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LeRoy Smith and Randy Lewis Controversy

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Great read.  I didn't recall that this was to be a 4-man, best of 3 round robin.  It appears that Smith defeated Dellagatta (who was actually the #1 seed) and Burley 2-0 each and thought at one point he had defeated Lewis 2-1.  If I read this correctly, Lewis defaulted out of facing Dellagatta and Burley, whom the rules at the time required him to face.  Truly confounding.

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This is the original second bout.  ThE scoring controversy occurs on the high crotch Smith shoots at the 5:39 mark.  They end up in a crackdown position and there is some exposure.  The score was 5-4 and after that it’s 8-5.  Smith gets two more takedowns to make the final 8-7 Lewis. 

Edited by Fishbane

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1 hour ago, Fishbane said:

 

This is the original second bout.  ThE scoring controversy occurs on the high crotch Smith shoots at the 5:39 mark.  They end up in a crackdown position and there is some exposure.  The score was 5-4 and after that it’s 8-5.  Smith gets two more takedowns to make the final 8-7 Lewis. 

Thanks, this helps.  Also, why did Smith shoot on The Impossible Leg?  All of Lewis’ scoring comes off those counters.

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22 hours ago, jchapman said:

Thanks, this helps.  Also, why did Smith shoot on The Impossible Leg?  All of Lewis’ scoring comes off those counters.

I thought the same.  The repeated head outside attacks to the left were giving away as many points as gaining them.  I guess make or break you go with what got you there.

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4 hours ago, hammerlockthree said:

That looked like it was all lewis to me. 

But how the hell did he get the spot if he didn't wrestle the other 2 guys at all?

He did wrestle them, it was after the Smith bouts were resolved.  But it think he only had to wrestle one of them because the last guy had too many losses to the others already.

Edited by jchapman

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Yeah, I don't think he ever wrestled Burley.  After the re-wrestled 84 seconds of Smith-Lewis and the Lewis-Dellagatta matches at Big Bear it stood Lewis 2-0 (4-0 individual matches), Smith 2-1 (4-2 individual matches), Dellagatta 1-2 (2-5 individual matches), and Burley 0-2 (1-4 individual matches).  I think Lewis had the spot clinched at that point and it didn't matter.  Even if that wasn't the case and some tiebreaking criteria would make it possible for Smith to get the spot over Lewis provided Burley beat Lewis in a certain manner it's hard to believe Burley would have any interest in wrestling these matches a month after the trials with no chance of making the team himself.

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9 hours ago, Coach_J said:

I thought the same.  The repeated head outside attacks to the left were giving away as many points as gaining them.  I guess make or break you go with what got you there.

LeRoy Smith had a pretty good record against Lewis going into the 84 trials.  He was 4-1 against him.  Lewis had beat Smith at the final rankings tournament before the final trials 11-9, but in that match Lewis turned him with a gut wrench 4 times which was more the difference than Lewis's counter wrestling, so maybe it was understandable for him to believe he could finish without giving up too many exposures.

Another point in this controversy was that the first match between Smith and Lewis at the final trials ended 7-7 with Lewis winning on criteria.  Smith protested that decision and it was denied. 

 

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Interesting stuff. Sounds like Smith really got screwed after all the legal stuff, but it looked like Lewis deserved to win the second match so it should have ended there. I’m not sure how they originally scored it 8-7 though. It was 5-4. Then it looked like 2 Lewis, 2 Lewis, and 1 Smith. Then two more takedowns for Smith. Wouldn’t that be 9-7, or did I miss something? I can see how the second exposure is questionable but it looked like Lewis initiated to me

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16 hours ago, Eagle26 said:

Interesting stuff. Sounds like Smith really got screwed after all the legal stuff, but it looked like Lewis deserved to win the second match so it should have ended there. I’m not sure how they originally scored it 8-7 though. It was 5-4. Then it looked like 2 Lewis, 2 Lewis, and 1 Smith. Then two more takedowns for Smith. Wouldn’t that be 9-7, or did I miss something? I can see how the second exposure is questionable but it looked like Lewis initiated to me

second crotch throw was likely 1 as smith may have gone hand to hand.

