this points out that if a guy can take Stoll down, and is a decent rider, Stoll will lose.  Jensen just simply isn't top tier, and Stoll, bum knee or not, isn't top tier this year.  Sure... he shot himself... but... Yianni has no triceps.  So... what's the difference?

 

I'd be shocked if Jensen could ride anybody else at HWT that way. Jensen had a little difficulty getting those legs in, he looked awkward as hell to me. But Stoll was so immobile that he got them in eventually.

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2 hours ago, VakAttack said:

Sure.  Easy peasy.  If someone is better than Stoll in 2 of 3 positions, they will beat him.  Damned insightful.

Well Snyder was generally superior in only 1 of 3 positions and he ended up being a 3x :D  But he was a freak.

Edited by TobusRex

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5 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

 

I'd be shocked if Jensen could ride anybody else at HWT that way. Jensen had a little difficulty getting those legs in, he looked awkward as hell to me. But Stoll was so immobile that he got them in eventually.

I believe he rode Snyder out last year didn't he? After double checking, I believe that was his brother, but he is like a carbon-copy of his brother. Leg riding is really their only thing and it wouldn't surprise me at all if he rode another higher ranked guy. 

Edited by qc8223

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3 hours ago, TobusRex said:

yeah, I remember that. I also remember Palmer thinking he was a superstar after he beat Metcalf :D

Well, he kinda was - but it only lasted 2 weeks.  # 2 Palmer beat # 1 Metcalf  by 9-3 decision at Big 10's.  Then # 2 Metcalf beat # 1 Palmer at NCAA's 3-2.  Brent changed his strategy to avoid going under Lance in the rematch.  "He was content to win by 1."

Image result for lance palmer brent metcalf

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