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Is Shakur Rasheed overrated at #2?

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1 minute ago, Molsen said:

There was no reason to rank him ahead of returning all Americans who placed at that weight, and higher then his 7th place. The only arguement he had was he goes to penn state. But with that argument, schnupp should be ranked top 8

He was like 4th in NCAA Most Dominant, so there were other reasons to rank him high. 

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Just now, BigTenFanboy said:

False, becuase no one thinks Schnupp is 8th best in the country. Most people thought Shakur was 2nd best in the country.

But without data to prove it you cant have consistently correct rankings, ranking that way. Flos rankings werent a conspiracy against shak, or psu. Its just how rankings are supposed to be done. With data, to minimize error. 

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1 minute ago, Molsen said:

But without data to prove it you cant have consistently correct rankings, ranking that way. Flos rankings werent a conspiracy against shak, or psu. Its just how rankings are supposed to be done. With data, to minimize error. 

Never said it was a conspiracy against Shak. Said that their rankings were wrong. Match results influence your gut feelings but your gut feeling should trump any of that stuff.

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2 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

He was like 4th in NCAA Most Dominant, so there were other reasons to rank him high. 

He didnt wrestle anyone in the top 10. There is a difference between dominating non-aas and even beating low level aas

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2 minutes ago, Molsen said:

He didnt wrestle anyone in the top 10. There is a difference between dominating non-aas and even beating low level aas

Yeah, but he's better than Venz imo. Also in the opinion of all those rankings entities. This isn't that hard to figure out. 

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Just now, BigTenFanboy said:

Never said it was a conspiracy against Shak. Said that their rankings were wrong. Match results influence your gut feelings but your gut feeling should trump any of that stuff.

Then they would be wrong more often. David taylor would have been ranked ahead of Dake after losing to him Rankings use date, predictions use gut feelings. Thats generally how it is done. Honestly im sure the other rankings guys that did have shak at 2 didnt do it because of gut feeling. They moved him up when others lost, which is flawed in a different way, but worked out for them this time.

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Just now, Molsen said:

Then they would be wrong more often. David taylor would have been ranked ahead of Dake after losing to him Rankings use date, predictions use gut feelings. Thats generally how it is done. Honestly im sure the other rankings guys that did have shak at 2 didnt do it because of gut feeling. They moved him up when others lost, which is flawed in a different way, but worked out for them this time.

They were right so it wasnt flawed. After Taylor lost to Dake the first time he was ranked 2nd and continued to be so. The only way Taylor would have been ranked ahead of Dake by gut feeling  is if they never wrestled.

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1 minute ago, BigTenFanboy said:

They were right so it wasnt flawed. After Taylor lost to Dake the first time he was ranked 2nd and continued to be so. The only way Taylor would have been ranked ahead of Dake by gut feeling  is if they never wrestled.

But gut feeling! But eye test. If those mattered, dake would have been ranked 2nd

Edited by Molsen

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2 minutes ago, Molsen said:

Then they would be wrong more often. David taylor would have been ranked ahead of Dake after losing to him Rankings use date, predictions use gut feelings. Thats generally how it is done. Honestly im sure the other rankings guys that did have shak at 2 didnt do it because of gut feeling. They moved him up when others lost, which is flawed in a different way, but worked out for them this time.

They would be as accurate as wrestlestat's rankings if they followed your plan.

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1 minute ago, Molsen said:

But gut feeling! But eye test. If those mattered, dake would have been ranked 2nd

Which he was until they actually wrestle. After that the eye test said Dake. The only time the eye test and gut would have ranked Taylor above Dake was when Taylor won NCAAs his sophomore year. A month later the eye test changed.

Edited by BigTenFanboy

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1 minute ago, BigTenFanboy said:

Yes it is.

See my post about shak moving up when others lost. That is most likely why he was ranked 2nd, not gut feelings or eye tests. Its flawed in the fact that its not consistently a way that will work in rankings. It worked out in shaks case but that doesnt make it a consistent wau to rank.

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Just now, Molsen said:

See my post about shak moving up when others lost. That is most likely why he was ranked 2nd, not gut feelings or eye tests. Its flawed in the fact that its not consistently a way that will work in rankings. It worked out in shaks case but that doesnt make it a consistent wau to rank.

Its flawed to have a consistent system when doing rankings. If your rankings dont include a large subjective component then hour rankings are bad. Ala wrestlestat. Which you repeated ignore.

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Just now, BigTenFanboy said:

But but it's purely dataaaaaaaaaaaa, how could it be wrooooonnnggg

Its data from previous years, that doesnt take into consideration injuries (also data). Come on dude. Why else to rankings guys predictions not match their rankings. You dont understand how rankings work, that is fine, you dont have to worry about it because your team is so good at the moment, they are gonna be up there. Good for you. Doesnt mean you have to get defensive when flo (rightfully) ranks shak lower. If shak would have wrestled one guy in the top 8, then youd have an arguement that he should have moved up when others lost. (Thats why he was ranked 2. Not gut feeling)

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5 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Yeah, but he's better than Venz imo. Also in the opinion of all those rankings entities. This isn't that hard to figure out. 

I don't think there's any question he's better than Venz. I don't think there's any question he's one of the 2 best wrestlers in the conference. I haven't seen the rest of the country but I doubt there's much else in the country except maybe the Lehigh kid. He's one of the three four best in the country on any day. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHETHER OR NOT HE WAS DESERVING OF THE 2 SEED. Christ they're not the same goddamn thing. I hope he wins tomorrow. There were other people not deserving of their seed but this is the Shakur Rasheed thread. One of the reasons this one is 7 pages long is because some people will never admit anything wrong about Penn State on this message board even though they know in their hearts it's correct. There are people out there who still think Paterno did nothing wrong. Or that's what they say in public. It's okay to admit things about your team that aren't positive. Your card won't be taken away.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Molsen said:

Its data from previous years, that doesnt take into consideration injuries (also data). Come on dude. Why else to rankings guys predictions not match their rankings. You dont understand how rankings work, that is fine, you dont have to worry about it because your team is so good at the moment, they are gonna be up there. Good for you. Doesnt mean you have to get defensive when flo (rightfully) ranks shak lower. If shak would have wrestled one guy in the top 8, then youd have an arguement that he should have moved up when others lost. (Thats why he was ranked 2. Not gut feeling)

I do understand how they work. I'm saying their system is wrong and bad. I'm not getting defensive, you are.

 

You keep saying he could have moved up. I'm saying he should have never been ranked that low in the first place. No need to move up!

Edited by BigTenFanboy

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Just now, BigTenFanboy said:

I do understand how they work. I'm saying their system is wrong and bad. I'm not getting defensive, you are.

How is it bad or wrong to use data before opinion? If you truly believe that then why dont you start doing rankings. Im gonna assume if your going off gut feelings and opinion, they willl be a lot worse then any of the rankings out there.

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There are people out there who still think Paterno did nothing wrong. Or that's what they say in public.
 
 


You lost any respect you had on this forum for the comment. Congrats. Ignore


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Just now, Molsen said:

How is it bad or wrong to use data before opinion? If you truly believe that then why dont you start doing rankings. Im gonna assume if your going off gut feelings and opinion, they willl be a lot worse then any of the rankings out there.

All rankings are done by gut feeling first, then data second. They're not purely objective. Purely data based objective rankings are bad. That's why rankings are done by people. People are not purely objective. My point is the subjective compent needs to be greater.

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