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Up and coming States.

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11 hours ago, JohnnyThompsonnum1 said:

Does it also help that high school wrestling has grown significantly south of Osage Beach?  When I was a kid, it seemed that Missouri was divided into two.  North of Osage Beach was Missouri, where most schools had wrestling teams and south of Osage Beach was Missouruh where most schools didn't have wrestling programs.  Now, most of those schools in the south have wrestling programs.  For example when I was little Branson high school didn't have wrestling.  Now, they do.  

 

On of the biggest issues IMO with areas outside of where KCMO2 stated is a major lack in FS/GR.  There are limited coaches that really know it and to complete it is almost an all weekend deal.  Traveling Friday Night, for tournament Saturday, then getting back very late Saturday night.  That all adds to the expenses too.  It makes training and competing more complex and challenging.  The kids that do wrestle are in programs where the coaches take them.  Most families don't make weekend wrestling trips.  Time and expense.  So, with competition being 2_3 hours away, kids can't drive themselves and it is far for a day trip every weekend.  So there are just more challenges. You can't have tournaments locally because there isn't enough knowledge, refs, or interest and it makes Zero since for city kids to travel when they have it in their back yard. 

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9 hours ago, scramble said:

I would say this is very possible.  That's why I could never get behind the documentary "the streak". We're they good? Yes.  Did they pass up challenges against in state schools when they might get beat? Without a shred of doubt.  They did get talented kids who moved there.  Which isn't unique.  However, they also would not schedule teams that had a legit chance to beat them.  

They hosted a dual meet tournament every year where they invited and accepted any team that was willing to enter. They put it on the line every year. The team that stopped the streak was a Florida team (South Dade) at that same tournament. Also, Russ went to the Clash, Cheesehead, and other tough tournaments throughout the years. Russ is all class. His son Joe is next in line. Florida's problem is no middle school wrestling throughout much of the state (Miami and Clay counties have MS teams) and lack of quality and depth once you get past the top five teams in each division (1A,2A, and 3A).

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2 minutes ago, CoachWrestling said:

12 NCAA qualifiers isn’t too shabby

No, it is not too shabby at all.  It feels like they have been at about that number of qualifiers and one AA for a number of years.  They aren't an up and coming state because they aren't pushing those numbers up.

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22 hours ago, scramble said:

Blake Stauffer from Southwest MO was a D1 AA for Arizona.  I'm having a memory lapse but there was another kid for Neosho who was an AA for Mizzou back in Brian Smith's early years.  I will remember eventually.   Those are the only two I can think of though since about 2002. 

Yep, that's definitely not the I-70 area.  Neosho's had a strong program for a long time.  Kenny Burleson took 7th for Mizzou in 2004

Edited by KCMO2

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On 3/30/2019 at 10:04 AM, KTG119 said:

Russ Cozart retired didn't he? Maybe not as simple as that but a factor. 

Cozart did retire a few years back and it's difficult to follow a legend.  Not only did he develop talent but they also had families move into the Brandon program.  

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Apologies to Missouri.  I posted them as up and coming. They are totally solid already. I counted the total AA’s from the last 5 years.  These guys would have started wrestling 10-15 years ago. So in a decade and a half development (up and coming change in wrestling culture), the AA’s in past 5 years excluding top ten except Missouri are; Missouri-18, Oklahoma-12, Colorado-8, Indiana-9, Oregon-6, Texas-6, Maryland—6, Georgia-4 and a few others with and the rest with less. 

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Gilman is Iowa.  Every wrestler lists his hometown on his college bio.  All the stats people go off of this.  This year, though Gable Steveson’s Mom continues to live in Michigan, his established residence with dad is Minnesota. Myles Martin is NJ ((where he lives with mom and dad) though he went to HS in Zmaryland. Same with Blair kids. Half are claimed out of state as per parents residence. 

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9 hours ago, KCMO2 said:

Yep, that's definitely not the I-70 area.  Neosho's had a strong program for a long time.  Kenny Burleson took 7th for Mizzou in 2004

Yes, Kenny.  Man I was brain dead on that one. 

