Spencer Lee did not have riding time.

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

Just now, qc8223 said:

Here we see Rivera doing literally the exact same thing Lee was called for at a different moment in the match.

Where is the hand in the face?

Not there.

[qc8223 327]

Okay, this is obviously a waste of time with you. Spencer Lee definitely had riding time. 

[skikayaker 82]

1 hour ago, stp said:

Brent Fleetwood is gonna shock the world and win NCAA's.

The hands to the face call was a little lame. the right arm was being manipulated by the opponent, and it was used to push away to defend a tie rather than to stall. I think the five count on the leg and the hands to the face rules need to be reevaluated, as does requesting a review. Hands to the face should be treated like a false start, two cautions, and then a point. The leg five count should have a more limited scope as to what constitutes stalling. If you lose a review challenge your opponent gets a point like with International rules.

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

10 minutes ago, qc8223 said:

Okay, this is obviously a waste of time with you. Spencer Lee definitely had riding time. 

he definitely didnt. He had :58 in riding time.

[VakAttack 1,978]

In a truly tough break for BTFB, I've gone back and counted the riding time.  Lee should have had at least 1:20 of RT.  No RT accrued in period 1.  In period 2, they give Rivera 25 seconds of RT when clearly Lee has escaped with 1:36 left and possibly even 1:37, putting Lee 24 seconds in the hole.  Lee then gets the TD at 46 seconds left and rides all 46 seconds, putting him at positive 22 seconds of RT.  He then rides Rivera for 58 seconds, putting him at 1:20, and thus with the newly discovered 20 seconds that Rivera has been awarded by BTFB, there's still 1:00 on RT on the clock for Lee when the match expires.  A tough break for a truly valiant effort.

Edited March 11 by VakAttack
Clearing up pronoun issues

[TBar1977 3,258]

Vak, can you do an analysis on the whole Hands to the Face thing?  Can we say that the match should not have gone to OT? That Spencer Lee should rightfully have won the match? Can we get there? 

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

3 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

In a truly tough break for BTFB, I've gone back and counted the riding time.  Lee should have had at least 1:20 of RT.  No RT accrued in period 1.  In period 2, they give Rivera 25 seconds of RT when clearly he has escaped with 1:36 left and possibly even 1:37, putting him 24 seconds in the hole.  He then gets the TD at 46 seconds left and rides all 46 seconds, putting him at positive 22 seconds of RT.  He then rides Rivera for 58 seconds, putting him at 1:20, and thus with the newly discovered 20 seconds that Rivera has been awarded by BTFB, there's still 1:00 on RT on the clock for Lee when the match expires.  A tough break for a truly valiant effort.

Please provide the video evidence with exact start at stop times. Spencer Lee had :58 in riding time.

[VakAttack 1,978]

1 minute ago, TBar1977 said:

Vak, can you do an analysis on the whole Hands to the Face thing?  Can we say that the match should not have gone to OT? That Spencer Lee should rightfully have won the match? Can we get there? 

I think the rule is stupid in general that it's an automatic point, so yeah, lol.  Especially in that scenario, when Rivera has both arms jacked up and he's trying to clear ties.  I do appreciate the need for some form of the rule, and I commented earlier that we're seeing a lot less of the head taps that became into the eyes, something that both you (Retherford) and I (St. John) know a lot about.

[VakAttack 1,978]

1 minute ago, BigTenFanboy said:

Please provide the video evidence with exact start at stop times. Spencer Lee had :58 in riding time.

Take your loss by technicality like a man, like Spencer did.

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

1 minute ago, VakAttack said:

I think the rule is stupid in general that it's an automatic point, so yeah, lol.  Especially in that scenario, when Rivera has both arms jacked up and he's trying to clear ties.  I do appreciate the need for some form of the rule, and I commented earlier that we're seeing a lot less of the head taps that became into the eyes, something that both you (Retherford) and I (St. John) know a lot about.

Coleman Scott against Matt Valenti

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

Just now, VakAttack said:

Take your loss by technicality like a man, like Spencer did.

Spencer lost. 

I didnt.

[TBar1977 3,258]

1 minute ago, VakAttack said:

I think the rule is stupid in general that it's an automatic point, so yeah, lol.  Especially in that scenario, when Rivera has both arms jacked up and he's trying to clear ties.  I do appreciate the need for some form of the rule, and I commented earlier that we're seeing a lot less of the head taps that became into the eyes, something that both you (Retherford) and I (St. John) know a lot about.

Good response. 

[unbiased 419]

4 minutes ago, BigTenFanboy said:

Spencer lost. 

I didnt.

[qc8223 327]

10 minutes ago, BigTenFanboy said:

Spencer lost. 

I didnt.

Yes. And nobody is arguing different. We're just saying your riding time thing is dumb, which it is.

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

4 minutes ago, qc8223 said:

Yes. And nobody is arguing different. We're just saying your riding time thing is dumb, which it is.

its not though. Spencer had :58 in riding time.

[qc8223 327]

Just now, BigTenFanboy said:

its not though. Spencer had :58 in riding time.

Except that he didn't. Other than that, you're spot on.

[VakAttack 1,978]

1 minute ago, BigTenFanboy said:

its not though. Spencer had :58 in riding time.

Prove it.

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

1 minute ago, VakAttack said:

Prove it.

I did.

1:18

takedown with :20 to go.

:58 in riding time.

[VakAttack 1,978]

4 minutes ago, BigTenFanboy said:

I did.

1:18

takedown with :20 to go.

:58 in riding time.

That's just the official clock saying his riding time was 1:18 at that time.  If we can't trust the clock officials or the referees regarding the awarding of a takedown and are now making these decisions based on your opinion, why should we trust their riding time calculations?

Edited March 11 by VakAttack

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

Just now, VakAttack said:

That's just the official clock saying his riding time was 1:18 at that time.  If we can't trust the clock officials or the referees regarding the awarding of a takedown, why should we trust their riding time calculations?

The TD was awarded 4 seconds late and it ticked up 2 seconds in the wrong direction before coming back down. The "official" clock said riding time was 1:08. When the clock runs the wrong way, you cant trust it.

[VakAttack 1,978]

1 minute ago, BigTenFanboy said:

The TD was awarded 4 seconds late and it ticked up 2 seconds in the wrong direction before coming back down. The "official" clock said riding time was 1:08. When the clock runs the wrong way, you cant trust it.

EXACTLY!

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

Just now, VakAttack said:

EXACTLY!

Yes. Hence why Spencer only had :58 in riding time.

[gimpeltf 961]

43 minutes ago, BigTenFanboy said:

The TD was awarded 4 seconds late and it ticked up 2 seconds in the wrong direction before coming back down. The "official" clock said riding time was 1:08. When the clock runs the wrong way, you cant trust it.

Even that would make it one minute exactly. Four plus four is eight

[VakAttack 1,978]

49 minutes ago, BigTenFanboy said:

Yes. Hence why Spencer only had :58 in riding time.

So, trust the clock, but also, DON'T trust the clock.

[BigTenFanboy 1,515]

9 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

Even that would make it one minute exactly. Four plus four is eight

Your forgetting to count the addtional seconds for the reverse.