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Is what Deakin did more impressive than Yianni?

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The reaction to Yianni’s wins seems to be much bigger than Deakin’s.  Roughly same age (right?), and Deakin beat a multi-time world medalist who has held the world team spot for many years.  Yianni didn’t beat a world medalist.

Both are amazing.  But Deakin is being a bit overshadowed.  Perhaps undeservedly so.

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I think it's because people (including me) think it's more of a "fluke" than an ongoing thing.  I think that if Green & Deakin wrestled 9 more times, Green wins 8 of them.  But... then again, there are those "freestyle savants" per se.  Maybe Deakin is one of them?  

Regardless, your point is well made.  If Nolf beat Green, then Nolf would be officially proclaimed as the 2nd coming.  Yianni beat some "really good" guys, but not guys with International Medal history.  

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Well when you think about it, this is a pretty good question. Yes Yianni downed three guys that are highly regarded, but JG is a multi AA, and a Multi World medalist. But I think that if Deakin holds onto the spot and makes the World Team by either beating JG again or downing Nolf, you would certainly have to look at this in a different light. If Deakin does make the team, I would love to see him win a medal or the Championship at the World's. 

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the only comment i would make here is that yanni did wizard **** on the mat this weekend... stuff that we have never seen before... who he beat was secondary to what he did while doing it...

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Actually I completely forgot Deakin beat Yianni the last time Yianni went out for a world team spot(Juniors, but still). He then went on to garner silver.

This being said I think another reason it is being written off is that Green actually tried to go down to 65kg last Oly trials and got tooled... badly. Molinaro may have lost to Green when he went up but he was still super successful. As was Oliver and Kennedy. So folks discredit the international medals with H2H domestic results.

We all k ow that Green never should have tried to drop, and I honestly believe he took a year or two away from his prime because of it. Next year he will either give e 74 a go, hang them up, or be content chasing 70 for non-Oly worlds while others chase Oly aspirations.

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Yeah, it's definitely more surprising and I'll take a James Green win over the 3 0x world medalists that Yianni beat. I think what made Yianni's performance so impressive was how dominant he was compared to Deakin. 

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I like this question. It makes me reflect and wonder if this is the lower weight version of J'Den.  Where Deakin is surrounded by so many big names that he gets lost in the mix and gets underratted.  

A few things give me pause though.  I feel like the win against JG came at the last second from a collision of Deaken staying after it and Green having an error with no time on the clock to account for that collision of scenarios.  However, Yianni scored and won positions simply because he was better in them.  Yiannis situation can be replicated because he largely controlled the scenarios he scored in.  Deakin was able to control wrestling every second, but the error and timing that gave Deakin that last score probably won't be recreated, if that makes since. Nevertheless, you also don't beat Green unless your dam good regardless.  Also, while not world medalists Yianni beat 3 guys who have had international success which was impressive.

I will probably rethink counting Deakin out though after reflecting on it more now.

 

 

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The difference is that Yianni went back-to-back-to-back beating Molinaro, JO and then Retherford. He beat the latter two convincingly and had a solid win over Retherford. The key is that all three of them are considered legitimate world team material. Meanwhile Deakin had solid wins over capable opponents (he beat Chamberlain 12-3 and Pantaleo 8-4) but I don't think anyone would think that those guys were world-team level opponents. It's much easier to believe that Green simply underestimated Deakin, so I wouldn't wager a lot on Deakin beating him again and on top of that I wouldn't wager a lot of Deakin making the world team because it's not clear Green will beat Nolf in a best of three and I think Deakin is going to have a lot of trouble besting Deakin. That's the difference.

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If Yianni's run to the title was an A+, Deakin's was an A.  

Running through Pantaleo, Chamberlain, and then knocking off Green in the finals is an incredible tournament.  How does a guy place 5th at the Big 10 tournament and then win the US Open 6 weeks later?

It will probably take Nolf beating Green at WTT, and then Deakin beating Nolf at Final X for him to get close to the same level of buzz as Yianni. 

Edited by steamboat_charlie v2

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. The win from Deakin looked flukish. He looked pretty bad (by his standard) at NCAAs. He also didn't beat a bunch of guys who were truly vying for the spot. If he beat Nolf in the semis, there would be way more hype behind him

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Despite being a different style, it's hard to unsee Nolf nearly teching Deakin at the dual this year.  I'm a NW fan and Deakin looked great at the US Open but if Nolf gets to Final X he's the favorite

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Deakin's best style is clearly FS. What he did is extremely impressive and people aren't giving him a fair shake. Sure, Green has a lot, and I mean A LOT, of close matches with good guys. He went out against Nolf whose best style very well may be folk, at least for the time being, and beat him close and he's done this twice. He went out against Deakin and did the same thing and it didn't work this time around because FS is Deakin's thing. Give Nolf a little to get his body used to FS full time and he's going to be scary. Deakin just has a knack for it and he is scary now. Now he has the luxury of training for 2 or 3 matches for potentially 1 or 2 guys. He's set up extremely well and if he wins the spot it should surprise no one. I am taking Green over Nolf for the third, and perhaps the final, time and I'm taking Green for the spot. But Deakin has the skills to take it to Green and if I'm being honest I think Deakin would beat Nolf 2 matches to none.  To answer the OP, yes it's more impressive because he beat a more credentialed guy to win it and he came out of nowhere for most people while Yianni beat a couple of solid guys but he was in the talks of a title.

Edited by Ragu
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8 hours ago, Gantry said:

Despite being a different style, it's hard to unsee Nolf nearly teching Deakin at the dual this year.  I'm a NW fan and Deakin looked great at the US Open but if Nolf gets to Final X he's the favorite

I'm thinking Hayden Hidlay.  Does everyone remember last year's University World Team Trials.  He snatched it away from Deakin with 2 seconds left on the clock.  I predict if Hidlay shows up, he'll avenge his loss to Nolf and beat Deakin to make the U.S. World Team.

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If Hidlay goes, that puts him as the 3 seed. He'll get Nolf in the semis.

That puts Pantaleo at the 4 with Green at the 1.

They wrestle the matches for a reason, too, so I fully expect some surprises.

Hidlay beating Nolf won't be one of them(my opinion). Pantaleo beating Green may be. Molinaro(who is qualified for both 65 and 70) making some noise may also be a surprise.

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12 hours ago, nhs67 said:

If Hidlay goes, that puts him as the 3 seed. He'll get Nolf in the semis.

That puts Pantaleo at the 4 with Green at the 1.

They wrestle the matches for a reason, too, so I fully expect some surprises.

Hidlay beating Nolf won't be one of them(my opinion). Pantaleo beating Green may be. Molinaro(who is qualified for both 65 and 70) making some noise may also be a surprise.

Is Hidlay even qualified for the WTT?

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I wouldn't be shocked if Hidlay entered at 74kg, dude is huge and I think another 3 pounds lower than his college weight may be too much.  Thinking he goes 165 next year, but based simply on my hunches...

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1 hour ago, Gantry said:

I wouldn't be shocked if Hidlay entered at 74kg, dude is huge and I think another 3 pounds lower than his college weight may be too much.  Thinking he goes 165 next year, but based simply on my hunches...

If I'm Hidlay I'm doing anything I have to do in the off season to keep my weight down in order to make 157 next year.  He is probably the favorite there next year. He'd have trouble AA'ing at 165. IMO theres no way he goes up. 

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I don't disagree his road is easier at 157 but if you're too big you're too big.  But maybe he isn't and I'm full of crap, basing it all off the eye test and the fact that NC State as a whole cuts a ton across their lineup.  Guy looks like Ivan Drago out there...

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