JB

[2td3nf 454]

It's cool JB won the spot again this year and has a chance to make another run. He looks like he's still in tremendous shape. Guessing JB will wrestle at  the upcoming Yasar Dogu?

Right now at 74kg, UWW has ranked:

1. Sidakov

2. Chamizo

3. JB

4. Kentchadze

5. Bekzod

 

[ConnorsDad 357]

3 hours ago, Katie said:

I wasn't arguing that the iMar series was unfair to JB. I'm saying that JB taking a loss does not worry me. In nine years, he's 175-8. Nobody has beaten him twice. That's a fantastic record given that the best wrestlers in the world have been gunning for him almost the entire time.

I don't understand what you're trying to say about making the Olympic team next year. It'll be difficult, but it always has been difficult. Then comes the Olympics, which are even more difficult (for whoever makes the team).

Maybe I didn't explain it great but when your voice texting that happens sometimes oh, LOL. If he does not win a medal he does not get to sit out and wrestle two out of three for the spot. He has to go through an entire challenge tourney then, if he wins that, he would wrestle off against somebody the next day best two out of three for the spot. Unless he won the open in December which again he would have to go through an entire tournament to do it. Regardless, whatever route he takes, unless he wins a medal this year, he is going to be wrestling in a tournament of multiple matches over multiple days with multiple weighins and a year older than this year when all he had to do was make weight one time and win one best two out of three series.

[BTC 13]

9 hours ago, Katie said:

I don’t think it’s certain JB makes the 2020 Olympic team. 

But to suggest he has no chance seems a little too emotional.

Never said he has no chance. I just think dake beats him without too much of a problem. To sit here and defend JB after every prediction against him seems a little too emotional.

[CoachWrestling 257]

12 minutes ago, BTC said:

Never said he has no chance. I just think dake beats him without too much of a problem. To sit here and defend JB after every prediction against him seems a little too emotional.

You’re not taking the weight into account. Look at how sucked down Dake looked when he wrestled 74 in the past. When you take into account the fact that he’s certainly gained muscle, it’s obvious it’ll be a tougher pull for him. 

[Katie 612]

9 hours ago, BTC said:

Never said he has no chance. I just think dake beats him without too much of a problem. To sit here and defend JB after every prediction against him seems a little too emotional.

I’m sorry you feel that way. It’ll be okay though. I promise. 

[BTC 13]

10 hours ago, CoachWrestling said:

You’re not taking the weight into account. Look at how sucked down Dake looked when he wrestled 74 in the past. When you take into account the fact that he’s certainly gained muscle, it’s obvious it’ll be a tougher pull for him. 

Fair point but at the end of the day I think KD gets it done. He has access to world class health and nutrition experts. The smart move would be to formulate a diet plan before worlds and start it as soon as he gets back, assuming he makes the team.  

Edited June 30 by BTC

[mspart 152]

So contrary to all evidence, you still think Dake is better than JB.  Kind of like all those who think Taylor is better than Dake, never having beaten him in real life.

Please don't forget that JB won his first Bronze with an injured MCL.  The man is tough as nails.  

mspart

[swoopdown 443]

"..... Kind of like all those who think Taylor is better than Dake, never having beaten him in real life."

A poll to confirm that this is actually a real phenomenon ..... Is there anyone on Earth (well, in this forum at least) who is willing to post that (real) Taylor is better?




Sent from my moto e5 play using Tapatalk

[headshuck 1,945]

Tayler has never lost a hypothetical match with Dake.  When you start your poll, do something like this...

"Hypothetical matchup:  Dake vs Tayler at 80kg.  Who you got?"

 

 

[swoopdown 443]

Tayler has never lost a hypothetical match with Dake.  When you start your poll, do something like this...
"Hypothetical matchup:  Dake vs Tayler at 80kg.  Who you got?"
 
 

Ok. I got Dake. Does anyone take Taylor? Bueller? Bueller? Unless Bueller shows up the hypothetical hypothetical unbeaten streak is broken. Bueller?

