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So, is Jason Nolf the best DI wrestler to never win the Hodge?

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6 hours ago, AKHUNTER said:

I love Nolf as a wrestler............ BUT even he knows he lost that semi match. Life can be strange at times.

No, he didn't lose the match.  You cannot just tack 2 pts on the final score.  If the TD stayed, it changes the entire dynamic of the match and there is no way to tell what the final outcome would have been.

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6 hours ago, spladle said:

No, he didn't lose the match.  You cannot just tack 2 pts on the final score.  If the TD stayed, it changes the entire dynamic of the match and there is no way to tell what the final outcome would have been.

I will agree with half of this. I agree that you can't just "add" two points that weren't there. The score is the score on the board. At the same time, I disagree that you are so confidently predicting the dynamic of the match changed. By saying that you are doing the same thing those who saying "Nolf lost" are doing.

If Hidley gets that takedown I am not convinced Nolf turns it into a different gear and rattles off three takedowns. If he could have done that, he would have because that is what he does. Give a lot of credit to Hidley in that match. I think that was one of those "I'm putting every ounce of blood sweat and tears" into this match. Even if they had wrestled again the next day, the match most likely been much different. It is disrespectful to Hidley and the competitor he is to assume Nolf would have found another gear if he was losing. Mainly, because the Nolf we all watch finds that gear regardless.

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10 hours ago, Lurker said:

Snyder is the best to never win it, although maybe not most deserving because of his schedule. Moving up to take out what many considered the best heavyweight ever at the time, and nobody else came close to him. His junior year nobody came close to him. His senior year obviously he wasn’t deserving with a loss. But as far as “best to never win it”. Snyder takes it. 

Not sure that is obvious. I know a former Hodge winner who got pinned the same year he won it.

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1 hour ago, gopher_fan_90 said:

I will agree with half of this. I agree that you can't just "add" two points that weren't there. The score is the score on the board. At the same time, I disagree that you are so confidently predicting the dynamic of the match changed. By saying that you are doing the same thing those who saying "Nolf lost" are doing.

If Hidley gets that takedown I am not convinced Nolf turns it into a different gear and rattles off three takedowns. If he could have done that, he would have because that is what he does. Give a lot of credit to Hidley in that match. I think that was one of those "I'm putting every ounce of blood sweat and tears" into this match. Even if they had wrestled again the next day, the match most likely been much different. It is disrespectful to Hidley and the competitor he is to assume Nolf would have found another gear if he was losing. Mainly, because the Nolf we all watch finds that gear regardless.

I made no assertion that Nolf would have rattled off 3 TDs had the score been 2 zip going into the 2nd.  

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Both Hidlay's and Nolf's approach to the rest of the match is changed.  The TD or removal thereof has a butterfly effect.  There is no way to know what the rest of the match holds.  The point is that you cannot take the final 3-2 score and just add the TD and say Nolf would have lost.

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I think that is where the two camps are for the most part. Several people are acting like the no-call wouldn't have made a difference because Nolf would have found a way. The other people are surprised as Nolf has never been controlled or at least not for a while like that where he is in a situation where the match is 3-2 in the final seconds with a leg in the air. Obviously if Nolf was losing one would hope he would have kicked it into the next gear. The way he always wrestles, and the way he looked in that Semi, I'm not convinced he finds a way. At the end of the day, Nolf got his hand raised, destroyed Berger and I don't look at his title with an asterisk.

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Nolf scored on a reshot early in the 2nd period.  Maybe Hidlay shuts down and gets called for stalling.  Maybe Nolf opens up and takes bigger chances.  Maybe the whole match plays out the same.  Point is, there is no way to know.

Edited by spladle

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17 hours ago, AKHUNTER said:

I love Nolf as a wrestler............ BUT even he knows he lost that semi match. Life can be strange at times.

I do not understand this argument...

I agree that the non-takedown by Hidlay early on in the match should have been called a takedown. However, just because adding 2 points to Hidlay's total means he wins 4-3 doesn't mean Nolf lost the match. Having seen Nolf respond to being taken down, chances are he rebounds and gets a takedown or two himself to still win the match. And that near takedown at the end of the match was not a takedown, so to say that Nolf "knows he lost that semi match" is a little ignorant.

In my opinion, if Nolf gives up that takedown early on and it's called, it lights a fire under him and he wins by more than 1...But I am not out here saying "Nolf knows he really won by more."

