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2019/2020 NCAA Rule Proposals

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On 4/30/2019 at 5:23 PM, Jim L said:

Why the strong feelings about headgear?

Of all the things to worry about, this seems pretty minor.

It’s an easy win for all. Wrestlers don’t want to were it, we won’t have to see matches being ruined by a grab

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14 hours ago, gowrestle said:

The medical committee will never approve it. Cauliflower ear looks stupid and is another thing that hurts wrestling. There are many reasons why high school programs are suffering. No doubt some parents equate wrestling with ear disfigurement and won’t  let their son’s wrestle. 

I see your point. But parents that let there kids wrestle enough to get cauliflower ear don’t care that much if they get it. It’s a badge of honor. It says I am a bad dude. Parents don’t let there kids wrestle because they think it is too violent and they don’t understand it. They think it is safer to play basketball.

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1 hour ago, BobbyGribbs said:

I see your point. But parents that let there kids wrestle enough to get cauliflower ear don’t care that much if they get it. It’s a badge of honor. It says I am a bad dude. Parents don’t let there kids wrestle because they think it is too violent and they don’t understand it. They think it is safer to play basketball.

For those that think it’s a badge of honor, it’s really a badge of stupidity. The toughest guy I coached became a Navy Seal. He didn’t need a tattoo or a disfigured ear to show the world he was tough. His toughness was emblazoned on his heart. 

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I think weigh-ins is one of the biggest problems that needs to be fixed for competitive balance. Why do we even have weight classes if you weigh-in then go and gain 15 pounds through the day. Mat side weigh-ins would make for more even matches and weight cutting would become less because they would find out how much it really affects your conditioning. 

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On 5/1/2019 at 11:59 PM, gowrestle said:

For those that think it’s a badge of honor, it’s really a badge of stupidity. The toughest guy I coached became a Navy Seal. He didn’t need a tattoo or a disfigured ear to show the world he was tough. His toughness was emblazoned on his heart. 

Oh I understand your point...but I am stating a point about many parents and wrestlers. I run into many parents that look at Wrestling as the gateway to MMA for their youth and the parent to live vicariously through.  It is not an all statement. And really toughness comes in many forms, as a former wrestler and a Veteran I have seen some tough Cooks, tough supply people, tough Mechanics, tough plumbers, etc. I don't understand the conversation we are continuing? 

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On 5/2/2019 at 11:30 AM, Gantry said:

What is the logic of going from one hour to two hour weighins?  To me it seems like it'll only encourage more cutting...

It’s hard to imagine this might be the reason given its an NCAA rule, but maybe they want it to be the same as freestyle? They do have Olympic shirts, after all, which do zero for the NCAA but help the Olympic process. I can’t really think of any other reason. 

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On 5/3/2019 at 11:06 AM, BobbyGribbs said:

Oh I understand your point...but I am stating a point about many parents and wrestlers. I run into many parents that look at Wrestling as the gateway to MMA for their youth and the parent to live vicariously through.  It is not an all statement. And really toughness comes in many forms, as a former wrestler and a Veteran I have seen some tough Cooks, tough supply people, tough Mechanics, tough plumbers, etc. I don't understand the conversation we are continuing? 

Well stated. But parents thinking wrestling can be a path to MMA are just as delusional as little league parents hoping their son makes it to MLB. Regardless of sport, participation for youngsters is intended to provide valuable life experiences. Parents pushing their children into sports hoping for more, will likely turn off their child and ultimately be disappointed. 

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On 5/1/2019 at 5:10 AM, gowrestle said:

The medical committee will never approve it. Cauliflower ear looks stupid and is another thing that hurts wrestling. There are many reasons why high school programs are suffering. No doubt some parents equate wrestling with ear disfigurement and won’t  let their son’s wrestle. 

I think the future may be in helmets like the Mercado or something similar. It might seem dumb to old school guys, but (assuming the product works and is comfortable enough to wear) I'm guessing that parents will want to err on the side of caution with all the CTE reports in the news lately, and kids might like them because they look cool and I guess will allow their heads and ears to facilitate harder contact while wrestling. It just has to reach a tipping point for the floodgates to open - the Mercado folks should look into sponsoring D1 teams or maybe even a whole preseason college or national high school tournament (where everyone wears the gear) to move it along. 

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20 hours ago, gowrestle said:

Well stated. But parents thinking wrestling can be a path to MMA are just as delusional as little league parents hoping their son makes it to MLB. Regardless of sport, participation for youngsters is intended to provide valuable life experiences. Parents pushing their children into sports hoping for more, will likely turn off their child and ultimately be disappointed. 

Dead on!

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What parents in their right mind would want their kid to go to MMA?  At least if you don't make it in MLB you spend a couple years in the minors (or not even) and move on with your life. With MMA if you don't make, you end up with brain damage and possibly some type of painkiller addiction.  

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3 hours ago, Billyhoyle said:

What parents in their right mind would want their kid to go to MMA?  At least if you don't make it in MLB you spend a couple years in the minors (or not even) and move on with your life. With MMA if you don't make, you end up with brain damage and possibly some type of painkiller addiction.  

I think you end of that way whether you make it or not. While I understand the entertainment value of MMA, I would NEVER want a family member participating. 

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9 hours ago, gowrestle said:

I think you end of that way whether you make it or not. While I understand the entertainment value of MMA, I would NEVER want a family member participating. 

Yup, MMA or WWE. I was pretty surprised by how enthused Bo Nickal’s mom was about her son going MMA. When asked about the hazards of the sport, she said something like “oh, that’s what doctors are for” - yikes.

