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Housebuye

Did Iowa decide to ignore Freestyle?

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1 hour ago, Dondante88 said:

After Spencer's AMA on the Inner Circle message board yesterday, it's laughable at how clueless you all are.  Keep it up though!  

Don, do you have a link or website to refer me to? Very interested in what he had to say. Thanks in advance. 

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2 hours ago, wrestlingnerd said:

Don, do you have a link or website to refer me to? Very interested in what he had to say. Thanks in advance. 

Good luck with that.  If they aren't sharing with HR, they sure as hell aren't sharing here.......

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Lee is 20, and has been wrestling basically year round in the toughest tournaments possible since probably age 12, if not younger (this is an educated guess I’m not pretending to be that familiar with his training cycle) and has had health issues the last few seasons. He’s someone I think could strongly benefit from some time off. Why rush his senior level debut when he still might not be 100% and let everyone in the world get a look at him before 2020? Seems a bit high risk low reward to me. As for the rest of Iowa, I’m disappointed we aren’t seeing guys like Cass, Warner, heck even Desanto doing no freestyle. But 2020 is supposed to be THE year for Iowa, and I seem to recall NLWC basically taking a freestyle season off a year or two ago in order to get ready for the NCAA grind that would be followed by the 2019/2020 worlds. All things considered, as a fan I’m disappointed we aren’t seeing some of Iowa’s best freestyle prospects: at the same time I see Brands and co trying to train and compete a little smarter, keep their guys healthy, and adapt methods that are a little more modern than the old school Iowa mentality of wrestling as hard as possible at all times. 2020 will be the judge 

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When Lee won NCAAs, I thought it was time to put "he's not 100%" to bed however Nolf won last year with a seriously injured knee so who knows. I do look forward to seeing what he can do at the senior level. Hopefully that will be next year for the Olympics. I can see it now, he wins Gold and a few of the Hawk fans will still insist he is not 100%, lol.  

Edited by Flying-Tiger

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13 hours ago, Chrissn2001 said:

Unrelated, but kind of related...where is Mekhi Lewis?  Shouldn't he be contending for a spot on some team?  

He considered it, but decided to focus on improving this year. He went to international camps and has some more scheduled this summer (supposedly). 

I get it with him. He is a freestyle novice who clearly has extremely high potential and wants to jump levels again. Even Burroughs said Mekhi  gives him some trouble in the room (he was vague, but it was clear Burroughs sees the potential in him). Burroughs spoke about him as a threat. It was post BTS I believe. 

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On 5/22/2019 at 5:32 PM, Underhook said:

Lee is 20, and has been wrestling basically year round in the toughest tournaments possible since probably age 12, if not younger (this is an educated guess I’m not pretending to be that familiar with his training cycle) and has had health issues the last few seasons. He’s someone I think could strongly benefit from some time off. Why rush his senior level debut when he still might not be 100% and let everyone in the world get a look at him before 2020? Seems a bit high risk low reward to me. As for the rest of Iowa, I’m disappointed we aren’t seeing guys like Cass, Warner, heck even Desanto doing no freestyle. But 2020 is supposed to be THE year for Iowa, and I seem to recall NLWC basically taking a freestyle season off a year or two ago in order to get ready for the NCAA grind that would be followed by the 2019/2020 worlds. All things considered, as a fan I’m disappointed we aren’t seeing some of Iowa’s best freestyle prospects: at the same time I see Brands and co trying to train and compete a little smarter, keep their guys healthy, and adapt methods that are a little more modern than the old school Iowa mentality of wrestling as hard as possible at all times. 2020 will be the judge 

My post isn’t about Lee. I trust that Lee is doing what he thinks is best. It is frustrating as a fan, but I’m not going to judge Brands based on 1 guy. The issue is this is prevalent across the team, which suggests coaching interference. If Iowa doesn’t win a title next year and they aren’t pushing their guys into freestyle, why would the top recruits go there? Iowa has a major recruiting issue. Young guys don’t see them as dominant. They haven’t been a real threat to the title in years besides the occasional year, and even then they underperformed. 

The post was framed around recruitment, so PSU being brought up isn’t relevant. PSU doesn’t have a recruitment issue. They are so dominant in folk plus they have multiple world golds on staff and in the room. If Iowa was winning NCAAs by huge margins, I wouldn’t have suggested their recruitment will suffer. 