P.S. I am about as far from a PSU fan as it gets.

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17 hours ago, AKHUNTER said:

I love Nolf as a wrestler............ BUT even he knows he lost that semi match. Life can be strange at times.

I do not understand this argument...

I agree that the non-takedown by Hidlay early on in the match should have been called a takedown. However, just because adding 2 points to Hidlay's total means he wins 4-3 doesn't mean Nolf lost the match. Having seen Nolf respond to being taken down, chances are he rebounds and gets a takedown or two himself to still win the match. And that near takedown at the end of the match was not a takedown, so to say that Nolf "knows he lost that semi match" is a little ignorant.

In my opinion, if Nolf gives up that takedown early on and it's called, it lights a fire under him and he wins by more than 1...But I am not out here saying "Nolf knows he really won by more."

P.S. I am about as far from a PSU fan as it gets.

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8 minutes ago, ILL1617 said:

I do not understand this argument...

I agree that the non-takedown by Hidlay early on in the match should have been called a takedown. However, just because adding 2 points to Hidlay's total means he wins 4-3 doesn't mean Nolf lost the match. Having seen Nolf respond to being taken down, chances are he rebounds and gets a takedown or two himself to still win the match. And that near takedown at the end of the match was not a takedown, so to say that Nolf "knows he lost that semi match" is a little ignorant.

In my opinion, if Nolf gives up that takedown early on and it's called, it lights a fire under him and he wins by more than 1...But I am not out here saying "Nolf knows he really won by more."

P.S. I am about as far from a PSU fan as it gets.

What happened in that match to lead you to believe Nolf could get 1-2 takedowns on his own or goes on a tear if he is down? You are making that assumption because of Nolfs normal dominance and ignoring what was happening in this match. Nolf couldn't get past the good D. If I look at his other matches he usually starts scoring at will in the first period too and got nothing in this match. IN THIS MATCH Hidlay had shut down his offense. 

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The real loser of the Nolf-Hidlay match at this year's NCAAs are the fans. We were robbed of an exciting finals match because of the incorrect call, and the aftermath continues to drag on. I think everyone would agree that it would take more than a 2-0 lead in the first period to shut down Jason Nolf. We would have been in for a thrilling 2nd and 3rd period but instead we just got Nolf wrestling defensively and maybe the missed call getting into Hidlay's head and messing with his wrestling. 

Anyway, I still think Nolf is one of the GOATs and was deserving of the Hodge. He used his creativity on the mat to dominate his opponent in far more interesting ways than Nickal, who just sort of horsed his guys over. It's crazy how a single match, even if it's a win, can derail a Hodge campaign but I guess that's how tight of a race it is among the best of the best wrestlers. 

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30 minutes ago, ILL1617 said:

 my opinion, if Nolf gives up that takedown early on and it's called, it lights a fire under him and he wins by more than 1.

I don't know how no one else noticed this, but I actually saw Hidlay telling the refs to take the 2 away. He knew Nolf would really turn it on if he was down 2-0 and it would turn into a blowout. Hidlay had seen it while studying tape. Scoring a TD that early was not part of his game plan, which was to keep it as close as possible and then score in the final seconds. So he asked the refs to kindly ignore his accidental TD and get his plan back on track. And it almost worked as he was only a couple of seconds from scoring the winning TD at the buzzer.

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9 hours ago, Billyhoyle said:

The best wrestler never to win a Hodge is Dan Hodge. 

Yes but he received the ultimate honor of having the award named after him. Kind of one-upping the winners and in that regard he wins it every year. 

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16 hours ago, TobusRex said:

I thought the whole point of the Hodge was falls, not TECH falls. That rules Snyder out immediately.

Well I mean I did say best, although maybe not most deserving. The question in the title is “best”...right?

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6 hours ago, TheOhioState said:

Not sure that is obvious. I know a former Hodge winner who got pinned the same year he won it.

But with the likes of Retherford, Nickal, Nolf, etc in the race?? in a year you have guys with records like that in the running, having a loss makes it pretty obvious.  

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14 minutes ago, spladle said:

I get it, you think Hidlay won.  Get over it already.

Did I say that? Where did I say that? Please show me. I was simply pointing out no one forgot that match on this forum years later. Why exactly are you butt hurt over me saying that? 

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1 hour ago, russelscout said:

Like Hendricks/Churella?

It will probably fall more into the camp of the hall/bo Jordan match that hall had no right to win. 

Edited by Perry

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