Sent from my moto e5 play using Tapatalk

[BTC 13]

13 hours ago, mspart said:

So contrary to all evidence, you still think Dake is better than JB.  Kind of like all those who think Taylor is better than Dake, never having beaten him in real life.

Please don't forget that JB won his first Bronze with an injured MCL.  The man is tough as nails.  

mspart

Th one difference with that is that dake has beaten JB before. It might've only been twice but it's better than that goosegg taylor has laid. My main reasoning for thinking this is that I believe KD is in his prime and JB is passed his prime although not so far that he isnt competitive, that much is evident. Shoot he is a returning world champ himself that wasn't scored on at worlds last year. Some time has passed since their last meeting and it's not so damn crazy to say that dake is better developed since then. I honestly think ringer is a worse matchup at this point than JB. But hey this all just like my opinion man.

[misterc 34]

5 hours ago, BTC said:

Th one difference with that is that dake has beaten JB before. It might've only been twice but it's better than that goosegg taylor has laid. My main reasoning for thinking this is that I believe KD is in his prime and JB is passed his prime although not so far that he isnt competitive, that much is evident. Shoot he is a returning world champ himself that wasn't scored on at worlds last year. Some time has passed since their last meeting and it's not so damn crazy to say that dake is better developed since then. I honestly think ringer is a worse matchup at this point than JB. But hey this all just like my opinion man.

Dake's only beaten JB once.  No man has beaten JB twice (Jokingly)!  

Seriously though, going 3 straight with JB, even fresh, is hard.  In 2017 Dake faded hard, but understandable due to the format at the time.  I was surprised this year when IMar faded almost just as hard in the 3rd match.  He admitted this himself.

JB and Dake are not that far apart in age, 30 and 28 currently.  It seems when JB 'slowed' down and stopped blasting people to Mars, it was out of no where.  Same thing could happen to Dake.  

It's not unreasonable to think Dake for 2020 but with Dake coming off injury, we'll just have to see where he is at. 

 

[Plasmodium 1,102]

Dake is going 86 because his weight is wrong for 74 and he is well aware that he can't beat JB.  He also understands that he 100% owns David Taylor.

Cox is a wild card.  Dake can't beat him either, but he probably thinks he can.

[misterc 34]

32 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

Dake is going 86 because his weight is wrong for 74 and he is well aware that he can't beat JB.  He also understands that he 100% owns David Taylor.

Cox is a wild card.  Dake can't beat him either, but he probably thinks he can.

Not sure if you're serious but I have been on the Dake at 86kg wagon for a while.  The new weigh in rules obviously favor Dake more than Cox at 86kg, I think Dake can do it.

[Plasmodium 1,102]

15 minutes ago, misterc said:

Not sure if you're serious but I have been on the Dake at 86kg wagon for a while.  The new weigh in rules obviously favor Dake more than Cox at 86kg, I think Dake can do it.

I'm totally serious.  It makes zero sense for Dake to wrestle 74.

[Jim L 148]

2 hours ago, misterc said:

Not sure if you're serious but I have been on the Dake at 86kg wagon for a while.  The new weigh in rules obviously favor Dake more than Cox at 86kg, I think Dake can do it.

Cox seems to be only wrestle who loses more hypotheticals than Dake.

[BTC 13]

I thought he beat him back in 2013 and again in 2016 or 17 but I digress. Im a little surprised by the lack of support for KD. He absolutely handled the russian who's name I'm to lazy to look up. Im a fan of his but if he loses oh well. I'll cheer just as loud for whoever earns the spot. I'll call it right now. If he beats ringer he wins worlds then goes on to take the Olympic spot next year. Winning last year I feel like he turned a corner and is at an all time high as far as confidence goes and that high will carry him to a three peat. 