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On 5/22/2019 at 1:02 PM, wrestlingnerd said:

Don, do you have a link or website to refer me to? Very interested in what he had to say. Thanks in advance. 

join the hawkeye wrestling club "inner circle" and you will have access to it.

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4 hours ago, Housebuye said:

He considered it, but decided to focus on improving this year. He went to international camps and has some more scheduled this summer (supposedly). 

I get it with him. He is a freestyle novice who clearly has extremely high potential and wants to jump levels again. Even Burroughs said Mekhi  gives him some trouble in the room (he was vague, but it was clear Burroughs sees the potential in him). Burroughs spoke about him as a threat. It was post BTS I believe. 

I was a little disappointed that we didn't see him at WTTs but do you think there's any chance he'll give U23 a go? I think the trials are coming up very soon. If he can win a Junior World title as a FS novice, he'd probably be able to do some damage at U23s after a full year of college and some international camps under his belt. And U23 Worlds happens before the college preseason, I think, so timing-wise, it could work out for Mekhi.

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4 hours ago, Housebuye said:

My post isn’t about Lee. I trust that Lee is doing what he thinks is best. It is frustrating as a fan, but I’m not going to judge Brands based on 1 guy. The issue is this is prevalent across the team, which suggests coaching interference. If Iowa doesn’t win a title next year and they aren’t pushing their guys into freestyle, why would the top recruits go there? Iowa has a major recruiting issue. Young guys don’t see them as dominant. They haven’t been a real threat to the title in years besides the occasional year, and even then they underperformed. 

The post was framed around recruitment, so PSU being brought up isn’t relevant. PSU doesn’t have a recruitment issue. They are so dominant in folk plus they have multiple world golds on staff and in the room. If Iowa was winning NCAAs by huge margins, I wouldn’t have suggested their recruitment will suffer. 

Wasn’t replying to you specifically, just giving my $0.02 on the overall discussion in the thread as a whole. I agree there’s really no excuse for Iowa’s entire lineup to be sitting out this freestyle season, Especially someone like Cass who was great at the open. I just think I see some potential similarity in their current strategy and what PSU did a couple years ago. Ultimately, Brands does know a thing or two more about wrestling than I do, so while it’s disappointing for me as a fan, I’ll reserve judgement until after the 2020 season

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6 hours ago, Housebuye said:

My post isn’t about Lee. I trust that Lee is doing what he thinks is best. It is frustrating as a fan, but I’m not going to judge Brands based on 1 guy. The issue is this is prevalent across the team, which suggests coaching interference. If Iowa doesn’t win a title next year and they aren’t pushing their guys into freestyle, why would the top recruits go there? Iowa has a major recruiting issue. Young guys don’t see them as dominant. They haven’t been a real threat to the title in years besides the occasional year, and even then they underperformed. 

The post was framed around recruitment, so PSU being brought up isn’t relevant. PSU doesn’t have a recruitment issue. They are so dominant in folk plus they have multiple world golds on staff and in the room. If Iowa was winning NCAAs by huge margins, I wouldn’t have suggested their recruitment will suffer. 

Seriously, that is your argument?  Wouldn't that "dominant" argument then basically fall on EVERY team, but PSU?  tOSU may have an argument, but they still are only a pretty short run and have a TON of reloading to do after losing Snyder, NaTo, both Jordans, Martin and McKenna in the last 2 seasons.

So, by your definition, why would ANY top recruit go anywhere other than PSU or MAYBE tOSU?

If that were the case, 1 sophomores wrestling Seniors and 1 frosh and a sophomore wrestling Juniors is less than a blip on the radar and may ONLY make the slightest of differences if they medaled.

The simple truth is Iowa recruiting is just fine.  It just isn't at the level of PSU or, more recently, tOSU.  The fact of that matter has WAYYYYY more to do with location and resources than whether or not they "boycotted" Trials this season............

