Jump to content

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, JeanGuy said:

I think it is really funny how this group still looks at these guys as representing a particular university/college. How is David Taylor considered to be representing PSU? Is James Green still primarily a Nebraska guy? Dake hasn't wrestled for Cornell since March of 2013. These guys are all USA wrestlers and should be supported as such.

Way too much bickering about where they went/go to school.

J'Den Cox and I agree with you wholeheartedly 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, JeanGuy said:

I think it is really funny how this group still looks at these guys as representing a particular university/college. How is David Taylor considered to be representing PSU? Is James Green still primarily a Nebraska guy? Dake hasn't wrestled for Cornell since March of 2013. These guys are all USA wrestlers and should be supported as such.

Way too much bickering about where they went/go to school.

It's easy to see wrestlers as representing an RTC, many of which have ties to a school.

Edited by pamela

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, pamela said:

It's easy to see wrestlers as representing an RTC, many of which have ties to a school.

But if you go to the Nittany Lion Wrestling Club website and read how they describe their athletes , there is not a singe mention of Penn State. Even with current students.

  • The NLWC Resident Athlete Program had some outstanding performances during the past season (2017-18).  In September, Matt Brownwon a bronze medal at the World Military Championships.  Josh Rodriguez and Riley Lefever both earned bronze medals at the U.S. U23 World Team Trials in October.  During the month of November, Matt Brown won silver and Riley Lefever bronze at the Dave Schultz International Tournament.  In December, Franklin Gomez and David Taylor joined the Titan Mercury Wrestling Club team and led them to a second place finish at the World Clubs Cup Championship in Iran.  David Taylor become only the 12th U.S. wrestler in history to win a gold medal at the Yarygin Grand Prix Tournament in Russia in January.  During the Month of February, Matt Brown won the U.S. Armed Forces Championship, and Franklin Gomez placed second, Riley Lefever placed third, and Josh Rodriguez placed fifth at the Outstanding Ukrainian Memorial Tournament in Kiev, Ukraine.  Nico Megaludis also competed in Ukraine, and Ben Provisor finished in 8th at the Thor Masters Tournament in Denmark.  In April, Franklin Gomez earned a bronze at the Bill Farrell International Tournament in New York whileDavid Taylor went undefeated in leading the U.S. team to a World Cup Championship.  At the U.S. Open National Championships also in April, Ben Provisor and David Taylor both won gold medals while Jake Varner (competing for the first time after a long layoff) earned silver and Nico Megaludis bronze.  A week later at the Pan American Championships in Lima, Peru, David Taylor won gold, Ben Provisorbronze in Greco and gold in Freestyle, and Mark Hall (not a NLWC Resident Athlete but representing the NLWC) also won a gold medal.  At the World Team Trials Challenge Tournament in Rochester, MN, in May, Nico Megludis earned a silver and Jake Varner a bronze.  Also in May, Collegians Brady Berge won gold, Nick Lee silver, and Jarod Verkleeren bronze while competing under the NLWC banner at the U.S. Junior World Team Trials.  In May, Josh Rodriguez lost a close match to the U23 World Champion in the Beat the Streets dual in New York City.  In June at the Final X, David Taylor won two consecutive matches in Penn State’s Rec Hall to claim a U.S. World Team spot while Ben Provisor and collegian Mason Manville earned runner-up finishes in the U.S. Greco World Team Trials.  In July, Franklin Gomez won gold, Ben Provisor silver, and Josh Rodriguez bronze at the Canada Cup, in Guelph, Ontario.  In the late summer, David Taylor pinned four straight opponents to capture gold at the Yassar Dogu International in Turkey.  And in early fall of 2018, David Taylorbecame the NLWC’s first World Champion!  To win the World Championships, David defeated a returning Olympic Gold medalist from Iran in his first match and in the tournament finals, he defeated an opponent from Turkey by a technical fall.  David’s World Championship performance combined with his performance throughout the 2018 season led to his being named the UWW Best Freestyle Wrestler of the year for 2018!

We all know who is from Penn State and who isn't but the club doesn't differentiate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/15/2019 at 7:41 AM, Lurker said:

This stuff about Yianni shouldn’t go to Dogu before the tournament was silly. Now it’s just ridiculous. He has every right to go and zero obligation to anyone not to. Injuries happen. Wasn’t intentional. Could have just as easily happened with any first round opponent. 

Not ridiculous. Just because he could go doesn't mean he should. Dogu was supposed to be a tuneup against international competition for the world team members. Yianni went just to prove a point - that he could beat Zain, even though everybody already knew that was possible - and to **** on Zain's parade which wound up injuring our world team member. I honestly don't think he meant to injure him, but the fact that Yianni is the alternate could mean he wanted to wrestle Zain with bad intentions, especially with the way the Trials ended. Again, I don't think Yianni injured Zain on purpose, but I think that possibility should be reason enough not to let him go in hindsight.

Edited by mg113

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, JeanGuy said:

But if you go to the Nittany Lion Wrestling Club website and read how they describe their athletes , there is not a singe mention of Penn State. Even with current students.

We all know who is from Penn State and who isn't but the club doesn't differentiate.

