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NJDan

Is Yianni the Second Best Ever?

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Cael aside, does Yianni, with two titles and just one loss, have the best record ever after his sophomore year (true soph, by the way)?

He has a better record than Dake or Pat Smith or Stieber. Better than Nolf or Bo or Hall or Metcalf or Taylor.

Maybe Imar is the only one who can equal him. Or are there others? 

Edited by NJDan

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13 minutes ago, ThorsteinV said:

I assume Dan Gable would qualify, right?

Right, my bad. Other than Cael and Gable... Of course Gable cheated by having his first two years start from his sophomore year.

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25 minutes ago, NJDan said:

Cael aside, does Yianni, with two titles and just one loss, have the best record ever after his sophomore year (true soph, by the way)?

He has a better record than Dake or Pat Smith or Stieber. Better than Nolf or Bo or Hall or Metcalf or Taylor.

Maybe Imar is the only one who can equal him. Or are there others? 

I asked this in another thread.  Imar was 67-1 with two titles compared to Yianni at 66-1 with two titles.

 

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2 minutes ago, NJDan said:

Who was Imar's loss to?

 

Byers' recap...

157: Red-shirt freshman Jason Nolf (Yatesboro, Pa.), ranked No. 3 at 157, met No. 1 Isaiah Martinez, the defending NCAA Champion, who entered the dual meet undefeated as a collegian. Nolf looked to set the tempo early, keeping a fast tempo in the center of the mat. Martinez responded with quick shots on the edge of the mat with neither man breaking through for any offense early, despite the up temp pace. Nolf countered a Martinez shot and worked his way around for takedown and a 2-0 lead at the 1:39 mark. Martinez escaped to a 2-1 score with under a minute to go. Martinez got in on a high single and took Nolf down to take a 3-2 lead with 0:35 on the clock. After a reset with 0:20 on the clock, Nolf steadily worked his way to an escape and a 3-3 tie with :02 on the clock. Illinois challenged the escape call but it stood and the bout moved to the second period tied 3-3. Nolf chose down to start the second period and quickly escaped to a 4-3 lead, with Martinez getting a first stall warning. Nolf took a 4-3 lead on a second Martinez stall with 1:10 on the clock. Nolf gained control of Martinez's shoulders at the :30 mark and nearly worked his way around for a takedown but the Illini was able to force a stalemate. Nolf, continuing his furious offensive pace, took a low shot that Martinez tried to counter, forcing a scramble in the middle of the mat. With the momentum in Nolf's favor over the full second period, Nolf turned the scramble into a takedown and then a chance to pick up the pin. The Lion freshman deftly forced Martinez's shoulders flat and got the fall, a second period pin at the 4:56 mark.

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1 hour ago, NJDan said:

Right, my bad. Other than Cael and Gable... Of course Gable cheated by having his first two years start from his sophomore year.

Those were the rules back then, plus at the Midlands, which he won his freshman year and got OW, he beat Masaaki Hatta and Don Behm....Hatta and NCAA Champion, and Behm a silver medalist in both the Olympics and World Championships.

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42 minutes ago, fadzaev2 said:

Those were the rules back then, plus at the Midlands, which he won his freshman year and got OW, he beat Masaaki Hatta and Don Behm....Hatta and NCAA Champion, and Behm a silver medalist in both the Olympics and World Championships.

Don't get me wrong: Gable was pretty good.

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14 minutes ago, Katie said:

There were a number of undefeated wrestlers in the days when freshman weren’t allowed to compete.

One such wrestler was Uetake, who also won an Olympic gold medal right after his sophomore year (the first year he was eligible).

But is being undefeated in 15 matches, mostly duals, the same as 35-0, while wrestling in three tournaments, plus duals?

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1 hour ago, NJDan said:

But is being undefeated in 15 matches, mostly duals, the same as 35-0, while wrestling in three tournaments, plus duals?

No. No it isnt. Cannot compare old timer wrestling to today. When I watch Gable vs Owings, I can't believe what I am watching. Yianni would major Gable at the very least.