Edited to add "location" results over the past 5 seasons for clarity:

2019 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Nolf 26-1st, Joseph 17-2nd totaling 43 pts

2019 tOSU: Ohio points/results- Jordan 19-2nd, Moore 19-2nd totaling 38 pts

2019 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Bowman DNQ, Wilcke 2.5 pts (2-2) totaling 2.5 pts

2018 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Keener(although not originally recruited, being from Pennnsylvania was definitely a factor in the transfer) .5 pts(1-2), Rether ford 25-1st, Nolf 23-1st, Joseph 21-1st totaling 69.5 pts

2018 tOSU: Ohio points/results- NaTo 19.5-3rd, Jordan 13-6th, Jordan 16-5th, Moore 13.5-4th totaling 62 pts.

2018 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Glynn DNQ, Sorensen 13-5th, Bowman 4-(2-2), Wilcke 4-R12 totaling 21 pts.

2017 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Gulibon 4.5-R12, Retherford 28-1st, Nolf 27-1st, Joseph 23-1st, McCutcheon 4-R12 totaling 86.5 pts.

2017 tOSU: Ohio points/results-Rodgriguez 2.5-(1-2), NaTo 15.5-3rd, Jordan 17.5-4th, Ryan DNQ, Burcher 0-2, BoJo 17-2nd, Moore 18.5-3rd totaling 71 pts.

2017 Iowa: Iowa points/results-Clark 20-1st, Sorensen 17-3rd, Meyer 2-R12, Wilcke 2-R12 totaling 41 pts.

2016 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Mega 21-1st, Conaway 9-6th, Gulibon 3-(2-2), Retherford 28.5-1st, Nolf 22-2nd, Morelli 1.5-(2-2), McCutcheon (0-2) totaling 85 pts.

2016 tOSU: Ohio points/results- NaTo 17-3rd, DiJulius 3-(1-2), Jordan 4-R12,  H. Stieber INJ, Ryan (0-2), BoJo 16.5-3rd, Martin DNQ totaling 40.5 pts

2016 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Clark 17-2nd, Grothus DNQ, Sorensen 17-2nd, Cooper 1-(1-2), Meyer 3-R12,  totaling 38 pts.

2015 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Conaway 5.5-8th, Gulibon 11-5th, Beitz 2-(1-2), Frey DNQ,  Hammond DNQ,  McCutcheon 3.5-R12 totaling 22 pts.

2015 tOSU: Ohio points/results- NaTo-24.5-1st, DiJulius 2.5-(2-2), Stieber 26-1st,  Stieber INJ, Demas 1-(1-2), BoJo 19.5-3rd, Tavenello (0-2) totaling 73.5 pts.

2015 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Clark-17-2nd, Sorensen 14.5-4th, Kelly (0-2), totaling 31.5 pts.  

 

Iowa 5 year total points scored by local talent-134

tOSU- 285

PSU- 305

VERY TELLING!!!

 

Edited by MSU158

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10 hours ago, MSU158 said:

Seriously, that is your argument?  Wouldn't that "dominant" argument then basically fall on EVERY team, but PSU?  tOSU may have an argument, but they still are only a pretty short run and have a TON of reloading to do after losing Snyder, NaTo, both Jordans, Martin and McKenna in the last 2 seasons.

So, by your definition, why would ANY top recruit go anywhere other than PSU or MAYBE tOSU?

If that were the case, 1 sophomores wrestling Seniors and 1 frosh and a sophomore wrestling Juniors is less than a blip on the radar and may ONLY make the slightest of differences if they medaled.

The simple truth is Iowa recruiting is just fine.  It just isn't at the level of PSU or, more recently, tOSU.  The fact of that matter has WAYYYYY more to do with location and resources than whether or not they "boycotted" Trials this season............

Edited to add "location" results over the past 5 seasons for clarity:

2019 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Nolf 26-1st, Joseph 17-2nd totaling 43 pts

2019 tOSU: Ohio points/results- Jordan 19-2nd, Moore 19-2nd totaling 38 pts

2019 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Bowman DNQ, Wilcke 2.5 pts (2-2) totaling 2.5 pts

2018 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Keener(although not originally recruited, being from Pennnsylvania was definitely a factor in the transfer) .5 pts(1-2), Rether ford 25-1st, Nolf 23-1st, Joseph 21-1st totaling 69.5 pts

2018 tOSU: Ohio points/results- NaTo 19.5-3rd, Jordan 13-6th, Jordan 16-5th, Moore 13.5-4th totaling 62 pts.