Right, although that could be for the benefit of recruiting and team chemistry so there’s no “us / them” mentality among club members from PSU or outsiders. But by simply being named the Nittany Lion Wrestling Club, Hawkeye Wrestling Club, etc. it’s easy for fans to fall back into school affiliations. At the same time however, donors are probably much more willing to contribute to the NLWC than say, if they were named the USA Wrestling Central PA RTC or something. It’s a double edged sword.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, mg113 said:

Not ridiculous. Just because he could go doesn't mean he should. Dogu was supposed to be a tuneup against international competition for the world team members. Yianni went just to prove a point - that he could beat Zain, even though everybody already knew that was possible - and to **** on Zain's parade which wound up injuring our world team member. I honestly don't think he meant to injure him, but the fact that Yianni is the alternate could mean he wanted to wrestle Zain with bad intentions, especially with the way the Trials ended. Again, I don't think Yianni injured Zain on purpose, but I think that possibility should be reason enough not to let him go in hindsight.

I get what you are saying, and I concede “ridiculous” may be a bit much, but as I said to qc it’s just a matter of perspective which is more important, policy on who can compete in what season tournament for the point of a particular year’s world championships, or focus on the overall big picture on competitive depth of our national team. A blanket policy that says nobody else but the #1’s can go to this tournament is for the former, one that says if you have the means and availability and want to, let’s wrestle..is for the latter. What took place was the ultimate **** storm of bad luck, but you can’t let the unreal odds of that happening factor into policy. 

I don’t know by what means Yianni and Grey were paid for, but if it wasn’t by USAW then I don’t see how they can deny it. If it was...maybe, just maybe a line or thinking was that hey, this thing is going to arbitration and we may not know who’s 65 yet, not a bad thing for both get some work in. And again, you can’t let the random series of bad luck events that took place factor into that, or at least outweigh it. But then again I’m coming from the side of overall depth and that’s where we look at it differently. Who knows who’s right. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Lurker said:

I get what you are saying, and I concede “ridiculous” may be a bit much, but as I said to qc it’s just a matter of perspective which is more important, policy on who can compete in what season tournament for the point of a particular year’s world championships, or focus on the overall big picture on competitive depth of our national team. A blanket policy that says nobody else but the #1’s can go to this tournament is for the former, one that says if you have the means and availability and want to, let’s wrestle..is for the latter. What took place was the ultimate **** storm of bad luck, but you can’t let the unreal odds of that happening factor into policy. 

I don’t know by what means Yianni and Grey were paid for, but if it wasn’t by USAW then I don’t see how they can deny it. If it was...maybe, just maybe a line or thinking was that hey, this thing is going to arbitration and we may not know who’s 65 yet, not a bad thing for both get some work in. And again, you can’t let the random series of bad luck events that took place factor into that, or at least outweigh it. But then again I’m coming from the side of overall depth and that’s where we look at it differently. Who knows who’s right. 

Bloody Elbow had a wrapup of Yasar Dogu and said that USAW invited them both to go in order to be neutral while the arbitration was pending.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

50 minutes ago, ugarte said:

Bloody Elbow had a wrapup of Yasar Dogu and said that USAW invited them both to go in order to be neutral while the arbitration was pending.

That would make sense if not for the fact that the arbitration is with USOC not USAW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, mg113 said:

Not ridiculous. Just because he could go doesn't mean he should. Dogu was supposed to be a tuneup against international competition for the world team members. Yianni went just to prove a point - that he could beat Zain, even though everybody already knew that was possible - and to **** on Zain's parade which wound up injuring our world team member. I honestly don't think he meant to injure him, but the fact that Yianni is the alternate could mean he wanted to wrestle Zain with bad intentions, especially with the way the Trials ended. Again, I don't think Yianni injured Zain on purpose, but I think that possibility should be reason enough not to let him go in hindsight.

You seem to know a lot about what is in Yianni's head.  Did you get an interview with him that we haven't seen?

And you think Yianni conspired to injure Zain ("could mean he wanted to wrestle Zain with bad intentions")?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, tbert said:

That would make sense if not for the fact that the arbitration is with USOC not USAW.

But USAW is a party to the arbitration, not Retherford and avoiding any appearance of favoritism among the wrestlers - as opposed to defending their own decision - is in their long term interest. 

I'm just repeating what Bloody Elbow said, so I don't have any real read on their intent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎7‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 11:59 AM, qc8223 said:

lol not sure what you mean by that. I'm pretty frustrated with the situation because it went from bad to worse. I think Zain has the potential to do well, but now he's potentially hurt. It was the absolute worst case scenario. Why on Earth was Yianni at this tournament? I'd put the chances of him winning arbitration at 1%, so the only thing he could have done here is limit Zain's opportunities to see international competition for tune up purposes, which he did and much more by injuring him in the process. Yianni couldn't earn enough points to be seeded anyway, so why was he there? If he wants an international tune up, send him to Spain or Poland for those tournaments where he can't potentially hurt Team USA.