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The opening question is an insult to more wrestling greats than I can possibly name. In my opinion, he actually was lucky he had the ref he had against McKenna in the NCAA 2019 finals. That being said, I have a lot of respect for Yianni, and he's one of my favorite active NCAA wrestlers, but please, he hasn't earned the status. Frankly, I think his competition has yet to avail itself. It takes more than two years of college wrestling to assess the opening statement of "best ever".

Edited by skikayaker

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8 hours ago, skikayaker said:

The opening question is an insult to more wrestling greats than I can possibly name. In my opinion, he actually was lucky he had the ref he had against McKenna in the NCAA 2019 finals. That being said, I have a lot of respect for Yianni, and he's one of my favorite active NCAA wrestlers, but please, he hasn't earned the status. Frankly, I think his competition has yet to avail itself. It takes more than two years of college wrestling to assess the opening statement of "best ever".

I think it was a character on "Game of Thrones" who said "everything before the 'but' is bull****."

And perhaps you should read the OP before responding.  Let me help you here:  "does Yianni, with two titles and just one loss, have the best record ever after his sophomore year".  How, exactly, does that insult anyone, much less the "wrestling greats?"

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10 hours ago, bsharp2384 said:

No. No it isnt. Cannot compare old timer wrestling to today. When I watch Gable vs Owings, I can't believe what I am watching. Yianni would major Gable at the very least.

If you want to compare wrestlers from different eras, like Gable and Yianni, either time machine Yianni back to the 1960s or move Gable to the present. Otherwise it's just bogus yapping. It's really quite impossible for Gable to be wrestling today with techniques from the 1960s and vice versa for Yianni. 

Also, most of the great wrestlers, including Gable and John Smith, were great competitors first, wrestlers second. People aren't born great wrestlers, they get there through extraordinary work and desire. 

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Great point, headache, about being great competitors first and the work ethic. I have been to 47 NCAA tournaments and feel I have some perspective. I I have been on the mat with Gable and it was an incredible experience. Talk to anyone from those days and you will understand that Gable brought something intangible to the mat with him. As pointed out, he won the Midlands as an 18-year-old freshman over some top competition. He never redshirted. His first year of college eligibility, he beat Dave McGuire, the defending NCAA champion, in both the Big 8 and NCAA, handily. (McGuire won the NCAA the next year to finish as a two-timer and one time runner-up). His senior year, Gable moved up a weight to take on the defending NCAA champion, Mike Grant of Oklahoma, in his home arena and beat him 9-4. Gable brought an intensity and commitment that has seldom, if ever, been matched. Ask the Petersons or the Banachs or Chuck Yalga what it was like to wrestle him. He had one loss in 181 matches over 7 years, 13-11.

 

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10 hours ago, skikayaker said:

The opening question is an insult to more wrestling greats than I can possibly name. In my opinion, he actually was lucky he had the ref he had against McKenna in the NCAA 2019 finals. That being said, I have a lot of respect for Yianni, and he's one of my favorite active NCAA wrestlers, but please, he hasn't earned the status. Frankly, I think his competition has yet to avail itself. It takes more than two years of college wrestling to assess the opening statement of "best ever".

In his first 2 years, Yianni has beaten:

Meredith 2x (2-4-2)

Heil (4-1-1)

McKenna 2X (3-3-2) (and I think Yianni won the finals fair and square - I’m of the opinion that it was a makeup call when he should’ve gotten 2 earlier)

Eierman 3x (5-4-3-TBD)

Lee (5-5-TBD-TBD)

 

that’s a pretty good list IMO.  Obviously a lot can happen over his next 2 seasons, but now that he’s halfway to 4, I think you can probably start putting him in the conversation assuming he does actually get 4 titles.

 

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I misinterpreted the meaning of second best ever as for all time, when the OP is suggesting second best ever after two years. There is a big difference. I still feel as though McKenna got a bad call, but that is another can of worms I'd rather not debate.

Edited by skikayaker

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