2018 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Glynn DNQ, Sorensen 13-5th, Bowman 4-(2-2), Wilcke 4-R12 totaling 21 pts.

2017 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Gulibon 4.5-R12, Retherford 28-1st, Nolf 27-1st, Joseph 23-1st, McCutcheon 4-R12 totaling 86.5 pts.

2017 tOSU: Ohio points/results-Rodgriguez 2.5-(1-2), NaTo 15.5-3rd, Jordan 17.5-4th, Ryan DNQ, Burcher 0-2, BoJo 17-2nd, Moore 18.5-3rd totaling 71 pts.

2017 Iowa: Iowa points/results-Clark 20-1st, Sorensen 17-3rd, Meyer 2-R12, Wilcke 2-R12 totaling 41 pts.

2016 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Mega 21-1st, Conaway 9-6th, Gulibon 3-(2-2), Retherford 28.5-1st, Nolf 22-2nd, Morelli 1.5-(2-2), McCutcheon (0-2) totaling 85 pts.

2016 tOSU: Ohio points/results- NaTo 17-3rd, DiJulius 3-(1-2), Jordan 4-R12,  H. Stieber INJ, Ryan (0-2), BoJo 16.5-3rd, Martin DNQ totaling 40.5 pts

2016 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Clark 17-2nd, Grothus DNQ, Sorensen 17-2nd, Cooper 1-(1-2), Meyer 3-R12,  totaling 38 pts.

2015 PSU: Pennsylvania points/results- Conaway 5.5-8th, Gulibon 11-5th, Beitz 2-(1-2), Frey DNQ,  Hammond DNQ,  McCutcheon 3.5-R12 totaling 22 pts.

2015 tOSU: Ohio points/results- NaTo-24.5-1st, DiJulius 2.5-(2-2), Stieber 26-1st,  Stieber INJ, Demas 1-(1-2), BoJo 19.5-3rd, Tavenello (0-2) totaling 73.5 pts.

2015 Iowa: Iowa points/results- Clark-17-2nd, Sorensen 14.5-4th, Kelly (0-2), totaling 31.5 pts.  

 

Iowa 5 year total points scored by local talent-134

tOSU- 285

PSU- 305

VERY TELLING!!!

 

It’s sad how Iowa fans try to defend this. 

Some top recruits will go to other schools. Of course. Weird conclusion to draw.

Very rarely will a team not producing results land multiple top 10 guys in multiple years in the same cycle. That is what is needed to win national titles as a team. Defending Iowa recruiting and saying it is fine is not something I expected. It’s terrible given their history and resources. They just aren’t able to get the best guys. Lee was supposed to be the turning point. 

Shocked that Iowa fans would defend this and make excuses. TOSU and PSU out recruit Iowa not just due to location. They are better at it. 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Housebuye said:

It’s sad how Iowa fans try to defend this. 

Some top recruits will go to other schools. Of course. Weird conclusion to draw.

Very rarely will a team not producing results land multiple top 10 guys in multiple years in the same cycle. That is what is needed to win national titles as a team. Defending Iowa recruiting and saying it is fine is not something I expected. It’s terrible given their history and resources. They just aren’t able to get the best guys. Lee was supposed to be the turning point. 

Shocked that Iowa fans would defend this and make excuses. TOSU and PSU out recruit Iowa not just due to location. They are better at it. 

 

 

 

 

 

I think his point was local talent matters, and iowa's local talent pool isnt on the level of penn state's and ohio states, and now both of those schools are taking advantage of it. Basically if iowa, psu, and osu all recruited the same level of top guys out of state, then also got instate talent iowa would be third in recruiting. Which is kinda what we are seeing.

.

 

Edited by Molsen

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9 hours ago, Housebuye said:

It’s sad how Iowa fans try to defend this. 

Some top recruits will go to other schools. Of course. Weird conclusion to draw.

Very rarely will a team not producing results land multiple top 10 guys in multiple years in the same cycle. That is what is needed to win national titles as a team. Defending Iowa recruiting and saying it is fine is not something I expected. It’s terrible given their history and resources. They just aren’t able to get the best guys. Lee was supposed to be the turning point. 

