Jump to content
swoopdown

Fewer PA weight classes

Recommended Posts

I have not read through many of the posts because I just don't have the time right now, but I will tell you that getting rid of weights in my situation will be bad.  I have coach in schools of all sizes and all throughout the Midwest, but now I'm coaching at a very large school in TX and less weight classes and particularly the low weight classes will definitely hurt my team.  

Here are the #'s that I had before FB was finished and my #'s went up some when the FB season finished.

106 - 2 Seniors, 1 Junior, 1 Sophomore, 3 Freshman 

113 - 2 Seniors, 1 Junior, 1 Sophmore, 2 Freshman

120 - 1 Senior, 3 Sophomores, 1 Freshman

126 - 1 Junior, 1 Sophmore, 1 Freshman (This weight is cleared out because no one wants to wrestle my 126lber) 

132 - 3 Juniors, 3 Sophomores, 4 Freshman

138 - 2 Seniors, 2 Juniors, 3 Sophomores, 3 Freshman

145 - 2 Seniors, 3 Juniors, 1 Sophomore, 2 Freshman

152 - 1 Senior, 2 Juniors, 3 Sophomores, and 5 Freshman

160 - 1 Senior, 2 Juniors, 1 Sophomore, 2 Freshman 

170 - 2 Juniors, 2 Sophomores, 3 Freshman

182 - 2 Juniors, 2 Sophomores, 1 Freshman

195 - 1 Senior, 2 Juniors, 1 Sophomore

220 - 1 Senior, 2 Sophomores, 1 Freshman

285 - 1 Senior, 1 Sophomore, 1 Freshman

 

As you can tell we have great #'s.  The biggest issue that I run into is, I do not get a assistant until our FB season is over and we always play deep into the playoffs.  The biggest thing that hurts the team is we have no Middle School Feeder programs.  There's no MS programs in the area and so I bust my butt by spreading as much information as I can by word of mouth at the MS and through youth football teams.  #'s are great, but if I lose weight classes and if I cannot have a JV schedule, my program is going to take a lot of hits and we will lose kids quickly. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Meatey said:

I have not read through many of the posts because I just don't have the time right now, but I will tell you that getting rid of weights in my situation will be bad.  I have coach in schools of all sizes and all throughout the Midwest, but now I'm coaching at a very large school in TX and less weight classes and particularly the low weight classes will definitely hurt my team.  

Here are the #'s that I had before FB was finished and my #'s went up some when the FB season finished.

106 - 2 Seniors, 1 Junior, 1 Sophomore, 3 Freshman 

113 - 2 Seniors, 1 Junior, 1 Sophmore, 2 Freshman

120 - 1 Senior, 3 Sophomores, 1 Freshman

126 - 1 Junior, 1 Sophmore, 1 Freshman (This weight is cleared out because no one wants to wrestle my 126lber) 

132 - 3 Juniors, 3 Sophomores, 4 Freshman

138 - 2 Seniors, 2 Juniors, 3 Sophomores, 3 Freshman

145 - 2 Seniors, 3 Juniors, 1 Sophomore, 2 Freshman

152 - 1 Senior, 2 Juniors, 3 Sophomores, and 5 Freshman

160 - 1 Senior, 2 Juniors, 1 Sophomore, 2 Freshman 

170 - 2 Juniors, 2 Sophomores, 3 Freshman

182 - 2 Juniors, 2 Sophomores, 1 Freshman

195 - 1 Senior, 2 Juniors, 1 Sophomore

220 - 1 Senior, 2 Sophomores, 1 Freshman

285 - 1 Senior, 1 Sophomore, 1 Freshman

 

As you can tell we have great #'s.  The biggest issue that I run into is, I do not get a assistant until our FB season is over and we always play deep into the playoffs.  The biggest thing that hurts the team is we have no Middle School Feeder programs.  There's no MS programs in the area and so I bust my butt by spreading as much information as I can by word of mouth at the MS and through youth football teams.  #'s are great, but if I lose weight classes and if I cannot have a JV schedule, my program is going to take a lot of hits and we will lose kids quickly. 