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Side note:  2 of the 4 are from southern New Jersey.  Dellegatta came on strong after never finishing in the Top 4 in the State tournament.  Burley was a 1-time champ the year before he won the NCAAs.     

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given the boycott in '84, I always wondered if any of those 4 guys would have won the gold if they were the rep. 

of course same is prob true at other weights where we won gold in '84....i.e. I'd have bet on Kemp to win at 163 if he was our rep (though the German opponent was one of the better guys the US had to go through to win a class).

 

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22 minutes ago, KTG119 said:

given the boycott in '84, I always wondered if any of those 4 guys would have won the gold if they were the rep. 

of course same is prob true at other weights where we won gold in '84....i.e. I'd have bet on Kemp to win at 163 if he was our rep (though the German opponent was one of the better guys the US had to go through to win a class).

 

It's possible.  Certainly Leroy Smith would have been the favorite if he had the spot as he was 2nd at the 1983 World Championships.  The silver medalist in 1984 was a 19 year old from Japan.  He later earned a silver at the 1989 World Championships and bronze at the 1992 Olympics both of those events were not boycotted by the Eastern Bloc.  Andre Metzger beat him for bronze at the 1987 world championships.  All of those later results (87, 89, 92) were up a weight at 68kg.

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27 minutes ago, Fishbane said:

It's possible.  Certainly Leroy Smith would have been the favorite if he had the spot as he was 2nd at the 1983 World Championships.  The silver medalist in 1984 was a 19 year old from Japan.  He later earned a silver at the 1989 World Championships and bronze at the 1992 Olympics both of those events were not boycotted by the Eastern Bloc.  Andre Metzger beat him for bronze at the 1987 world championships.  All of those later results (87, 89, 92) were up a weight at 68kg.

yes I had started typing some of that about the Japanese opponent at 136; he was young but ended up with a nice resume. agreed Smith would have been favored but think Dellegatta and Burley would have been tough tests for him as well. Dellegatta had some impressive wins (beat Sergei B I think) though not in world championships.  

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2 hours ago, TFBJR said:

Side note:  2 of the 4 are from southern New Jersey.  Dellegatta came on strong after never finishing in the Top 4 in the State tournament.  Burley was a 1-time champ the year before he won the NCAAs.     

It was 8-7 Lewis.  I re-scored that match on video at least half a dozen times at the time - I was also competing senior freestyle in 1984, so was aware of the current rules. At "most", it was 8-8, Lewis by criteria.

That was a fearsome foursome, to be sure. Smith was the rock-solid, technically sound athlete, Lewis was the guy with incredible kinesthetic awareness ( see Loudin Swain), Dellagatta the  funk-master, and Burley was a super-smooth wunder-kind.

 

This book ( you can find a less expensive one in paperback or on EBay) shares the personal takes from the combatants https://www.amazon.com/Wrestlers-At-Trials-wrestling-1960-1988/dp/0979905109  .  Well worth the read.

 

By the way, had this match been scored with today's rules...it may have been scored 12-10 SMITH ( take-downs only worth 1 back in the day), unless Lewis was awarded a third NF 2 pointer near the out of bounds flurry, but Smith hadn't bellied out the time..

 

Edited by BadgerMon

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1 hour ago, KTG119 said:

 yes I had started typing some of that about the Japanese opponent at 136; he was young but ended up with a nice resume. agreed Smith would have been favored but think Dellegatta and Burley would have been tough tests for him as well. Dellegatta had some impressive wins (beat Sergei B I think) though not in world championships.  

Akaishi was 4th at the 88 Olympics too losing to Nate Carr in the bronze medal match 5-1. 

I had tried looking up Dellagatta on the UWW database when I was looking up Akaishi and nothing came up.  There was a Rick Dellegatta who competed in the 1981 World Cup representing Canada at 57kg.  I didn't think that was the same person; Last name is spelled different, different country, different weight (Dellagatta wrestled NCAAs at 134 in 1981), but Beloglasov was at his weight in that World Cup. There were no results for Burley in the UWW database either.  I think any of the 4 would have won a medal, possibly gold.

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