Shocked that Iowa fans would defend this and make excuses. TOSU and PSU out recruit Iowa not just due to location. They are better at it. 

 

 

 

 

 

Not producing results?  Again, there are ONLY 2 schools with consistently better results over the past 5 season and exactly 1 over the past 10. For purposes of recruiting, their results are just fine. 

I am not saying they are recruiting at the level of PSU or tOSU, but that has more to do with what PSU and tOSU are as a whole adding in what they have in their own backyard to work with. I would love to see them recruiting at the highest level, but that almost solely relies on stealing top out of state guys from a myriad of schools when you don’t have at least 2 top 15ish local guys you can fall back on nearly every year  if you don’t see how big that is for both PSU and tOSU, you don’t know how to read and understand numbers  

And the REAL fricking point was Junior world participation was NOT going to change this EITHER way......

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On 5/20/2019 at 10:08 AM, MrDream said:

Again.....I'll say it......

At the end of the day a 3x World Champ has never wrestled a Senior level freestyle event and hasn't wrestled a freestyle match in 2+ years.....something is wrong here.....

A major knee surgery? Possibly something else wrong this year? Yeah, if you look at only the surface level it's strange. If you take even the smallest effort to look at it, it's really not that hard to understand.

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On 5/21/2019 at 2:51 PM, Housebuye said:

Deflection. PSU doesn’t have to worry about recruitment. Iowa was  

They also had more senior level guys competing than any other club I would guess, so having a few guys miss is reasonable. 

2018 trials is completely different than 2019 trials too. Olympics are in 2020. 

You don’t have to agree with the fact that this will impact recruiting. That is and educated guess. To pretend like these two situations are the same is silly 

That's not deflection. Psu doesn't wrestle everyone and it doesnt hurt their recruiting. Why is that not a legitimate comparison?

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I for one would be worried when a high level athlete starts to have injuries that require surgery in high school(I dont believe his knee was the only one, correct?)It doesnt seem like the best strategy to me to have him compete non-stop all the time and hope and pray that they dont become an issue, but what do I know? I'm not in the inner circle yet.. that was a damn fine pitch tho @Dondante88!

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26 minutes ago, russelscout said:

That's not deflection. Psu doesn't wrestle everyone and it doesnt hurt their recruiting. Why is that not a legitimate comparison?

Because PSU gets the recruits for other reasons. Obviously. They are in the middle of one of the best ncaa runs in history. 

If Iowa was winning ncaa titles, they wouldn’t need to worry about pushing freestyle to get recruits. 

Bringing up PSU isn’t relevant. They don’t need help with recruiting because they winning NCAAs. 

Excited for the excuses next year when Iowa loses again. Maybe then they will focus on recruiting  

I actually like Iowa. The whole point of this thread is to explain how Iowa is digging their own grave and that they are making a mistake. It is exiting to see a powerhouse team go through some struggles and now have to deal with adversity to succeed. 

Iowa fans for decades claimed how Iowa style is the best, they are the toughest team, if you can’t handle it get out, etc etc etc. It is easy to make these claims when you are on top. This is tested when you are on top. Now that Iowa is on a downward swing, instead of holding Iowa accountable they make a ton of excuses. Just look at this thread. 

“But other states have better high school wrestlers” is an excuse. That never would’ve been acceptable when Iowa was doing well. 

It makes wrestling less fun now that Iowa fans are fine with accepting their place as an occasional title contender at best. 

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1 hour ago, MSU158 said:

Not producing results?  Again, there are ONLY 2 schools with consistently better results over the past 5 season and exactly 1 over the past 10. For purposes of recruiting, their results are just fine. 

I am not saying they are recruiting at the level of PSU or tOSU, but that has more to do with what PSU and tOSU are as a whole adding in what they have in their own backyard to work with. I would love to see them recruiting at the highest level, but that almost solely relies on stealing top out of state guys from a myriad of schools when you don’t have at least 2 top 15ish local guys you can fall back on nearly every year  if you don’t see how big that is for both PSU and tOSU, you don’t know how to read and understand numbers  

And the REAL fricking point was Junior world participation was NOT going to change this EITHER way......

Junior world medals absolutely has an impact in recruiting. That turns guys into stars (wrestling wise). 

