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Jimmy Cinnabon

Rutgers is the key to ending the PSU dynasty - T/F?

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Just now, 1032004 said:

Aren’t they gone?  Which is kinda funny because they were ahead of their time with most people now having no problem buying food from a truck.

I believe they spread them across campus instead of the one location.

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Amazing performance by Rutgers who have never had a national champ and get two this year.  Congratulations to them.  With the talent pool they have close by, you would had thought by now that they would had at least 1 naty champ.  Goes to show that it's not only about the talent but many other things that factor in.  Could they contend for a national championship...don't know but they are on the right path.  To be able to usurp Cael and Penn State, nawww, don't think so anytime soon as long as Cael is coaching but they are closing the gap which is awesome for wrestling all together.  

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8 hours ago, sisi said:

Amazing performance by Rutgers who have never had a national champ and get two this year.  Congratulations to them.  With the talent pool they have close by, you would had thought by now that they would had at least 1 naty champ.  Goes to show that it's not only about the talent but many other things that factor in.  Could they contend for a national championship...don't know but they are on the right path.  To be able to usurp Cael and Penn State, nawww, don't think so anytime soon as long as Cael is coaching but they are closing the gap which is awesome for wrestling all together.  

Living in New Jersey,I follow Rutgers' wrestling pretty closely.

I think that,after next year,Rutgers' wrestling is likely to experience a drop off.

No doubt Ashnault and Suriano helped  raise the program's stature.

But,if recall correctly,Ashnault  only came to RU because of his family's involvement with

the school.

Everyone knows the Suriano story.

From talking to people who are more familiar with the inner workings of Rutgers'

wrestling program,even with  Ashnault  and Suriano,they haven't been able to recruit 

wrestlers of similar caliber.

I think that,once Suriano is gone,recruiting top talent,is going to be even harder.

I know they have a new wrestling facility,but it seems everyone has one now.

How much different /better can Rutgers' be ?

Plus as one poster said,Rutgers is not exactly the most beautiful campus.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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24 minutes ago, rpbobcat said:

Living in New Jersey,I follow Rutgers' wrestling pretty closely.

I think that,after next year,Rutgers' wrestling is likely to experience a drop off.

No doubt Ashnault and Suriano helped  raise the program's stature.

But,if recall correctly,Ashnault  only came to RU because of his family's involvement with

the school.

Everyone knows the Suriano story.

From talking to people who are more familiar with the inner workings of Rutgers'

wrestling program,even with  Ashnault  and Suriano,they haven't been able to recruit 

wrestlers of similar caliber.

I think that,once Suriano is gone,recruiting top talent,is going to be even harder.

I know they have a new wrestling facility,but it seems everyone has one now.

How much different /better can Rutgers' be ?

Plus as one poster said,Rutgers is not exactly the most beautiful campus

 

 

 

Well in terms of NJ credentials, there aren't many people of Ashnault and Suriano's caliber being 4x undefeated NJ state champs.   But I think Aragona was a top 10 overall recruit so he's probably their best chance.

This 2019 recruiting class has gotta be their best ever with 5 top 100 overall recruits and 3 in the top 50, which could at least give them some better depth.  Their 2018 class was ranked #12 as well, but I think they almost all redshirted so not sure what the early read on those guys is.

 

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6 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

 

Well in terms of NJ credentials, there aren't many people of Ashnault and Suriano's caliber being 4x undefeated NJ state champs.   But I think Aragona was a top 10 overall recruit so he's probably their best chance.

This 2019 recruiting class has gotta be their best ever with 5 top 100 overall recruits and 3 in the top 50, which could at least give them some better depth.  Their 2018 class was ranked #12 as well, but I think they almost all redshirted so not sure what the early read on those guys is.

 

Vulakh seems to be a "get" for RU.

But, from reading some of the other wrestling boards,there seems to be

some questions as to how he was recruited by Rutgers.

 

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Do the top programs recruit the best wrestlers to represent their program or do they take the wrestlers that join their program and create the best wrestlers?

If the former, then any programs getting better recruits will be a threat.

If the latter, then it would be the status quo.

 

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8 minutes ago, Pinnum said:

Do the top programs recruit the best wrestlers to represent their program or do they take the wrestlers that join their program and create the best wrestlers?

If the former, then any programs getting better recruits will be a threat.

If the latter, then it would be the status quo.

 

Personally, I think its a combination  of both.

Top programs  recruit  wrestlers  a certain level of talent.

How  that wrestler evolves from there,is up to  the program. 

 

Edited by rpbobcat

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47 minutes ago, rpbobcat said:

Vulakh seems to be a "get" for RU.

But, from reading some of the other wrestling boards,there seems to be

some questions as to how he was recruited by Rutgers.

 

Is the rumor that Rutgers was the school that actually caused him to decommit from GMU?   When it was announced he was decommitting, was Rutgers even mentioned as one of the possible schools?  Seems like a weird situation.  

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20 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Is the rumor that Rutgers was the school that actually caused him to decommit from GMU?   When it was announced he was decommitting, was Rutgers even mentioned as one of the possible schools?  Seems like a weird situation.  

From reading on some other wrestling boards,there are a lot of questions about timing ,based on a 4/1 Tweet from  GM's Asst. coach about games/cheating with recruiting.

The next day he decommited.

A follow up Tweet from the same coach talked about visiting/recruiting already committed athletes.

Apparently,his picking RU came out of nowhere.

