BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 Yanni D beat... 8th place Red in R2 4th place Demas in the quarters 3rd place Eirman in the semis 2nd place McKenna in the finals. 1 KTG119 reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 Gonna be tough to top Lewis at 165.Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk 1 Perry reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 3 minutes ago, VakAttack said: Gonna be tough to top Lewis at 165. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Beating 2,3,4,8 imo is better than beating 2,4,7. With that said Lewis absolutely without question deserved the OW. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 Beating 2,3,4,8 imo is better than beating 2,4,7. With that said Lewis absolutely without question deserved the OW.He beat Marinelli and Joseph. Those two are better wrestlers than McKenna and anyone else in the 141 bracket.Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk 1 simple reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 1 minute ago, VakAttack said: He beat Marinelli and Joseph. Those two are better wrestlers than McKenna and anyone else in the 141 bracket. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk McKenna - 2x 3rd prior to this weekend and Final X Finalist. I give McKenna the edge over Marinelli at this point. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 McKenna - 2x 3rd prior to this weekend and Final X Finalist. I give McKenna the edge over Marinelli at this point.You can if you want to. They're wrestling in different brackets. 165 is a much better weight. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 1 minute ago, VakAttack said: You can if you want to. They're wrestling in different brackets. 165 is a much better weight. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Question never was what was the better weight. It was about the specific path followed to their title. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 Question never was what was the better weight. It was about the specific path followed to their title.It was about toughest path, which implies the best wrestlers beaten. If you want to talk who beat the most high places, go for it. That's just math though.Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scribe 1,654 Report post Posted March 25 Places are results. The rest is theory. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 (edited) 3 minutes ago, VakAttack said: It was about toughest path, which implies the best wrestlers beaten. If you want to talk who beat the most high places, go for it. That's just math though. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Nothing was implied. I'm making an objective observation, while yours is subjective and theoretical, just like scribe said. Edited March 25 by BigTenFanboy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 Places are results. The rest is theory. But they have no context outside of their own weight. If in a group of 16 AAs from 141 and 165, the 8 from 165 are all better than all of the 141s, did the 141 champ have a tougher bracket even though he was beating inferior wrestlers? Im not saying its that stark, and in fact I'd sat Yianni is the best wrestler of all 16, but if you want to debate who beat higher placing wrestlers, that is devoid of context or nuance. It's just the numbers next to their names.Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrStrange 88 Report post Posted March 25 I have the toughest path. I have to lose about 70 lbs., get in shape while staying healthy, get my NCAA eligibility back, pick a school, crack the lineup, qualify through my conference, and then win the NCAAs. 2 GranbyTroll and BigTenFanboy reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 2 minutes ago, VakAttack said: But they have no context outside of their own weight. If in a group of 16 AAs from 141 and 165, the 8 from 165 are all better than all of the 141s, did the 141 champ have a tougher bracket even though he was beating inferior wrestlers? Im not saying its that stark, and in fact I'd sat Yianni is the best wrestler of all 16, but if you want to debate who beat higher placing wrestlers, that is devoid of context or nuance. It's just the numbers next to their names. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk And? Objectively with the way the 141 bracket fell for Yanni D he faced the tougher path to his title. I never said the 1 weigh class's 8 AAs are better than the other. You did though, which is arguable. You also said Marinelli and Joseph is better than McKenna. Objectively speaking McKenna has accomplished more at the senior level than either of them. I was under the impression that Senior level accomplishments trump age level NCAA accomplishments. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 And? Objectively with the way the 141 bracket fell for Yanni D he faced the tougher path to his title. I never said the 1 weigh class's 8 AAs are better than the other. You did though, which is arguable. You also said Marinelli and Joseph is better than McKenna. Objectively speaking McKenna has accomplished more at the senior level than either of them. I was under the impression that Senior level accomplishments trump age level NCAA accomplishments.The tougher path at the very least insinuates that he beat the tougher wrestlers, since you're comparing across weights. If you want to say he beat the highest places, go for it. It just doesn't really lend itself to a message board discussion. It's just numbers without context.Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 (edited) 7 minutes ago, VakAttack said: The tougher path at the very least insinuates that he beat the tougher wrestlers, since you're comparing across weights. If you want to say he beat the highest places, go for it. It just doesn't really lend itself to a message board discussion. It's just numbers without context. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Ok so Lewis beat Marinelli, Wick and Joseph. Yanni beat Red, Demas, Eierman and McKenna. You claim that Marinelli and Joseph is better than McKenna. I think McKenna with his senior level accomplishments is better, I think Eierman is better than Wick. I think Red and Demas are better than Coy and McCormack. Edited March 25 by BigTenFanboy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silverback 36 Report post Posted March 25 (edited) One and 4 are on the same side of the bracket. Three and two are on the other side. Can't beat 4, 3, and 2 in the same tournament. Edited March 25 by silverback grammar Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 1 minute ago, silverback said: One and 4 are on the same side of the bracket. Three and two is on the other side. Can't beat 4, 3, and 2 in the same tournament. False, you're talking about seeds. I'm talking place finishers. http://arena.flowrestling.org/event/097e53e8-3ef4-476e-8170-27a58f550378 Take a look. Yanni beat the 2,3,4 and 8th place finishers on his path to his title. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silverback 36 Report post Posted March 25 Misunderstood, sorry. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrStrange 88 Report post Posted March 25 1 minute ago, BigTenFanboy said: False, you're talking about seeds. I'm talking place finishers. http://arena.flowrestling.org/event/097e53e8-3ef4-476e-8170-27a58f550378 Take a look. Yanni beat the 2,3,4 and 8th place finishers on his path to his title. Nobody wins in forum arguments. Nobody changes their mind. 2 BigTenFanboy and JHRoseWrestling reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 Ok so Lewis beat Marinelli, Wick and Joseph. Yanni beat Red, Demas, Eierman and McKenna. You claim that Marinelli and Joseph is better than McKenna. I think McKenna with his senior level accomplishments is better, I think Eierman is better than Wick. I think Red and Demas are better than Coy and McCormack.Fine. I disagree, but you're entitled to your opinion.Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 1 minute ago, VakAttack said: Fine. I disagree, but you're entitled to your opinion. Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Which part do you disagree with? Do you think Wick is better than Eierman? Or the other guys that Lewis wrestled are better than Red or Demas? What makes Marinelli or Joseph better than McKenna in your opinion? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VakAttack 1,993 Report post Posted March 25 Yes to you first two questions. I believe both are more well-rounded folkstyle wrestlers and incredibly hard-nosed and physical (hard hand fighting, heavy on the head), which is difficult to wrestle, plus Joseph is more athletic. McKenna is meat and potatoes and not overly physical.Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Perry 956 Report post Posted March 25 I'm siding with Vak on this, Lewis at 165 had the toughest path imo. 141 was a tough weight with some solid talent but 165 was one of the toughest weights once again this season. You can call marinelli a 7th place finisher but remember he beat a previous 3rd place finisher just for the right to aa before falling to this year's third right after that. Lewis went through a gauntlet and came out on top, hes gotta be #1 on this list Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTenFanboy 1,516 Report post Posted March 25 Just now, Perry said: I'm siding with Vak on this, Lewis at 165 had the toughest path imo. 141 was a tough weight with some solid talent but 165 was one of the toughest weights once again this season. You can call marinelli a 7th place finisher but remember he beat a previous 3rd place finisher just for the right to aa before falling to this year's third right after that. Lewis went through a gauntlet and came out on top, hes gotta be #1 on this list Lewis path was Coy DNP, McCormack DNP, Marinelli 7, Wick 4, and Joseph 2. Yanni's path was Lipari DNP, Red 8, Demas 4, Eierman 3, McKenna 2 Lewis beat 3 top level wrestlers, Yanni beat 4 objectively facing more "landmines." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tigerfan 107 Report post Posted March 25 Aren't McKenna and Eierman on our World team in freestyle as well? Is Marinelli? Is Cenzo? Both had tough roads, if you ask me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