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14 hours ago, MikePorcelli said:

They hosted a dual meet tournament every year where they invited and accepted any team that was willing to enter. They put it on the line every year. The team that stopped the streak was a Florida team (South Dade) at that same tournament. Also, Russ went to the Clash, Cheesehead, and other tough tournaments throughout the years. Russ is all class. His son Joe is next in line. Florida's problem is no middle school wrestling throughout much of the state (Miami and Clay counties have MS teams) and lack of quality and depth once you get past the top five teams in each division (1A,2A, and 3A).

Yes, I agree that he is class.  He has been a staple of wrestling in FL.  I agree with the lack of depth and younger aged wrestling being an issue too.  I'm also sure it is true there was a period of time where the dual tournament scenario you stated was true.  However, being born at Miami Dade, growing up, and graduating from FL I know with 100% certainty that early in the streak he declined wrestling teams.  Again... I don't think it has anything to do with his character or as a person.  I'm just saying while it may have been rare there cases that he would not take a dual. This was a long time ago.  Like I said at the beginning.  I can't speak for after.  Only for the years of it when I lived in FL. 

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18 hours ago, Bryan said:

Cozart did retire a few years back and it's difficult to follow a legend.  Not only did he develop talent but they also had families move into the Brandon program.  

Cozart didn't retire. He's still there. He is still the head coach. 

To those saying he is all class - how do you defend him not showing up for the dual meet state tourney? Honestly lost a lot of respect for him. Kind of proves everyone right who was saying that if they knew they couldn't win, they wouldn't show. 

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I think it has a lot to do with Compound wrestling club down there and the Team Minion National team. At the youth level, Minion Black is top 5 everywhere they go. They are building out a very strong youth culture in Georgia 

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29 minutes ago, ptz305 said:

Cozart didn't retire. He's still there. He is still the head coach. 

To those saying he is all class - how do you defend him not showing up for the dual meet state tourney? Honestly lost a lot of respect for him. Kind of proves everyone right who was saying that if they knew they couldn't win, they wouldn't show. 

I apologize but I was told that he retired about five years ago.

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In my mind there are 5 tiers of states for high school/youth wrestling.

The first tier are the ones everyone knows about without thinking: Pennsylvania, Ohio, New Jersey, Iowa, and Minnesota.

The second tier is almost as good as the first tier and may all be underrated: Illinois, Oklahoma, Michigan, New York, Missouri, California, Indiana, Nebraska, and Wisconsin

The third tier is the up and coming states: Georgia, Texas, Florida, Utah, Arizona, and Colorado

The 4th tier is states that used to be better and have dropped off or not improved recently: Virginia, Maryland, North Carolina, West Virginia, and New England

5 Tier: The rest. 

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On ‎3‎/‎29‎/‎2019 at 8:04 PM, Katie said:

Why do you think wrestling is catching on in Georgia?

All of the people relocating from New York and New Jersey.

That is what I have observed. 

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7 hours ago, VAtoSC said:

The second tier is almost as good as the first tier and may all be underrated: Illinois, Oklahoma, Michigan, New York, Missouri, California, Indiana, Nebraska, and Wisconsin

 Personally, I’d take California and Illinois against Minnesota and Iowa who you like placed in first tier. Slightly, but still my opinion. Nebraska just doesn’t seem like a second tier though. Just one ( 1 ) all-American in the past 9 years. 

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15 hours ago, ptz305 said:

Cozart didn't retire. He's still there. He is still the head coach. 

To those saying he is all class - how do you defend him not showing up for the dual meet state tourney? Honestly lost a lot of respect for him. Kind of proves everyone right who was saying that if they knew they couldn't win, they wouldn't show. 

I guess it depends on how a person is viewing class from their perspective.  When I think if it I think in regards to how they present themselves with the interactions with others.  I've saw him years ago in FL and then later in life at some national tournaments.  In my experience I never saw him represent himself poorly.  However, I do know he didn't always take ever dual.  I don't categorize that as a lack of class.  Some top D1 schools didn't attend the national duals.  Such as PSU.  I would not say Sanderson lacks class because of it.  However, other may define it different based on their definition, perspective, and experiences.  

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Gilman is Iowa.  Every wrestler lists his hometown on his college bio.  All the stats people go off of this.  This year, though Gable Steveson’s Mom continues to live in Michigan, his established residence with dad is Minnesota. Myles Martin is NJ ((where he lives with mom and dad) though he went to HS in Zmaryland. Same with Blair kids. Half are claimed out of state as per parents residence. 

I think you are confusing Gable for Mark Hall. Gables family lives in MN.


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