 

 

 

Edited by rpbobcat

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The reality is that Rutgers, Cornell, Pittsburgh, and others generally only get the wrestlers from NJ, PA, NY that are second tier, or would have a real tough existing wrestler at PSU that is already there.  I say generally, not always, but the very top ranked wrestlers from the tri state area that have a realistic shot at National Champ and/or a freestyle future go to PSU.  Many second tier tri state wrestlers also migrate to Lock Haven, East Stroudsburgh, Lehigh, Rider, Princeton, Clarion, and others near home where they stand a better chance of starting and having great careers.  This will remain the case and I believe it will be very difficult for Rutgers to rise to the upper group of the Big10.  Rutgers can't do what they do in football:  go South because there's not a lot of talent South, and where there is they wind up in NC State, NC, Duke, Virginia Tech, etc.  And into the Midwest, it would be a great challenge for Rutgers to attract top guys from Ohio State, Iowa, and the other Big schools.  Rutgers best shot is really going after the top NJ wrestlers, and if successful that would be the key to getting into the top 10 nationally on a consistent basis.

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13 minutes ago, smackie84 said:

 Rutgers can't do what they do in football: 

 

Based on their record,especially in the B1G, whatever  Rutgers is doing in football  isn't working.

Maybe football should follow wrestling's recruiting model.

At least they'd be competitive.

 

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1 hour ago, rpbobcat said:

From reading on some other wrestling boards,there are a lot of questions about timing ,based on a 4/1 Tweet from  GM's Asst. coach about games/cheating with recruiting.

The next day he decommited.

A follow up Tweet from the same coach talked about visiting/recruiting already committed athletes.

Apparently,his picking RU came out of nowhere.

 

 

 

 

52 minutes ago, Dr. Novak said:

Mason Beckman is the coach from George Mason who leveled the accusation.


So, if Rutgers "came out of nowhere," did they really "snake" him?  Seems plausible it might have been interest from other school(s) that caused the initial decommitment.  But once he was back on the open market, he ended up choosing Rutgers.  So maybe Rutgers was one of the school(s) Beckman was complaining about, maybe not.

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52 minutes ago, smackie84 said:

The reality is that Rutgers, Cornell, Pittsburgh, and others generally only get the wrestlers from NJ, PA, NY that are second tier, or would have a real tough existing wrestler at PSU that is already there.  I say generally, not always, but the very top ranked wrestlers from the tri state area that have a realistic shot at National Champ and/or a freestyle future go to PSU.  Many second tier tri state wrestlers also migrate to Lock Haven, East Stroudsburgh, Lehigh, Rider, Princeton, Clarion, and others near home where they stand a better chance of starting and having great careers.  This will remain the case and I believe it will be very difficult for Rutgers to rise to the upper group of the Big10.  Rutgers can't do what they do in football:  go South because there's not a lot of talent South, and where there is they wind up in NC State, NC, Duke, Virginia Tech, etc.  And into the Midwest, it would be a great challenge for Rutgers to attract top guys from Ohio State, Iowa, and the other Big schools.  Rutgers best shot is really going after the top NJ wrestlers, and if successful that would be the key to getting into the top 10 nationally on a consistent basis.

If by "second tier" you mean not multi-time National Champ potential because that seems to be the majority of what PSU recruits, Rutgers could still get to the "upper group of the Big 10" with the second tier of guys from NJ, PA and NY.   Their current (previous?) problem was that their entire starting lineup was from NJ.   NJ is good but it wouldn't hurt to get some variety.   Sprinkle a few PA, NY, etc. guys in there and they could be a top 5 team even if most of their team is "second tier."

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As some have astutely pointed out, my post was not to say Rutgers will beat PSU, head to head.  I doubt this happens any time during Cael's tenure.

It was merely to say PSU can be weakened by Rutgers (i) keeping elite NJ talent in state and (ii) grabbing a few top PA guys from time to time, such that another elite power (e.g. Iowa, Ohio State, Ok State, Mizzou) might be able to take the team title in March.

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Between Aragona, Vulakh, Benner, Glasgow, and Janzer I think they will continue to have at least on AA every year even after Suriano graduates but will find it tough to repeat what they did this past year with two NCs.

I'm not sure RU could ever become a powerhouse like PSU but think they follow a similar model like NC State and take those 2nd tier recruits and form them into NC contenders. PSU steals a few of the top NJ recruits but it is the IVY league schools like Cornell, Penn and Princeton that get a lot of the NJ talent that would help a program like RU reach sustained success. Can't fault a kid for choosing any of those schools over RU due to academics. 

One thing they do have that is somewhat of a differentiator to schools not named PSU, tOSU and Iowa is the crowd attendance and atmospherics of the home meets. They do a great job promoting and getting people and kids to come to all the meets.

Edited by Juanma25

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11 minutes ago, Dr. Novak said:

ROI on a Blair education doesn't compute by attending Rutgers.

Blair has had a bunch of guys wrestle at state schools.   Taking a quick look at their website since 2000: Mocco, Backes, Mark Perry, Hudson Taylor, Kellen Russell, Ruth, Mike Evans and McKenna are all ones that AA'd at state schools

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2 minutes ago, Dr. Novak said:

Expectation for anyone attending a prep school that costs $40k/year is to parlay that into acceptance to an Ivy.  

I mean if they get a full (or partial at some schools) scholarship somewhere else it would pretty much cancel out the HS cost

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