[mspart 152]

Well, all of this is hypothetical really.  Opinions are just that.  I think JB prevails.  Others here think KD prevails.  The neat thing is we will see in a few months how this turns out.  In the meantime, we can see Dake and JB in action at higher profile tourneys in the next few weeks. 

mspart

[RJChicago 14]

On 6/26/2019 at 8:38 PM, Katie said:

Okay so none of JB's seven wins over Dake count, but Dake's one win against JB counts. Got it.

Wow - Katie I really enjoy your posts and appreciate your perspectives generally - but this was not at all what he was saying. I have no horse in this, am a huge JB fan, etc. But isn't that the point of this forum - to make points and counter-points - and that post wasn't even one of the thoughtlessly one-sided ones. That poster presented arguments for why Dake may beat JB despite the fact that not only did JB win their last series, but has previously beat him every other time except once. They are literally addressing JB's wins against Dake, not claiming they didn't happen. The point of that post is that despite JB's utter dominance so far against Dake, Dake may have a shot for all of these reasons. I found that post to be interesting and well thought-out even though I don't agree with the conclusions. Very, very far from "So none of JB's seven wins over Dake count."

[wrestlingnerd 2,356]

Katie loses all objectivity for all things Cornell, Kyle Dake included. If you read his comments about the school, you should not be surprised.

[Katie 612]

2 hours ago, RJChicago said:

Wow - Katie I really enjoy your posts and appreciate your perspectives generally - but this was not at all what he was saying. I have no horse in this, am a huge JB fan, etc. But isn't that the point of this forum - to make points and counter-points - and that post wasn't even one of the thoughtlessly one-sided ones. That poster presented arguments for why Dake may beat JB despite the fact that not only did JB win their last series, but has previously beat him every other time except once. They are literally addressing JB's wins against Dake, not claiming they didn't happen. The point of that post is that despite JB's utter dominance so far against Dake, Dake may have a shot for all of these reasons. I found that post to be interesting and well thought-out even though I don't agree with the conclusions. Very, very far from "So none of JB's seven wins over Dake count."

It was a douchey response to a thoughtful post. I’m guilty. 

[spladle08 554]

This thread is silly but for those of you interested.
Neither Dake nor Taylor compete for an Olympic medal until 2024.

[RJChicago 14]

1 hour ago, Katie said:

It was a douchey response to a thoughtful post. I’m guilty. 

Classy response. I've always liked your posts and never more than now. It can be as simple as that, I wish all of us would say "My bad" or "I changed my mind" or "I don't agree, but those are good points" a bit more often.

[de4856 336]

Well I know this have changed over the years, and with our top wrestlers being able to get stipends, sponsorships and what not, it is still kind of amazing to see a guy like JB to stay on top of the mountain for so long. Perhaps with the increase and availability of financial support this trend will continue and we see more guys/gals have extended careers. But even so, I have to think that JB is a rare bird not just with his success, but also the longevity of his post college career.

I don't know what the typical length of a post collegiate career is, but I would have to say that typically if your are not the elite of the elite, it can't be that many years. And if you look back through our history, I think that with a lot of our medal winners/champs, I would say that the average would only be two or three ( World/Olympic ) medals in their career. Now obviously there are outliers like Bruce Baumgartner, John Smith, Dave Schultz, ( and a few others ), but I guess my point would be that JB is also one of these outliers as well. Additionally, I would also have to mention that Adeline Gray who has a long and successful career would also be in this category as well. It may be that Adeline Gray may be our greatest Women's wrestler, at least up to this point in time. 

[wrestlingnerd 2,356]

I think part of JB’s longevity is his lack of interest in coaching, which is quite rare for world champion American wrestlers. He could probably get almost any D1 job he wanted or one comparable to it, and the allure of greener pastures without the daily grind of world-level competition might’ve been too much even for JB if he were interested in coaching. It’s not a bad gig to kick some ass a few times a year while it lasts given the substantial expansion of the wrestling economy while he had his GOAT-worthy run.