 

 

Above is a great example of why weight classes do not need to be reduced.  Let us all remember that wrestling first and foremost is an individual sport.  My high school team was ranked in the top 10 in the state my senior year.  We made it to the state semi-finals in the duals series, which was nice.  But people remember the 2 individual place-winners we had on that team much more than the dual team.  Also, at the state tournament, most of our team laid an egg.  There was 1 team that had 1 qualifier who won state.  They placed higher than us in the team race.  For the most part, other than their team and our team, no one remembers or cares.  What we all remember was his individual state championship and our two state place-winners.  Team points were put in place so that schools could try to fill trophy cases.  The origin and heart of our great sport is individual competition.  Your teammate cannot help you when you are on the mat.  We have gotten so hung up on dual meet scores, tournament scores, and forfeits.  Don't reduce opportunities for wrestlers at schools that fill a full lineup because other schools are not capable of finding 14 kids in 14 weight classes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There definitely needs to be adjustments due to the outrageous number of forfeits. One resolution could be allowing multiple entries into the end of season tournaments. This would allow, if there were 12 weight classes, a total of 24 wrestlers to enter your sectionals/districts/states at the end of the season. You can't look at the results and believe that this is good for wrestling. Too many forfeits, weak kids not ready for Varsity, and too many mismatches. And finally, don't be selfish in thinking because you fill all the weight classes that it is okay to be doing the status quo. Top 10% and Bottom 10% are not the reason to keep up with the same routine.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, cradleman said:

There definitely needs to be adjustments due to the outrageous number of forfeits. One resolution could be allowing multiple entries into the end of season tournaments. This would allow, if there were 12 weight classes, a total of 24 wrestlers to enter your sectionals/districts/states at the end of the season. You can't look at the results and believe that this is good for wrestling. Too many forfeits, weak kids not ready for Varsity, and too many mismatches. And finally, don't be selfish in thinking because you fill all the weight classes that it is okay to be doing the status quo. Top 10% and Bottom 10% are not the reason to keep up with the same routine.

 

Michigan does it well in that you can enter 14 individuals with no more than 2 per weight. So thus you could enter two kids at 7 weights. This is the right thing to do. 

The forfeits will be there no matter what. Many of the schools that wrestle are smaller schools that quite simply do not have the bodies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, 1032004 said:

"106 is a freshman weight class"

Yeah, for freshman who go on to place top 3 at NCAA's.

 

 

So what's the point you're trying to make?

I think everyone here will agree that as a freshmen great wrestlers are at a lighter weight than they are as a junior or senior.  They will also agree that kids that start out at 106lbs as freshmen, they will grow into bigger kids. This isn't exactly earth shattering evidence.

The whole "well all these kids started at 106/103 are now good wrestlers" argument is pretty lame. The best kids all start out at different weight classes. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, BobDole said:

So what's the point you're trying to make?

I think everyone here will agree that as a freshmen great wrestlers are at a lighter weight than they are as a junior or senior.  They will also agree that kids that start out at 106lbs as freshmen, they will grow into bigger kids. This isn't exactly earth shattering evidence.

The whole "well all these kids started at 106/103 are now good wrestlers" argument is pretty lame. The best kids all start out at different weight classes. 

The point is that some seem to be arguing that 106 should be a JV weight.    But I bet a high percentage of guys that go on to be multiple time AA's in D1 were 4X state placers in high school, even if they weren't 106 as a freshman.   If 106 were a JV weight, sure some of these guys would still have been varsity at 113, but maybe not all of them, and they probably wouldn't have been as successful at the state tournament.   

The fact that many of the top guys in D1 were 106 as freshman or sometimes more than just as a freshman (I believe Zahid was 106 as a freshman as well), IMO is a strong argument in favor of keeping it as a varsity weight. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, 1032004 said:

The point is that some seem to be arguing that 106 should be a JV weight.    But I bet a high percentage of guys that go on to be multiple time AA's in D1 were 4X state placers in high school, even if they weren't 106 as a freshman.   If 106 were a JV weight, sure some of these guys would still have been varsity at 113, but maybe not all of them, and they probably wouldn't have been as successful at the state tournament.   

The fact that many of the top guys in D1 were 106 as freshman or sometimes more than just as a freshman (I believe Zahid was 106 as a freshman as well), IMO is a strong argument in favor of keeping it as a varsity weight. 

So your evidence is based on NCAA All-Americans aka the best of the best for keeping a weight class?

How come other sports still have great numbers when they basically force most freshmen to play on freshmen only or JV teams?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, BobDole said:

So your evidence is based on NCAA All-Americans aka the best of the best for keeping a weight class?

How come other sports still have great numbers when they basically force most freshmen to play on freshmen only or JV teams?

Yes the point is “the best of the best” should be varsity as freshmen.  I would say that’s true in other sports as well.  What do you mean by “other sports have great numbers”?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Yes the point is “the best of the best” should be varsity as freshmen.  I would say that’s true in other sports as well.  What do you mean by “other sports have great numbers”?

If they are the best they will be varsity, that's the beauty of the sport.

Other sports...you know like football or baseball or basketball, or really most sports that have full freshmen teams.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, 1032004 said:

I mean I don’t have the data in front of me but I’m pretty sure the “best of the best” in those sports are varsity as freshmen too.

Then how will that affect wrestling? If they are the best they will be varsity. The beauty of wrestling is you aren't playing politics on playing time. If the kid wins the wrestle-off he's varsity. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...