If Zain can go, which I expect he will be able to even if he's not 100%, he's gonna go. He won't step aside for Yianni because he's only at 80%, nor would I honestly. What I don't think can be argued is that an injured Zain is not a good option for Team USA. I'm very much on team Zain on this one because he's our guy. Frankly, I don't think the Cornell program has represented themselves well this summer.

This really can't be coming from an adult?  Maybe Yianni should issue an apology!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎7‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 3:13 PM, qc8223 said:

No doubt going to Dogu was best for Yianni, but it's not what's best for USA. None of our other reserves went to Dogu. Same thing last year. That's because this trip is meant to earn seeding points for the people on the team and work out some kinks before Worlds. Also, Chakaev and Rashidov will both be in Poland for their wrestle off. Yianni could have gotten better competition there if that's really his intent. He had already seen Bajrang. He knew where he stood there. It's pretty clear he and Cornell wanted to show that he was a better option than Zain in order to help their arbitration case. That's great for them, but not for USA because they're still going to lose and now Zain is potentially hobbled and even if he's not, he missed his opportunity for a good tune up.

Obviously, they can't ban him from competing, but it should have been strongly cautioned against and Cornell should have gone elsewhere if he really wanted more international competition. Poland is actually a better opportunity for him because he's guaranteed to have at least 2 top 5 guys in the world in the bracket in Rashidov and Chakaev.

Last time I checked, Yianni was not a reserve.  I guess you overlooked the fact that the outcome at this particular weight has yet to be determined.  Again, is this coming from an adult?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, RED said:

Last time I checked, Yianni was not a reserve.  I guess you overlooked the fact that the outcome at this particular weight has yet to be determined.  Again, is this coming from an adult?

exactly my thoughts, Yianni is not a reserve. This match should've been the final wrestle off IMO.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, RED said:

Last time I checked, Yianni was not a reserve.  I guess you overlooked the fact that the outcome at this particular weight has yet to be determined.  Again, is this coming from an adult?

Outcome has been determined.  There is a protest on the outcome.   A protest does not negate the outcome.  A ruling by a hearing or arbitration might or might not.  As of now Zain is the winner and Yanni is merely a reserve..  

I know, it hurts to acknowledge it, but time heals all.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, tbert said:

Outcome has been determined.  There is a protest on the outcome.   A protest does not negate the outcome.  A ruling by a hearing or arbitration might or might not.  As of now Zain is the winner and Yanni is merely a reserve..  

I know, it hurts to acknowledge it, but time heals all.

 

Yep outcome is determined but time is not on Zains side let's just enjoy his last world team

Edited by Sublime607

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Sublime607 said:

Yep outcome is determined but time is not on Zains side let's just enjoy his last world team

I like them both.  Important to realize it's only a game and outcomes are better left on the mat rather than courtrooms.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When your on the level those 2 are it's not a game it's a way of life. I agree that it should just be dropped it was unfortunate the events of match two. But I just dont see Zain beating Yianni from here on out.

Edited by Sublime607

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is really crazy that a decision has not been announced. It isn't like there is a big period of discovery where each party has to turn over evidence.

USA Wrestling should have already ruled and the competitors should know if it stands or if they have to re-wrestle the second match and possibly a third.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Sublime607 said:

When your on the level those 2 are it's not a game it's a way of life. I agree that it should just be dropped it was unfortunate the events of match two. But I just dont see Zain beating Yianni from here on out.

After match one final x   you could say the same about Zain.   Nothing in that last match told me yanni was going to win all futures. Zain took him down virtually uncontested. The rest I can agree.  

Zain had an excellent game plan  at final x against yanni. Yanni made adjustments at Dogu.Other than the lawyer angle, Tthat's another reason I am against a do over. Favors Yanni as he had a chance for adjustments against a good plan by Zain @ finalx.

Other than that, I dont care.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, RED said:

Last time I checked, Yianni was not a reserve.  I guess you overlooked the fact that the outcome at this particular weight has yet to be determined.  Again, is this coming from an adult?

I'm not an adult, but you apparently don't understand how protests work? lol The outcome is has been determined. There is a minimal chance that arbitration will overturn that outcome, but as of now, Zain is the team member.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, DuckFor2 said:

exactly my thoughts, Yianni is not a reserve. This match should've been the final wrestle off IMO.

Not how things work my friend. I also would have liked that to be the case because I think Yianni is better, but that desire doesn't change the fact that, as of now, Zain is the world team member. We can't just will things into being. We have to take them as they actually are.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, qc8223 said:

Not how things work my friend. I also would have liked that to be the case because I think Yianni is better, but that desire doesn't change the fact that, as of now, Zain is the world team member. We can't just will things into being. We have to take them as they actually are.

i hear ya. I'm thinking the decision will come down to have them wrestle that 3rd match, it's only fair to both of these guys. I also hope Zain's knee is good to go. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, DuckFor2 said:

i hear ya. I'm thinking the decision will come down to have them wrestle that 3rd match, it's only fair to both of these guys. I also hope Zain's knee is good to go. 

I'd be shocked if that happened honestly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More of a chance for a second match rematch than third.  Nobody in their right mind is going to change an official score to award the win to another team/competitor. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...