Claiming that Iowa is losing because their state isn’t as good at wrestling is a defeatist attitude. It doesn’t sound like the Iowa I know. 

If your numbers were a reflection of performance, why wasn’t a Pennsylvania or Ohio team always winning ncaa titles? How could OSU win ever? Oklahoma has good wrestling compared to their population size, but they are never as good as Pennsylvania, NJ, Ohio, Cali, etc. 

Maybe there are other variables that other teams are doing better than Iowa is. It is a perfect opportunity to learn from, but instead we just hear excuses 

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1 minute ago, Housebuye said:

Junior world medals absolutely has an impact in recruiting. That turns guys into stars (wrestling wise). 

Claiming that Iowa is losing because their state isn’t as good at wrestling is a defeatist attitude. It doesn’t sound like the Iowa I know. 

If your numbers were a reflection of performance, why wasn’t a Pennsylvania or Ohio team always winning ncaa titles? How could OSU win ever? Oklahoma has good wrestling compared to their population size, but they are never as good as Pennsylvania, NJ, Ohio, Cali, etc. 

Maybe there are other variables that other teams are doing better than Iowa is. It is a perfect opportunity to learn from, but instead we just hear excuses 

There are other variables, but instate talent is an important factor.  The number one variable, that nothing iowa can do to change though, is Cael being at PSU. Its a perfect storm, with arguably the best instate talent+coach. Its gonna take a lot more to overcome that, then having your guys wrestle freestyle.

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3 hours ago, Housebuye said:

Junior world medals absolutely has an impact in recruiting. That turns guys into stars (wrestling wise). 

Claiming that Iowa is losing because their state isn’t as good at wrestling is a defeatist attitude. It doesn’t sound like the Iowa I know. 

If your numbers were a reflection of performance, why wasn’t a Pennsylvania or Ohio team always winning ncaa titles? How could OSU win ever? Oklahoma has good wrestling compared to their population size, but they are never as good as Pennsylvania, NJ, Ohio, Cali, etc. 

Maybe there are other variables that other teams are doing better than Iowa is. It is a perfect opportunity to learn from, but instead we just hear excuses 

There is a huge difference between realism and defeatism. No one is accepting it as a reason they can’t win, just a major reason why they haven’t. It is simply a disadvantage they have to overcome. 

With that said , focusing on winning it all this year is 100000000xs more important than Junior worlds. 

Edited by MSU158

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Also, no other Pennsylvania or Ohio school had the support, notoriety or coaching that tOSU and PSU now have. The right coaches woke 2 sleeping giants that can recruit nationally as well as keep most of the best home. 

Everyone that truly knew wrestling, including Sanderson, knew those 2 programs had the potential to leap to the forefront. 

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11 hours ago, Housebuye said:

Because PSU gets the recruits for other reasons. Obviously. They are in the middle of one of the best ncaa runs in history. 

If Iowa was winning ncaa titles, they wouldn’t need to worry about pushing freestyle to get recruits. 

Bringing up PSU isn’t relevant. They don’t need help with recruiting because they winning NCAAs. 

Excited for the excuses next year when Iowa loses again. Maybe then they will focus on recruiting  

I actually like Iowa. The whole point of this thread is to explain how Iowa is digging their own grave and that they are making a mistake. It is exiting to see a powerhouse team go through some struggles and now have to deal with adversity to succeed. 

Iowa fans for decades claimed how Iowa style is the best, they are the toughest team, if you can’t handle it get out, etc etc etc. It is easy to make these claims when you are on top. This is tested when you are on top. Now that Iowa is on a downward swing, instead of holding Iowa accountable they make a ton of excuses. Just look at this thread. 

“But other states have better high school wrestlers” is an excuse. That never would’ve been acceptable when Iowa was doing well. 

It makes wrestling less fun now that Iowa fans are fine with accepting their place as an occasional title contender at best. 

Why did PSU do it last year is the most relevant question of all. Did they do it to be better positioned to win a title? If so,  Iowa should do the exact same thing, because winning a title, not freestyle, is what drives recruiting. You just said so yourself.

Whether you think they can win it all is irrelevant. The rest of the stuff you said about Iowa style, other states recruiting, complacency of Iowa fans is just a strawman arguments. No one is even talking about that stuff here dude. 

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