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13 hours ago, Billyhoyle said:

What parents in their right mind would want their kid to go to MMA?  At least if you don't make it in MLB you spend a couple years in the minors (or not even) and move on with your life. With MMA if you don't make, you end up with brain damage and possibly some type of painkiller addiction.  

What about parents pushing their kids into Football?  I still love FB (watching only, never played), but all the news about CTE has made it a lot less enjoyable and has also turned me off MMA completely.

It is no longer enjoyable to watch a brutal tackle/kick/punch.  I always end up thinking that guy might never be the same.

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I'm of the mind that weigh-ins should follow the same procedures as the UWW's procedures. They should still have to follow decent plans and safety guidelines for all that, but if it is matside for UWW go matside. If it is 24 hour then go 24 hour. EZPZ.

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On 4/30/2019 at 2:32 PM, IronChef said:

Making Medical Forfeits count as losses will negatively affect more than just the wrestler who forfeits. The reason for the rule is to punish people who drop out of tournaments by lowering their seed at the NCAA championships due to the arcane formula they use. Seeding at the NCAA DI tournament is the only effect of this change. The unintended consequence is how it affects everyone else in the bracket. Do we really want a potential national finalist knocked into the consolation because the best guy sprained his ankle at the Southern Scuffle and then dropped out of the B1G tournament with a tweaked knee? The point of seeding is to separate the top guys in the weight. Anything that artificially affects that is a negative. 

I worry less about seeding than about conference AQ allocations and at-large bids. Both of those are driven by formulas that factor in win% and MFFs would be a killer. It's bad for real injuries, and it's even bad when it's just a coach's choice to bail. As much as I'm sure that it's cool to finish in 3rd place at the Mat-Town Open, if your coach has decided that 4 matches is enough for a day in November, that shouldn't be held against the wrestler when he's told to skip the consolation final.

Edited by ugarte

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On 5/3/2019 at 11:06 AM, BobbyGribbs said:

Oh I understand your point...but I am stating a point about many parents and wrestlers. I run into many parents that look at Wrestling as the gateway to MMA for their youth and the parent to live vicariously through.  It is not an all statement. And really toughness comes in many forms, as a former wrestler and a Veteran I have seen some tough Cooks, tough supply people, tough Mechanics, tough plumbers, etc. I don't understand the conversation we are continuing? 

Just one more headgear point. 45 years ago I was working a summer camp as a counselor. At dinner one night I was at a table with Thad Turner from Lehigh, Bill Koll from Penn State, and Doug Parker from Springfield. I was still in college at that time and was an aspiring high school coach. We got on the point of headgear and all of those coaches felt it was important to require its use. I clearly remember Koll saying, “If you care about wrestling you will make your kids wear headgear.”  That conversation had a big impact on my opinion about headgear  By the way, those 3 coaches had a huge impact on the development of east coast wrestling  

 

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Wrestlers don’t like wearing headgear, and I personally know a few guys who got cauliflower ear despite wearing it religiously. Most D1 guys have it by the time they walk into the practice room already. Making it optional seems like a win for all parties-fewer matches tarnished by a headgear grab, guys who want to wear it can continue to do so, while guys who are bothered by it will be free to not wear it. Seems to me the only people concerned about getting rid of headgear are mothers of wrestlers and the same over the hill fans who would bring back horsehair mats, leggings, and practicing in rubber suits if they could. 

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17 hours ago, gowrestle said:

Just one more headgear point. 45 years ago I was working a summer camp as a counselor. At dinner one night I was at a table with Thad Turner from Lehigh, Bill Koll from Penn State, and Doug Parker from Springfield. I was still in college at that time and was an aspiring high school coach. We got on the point of headgear and all of those coaches felt it was important to require its use. I clearly remember Koll saying, “If you care about wrestling you will make your kids wear headgear.”  That conversation had a big impact on my opinion about headgear  By the way, those 3 coaches had a huge impact on the development of east coast wrestling  

 

I have to say I always encourage the use of headgear. I even try and promote the forehead protection especially in the youth. But, at the collegiate level why is it mandatory and not at the international? I just advocate for safety but if a NCAA wrestler doesn’t like headgear he or she shouldn’t have to wear it

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On 6/2/2019 at 11:12 PM, BobbyGribbs said:

I have to say I always encourage the use of headgear. I even try and promote the forehead protection especially in the youth. But, at the collegiate level why is it mandatory and not at the international? I just advocate for safety but if a NCAA wrestler doesn’t like headgear he or she shouldn’t have to wear it

Cauliflower ear is a black eye on wrestling. Young kids see their college heroes with one, they want one. For no other reason, keep the college guys wearing headgear for the purpose of promoting wrestling as a wholesome activity. On another note, I am seeing more top guys wearing headgear all the time because they don’t want cauliflower ear. Nick Suriano is an example. 

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On 6/2/2019 at 11:54 AM, Underhook said:

Wrestlers don’t like wearing headgear, and I personally know a few guys who got cauliflower ear despite wearing it religiously. Most D1 guys have it by the time they walk into the practice room already. Making it optional seems like a win for all parties-fewer matches tarnished by a headgear grab, guys who want to wear it can continue to do so, while guys who are bothered by it will be free to not wear it. Seems to me the only people concerned about getting rid of headgear are mothers of wrestlers and the same over the hill fans who would bring back horsehair mats, leggings, and practicing in rubber suits if they could. 

Nope. Not in favor of horse hair mats, tights, and plastics. But am interested in wrestling developing/maintaining  a positive image. Also, don’t underestimate a mother’s influence on what her children do and that’s a good thing.  

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