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J' Den will take out Snyder at the Olympic Trials

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2 hours ago, spladle08 said:
2 hours ago, Ogalthorpe Haywood said:
I think his approach will be to push the pace really hard and test the gas tank after a tough cut. I think at 86kg Cox will be vulnerable the 2nd day of making scratch  

I understand the thinking but Cox is just so positionally sound, I question Taylor's ability to get to his legs and create those positions he thrives in. We all know foreign wrestlers have that mentality of create action off your opponents shot and "getting to the legs" is usually only half the battle. I think that is a big factor in the rise of DT he's just so good in those scrambly situations it's just not fair, and its exhausting. If he can't create these spots with Cox. I see it being a cruise control victory.

This is just an absolutely ridiculous statement.

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This is just an absolutely ridiculous statement.
Elaborate? Cox is hella defensive. DT is a master scrambler and that is a tiring endeavour. DT kills people's gas tanks in scrambles.....
What part of that Is ridiculous.

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In your experience DT destroys people from relentless neutral attacks? Or on the mat action?

Of the 2 who is better from neutral?

If you saw DT winning would it be on the mat?

How often does Cox get taken down/turned?

I think Cox controls the bout on the feet and wins a low scoring affair like 3-1

 

 

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I hate the reduction in weight classifications every 4 years.  Now that we are solid two deep at most weights, it hurts even more to see the talented and dedicated athletes this keeps out of our line-up.

 

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Well according to Snyder in a interview yesterday on track wresting Cox is the toughest wrestler he is currently facing in the US and even said Sad and Cox are the toughest two wrestlers he has wrestled currently wrestling. From what I can gather from his interview he is winning 2 out of 3 from Cox and it appears from weights 86k -125k that Cox is the only one who can steal a match from him. 

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8 minutes ago, PRyan2012 said:

Well according to Snyder in a interview yesterday on track wresting Cox is the toughest wrestler he is currently facing in the US and even said Sad and Cox are the toughest two wrestlers he has wrestled currently wrestling. From what I can gather from his interview he is winning 2 out of 3 from Cox and it appears from weights 86k -125k that Cox is the only one who can steal a match from him. 

This is yet another reason why Cox needs to drop to 86kg for next year, starting his descent plan the day after winning his next WC at 92kg.  The best Team USA that we could send would be Cox at 86 and Snyder at 97.  DT is also a WC, but is also coming off an injury of unknown actual extent.  As a DT fan, it irks me to say it, but putting Cox in that lineup at 86 is making more and more and more sense to maximize Team USA potential (given potential impact of injury).  Now... if DT beats Cox at OTT, then so be it.  He's the best for that weight then, and will probably bring home another Gold.  Either way, we have tremendous chances at that weight with those two duking it out.

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Everything depends on the weigh-in rules. To me the biggest change for Snyder has been the change in when they weigh in. He went from an engine who wore out his opponents with strength and endless energy to someone much more mortal. When Cox made 86 for Rio he was huge for the weight. Not sure if he can make it now or if the benefits would outweigh the cost.   

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Based on what he’s said about the weight cut, I’m guessing J’Den will challenge up at 97. He’s so ripped that it’s hard to imagine that he’ll lose much in terms of size and strength, and he already wrestles a controlled style that won’t require significant adjustment - more similar to Dake adjusting his style up a weight than DT or Sadulaev bumping up and adjusting.

 

However. If Cox ends up at 86kg, I hope we get to see him vs. PD at trials. It would be a very satisfying match to see.

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Well I do believe that J'den will move up to 97, and how it will go between him and Snyder, I have no clue. But I do think Kyle is getting too muscle bound, I think he needs to train to become faster, and obviously work on set ups, and finishes. If he does these things, I think he remains our rep at 97. 

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1 hour ago, PRyan2012 said:

Here is Mr Cox's last loss. Little over 1 year ago. How ironic it was to Mr Sharipov: 213 is going to be a harder go

That was J'den's first loss at 92 kg.  His last loss was to Boke at 2018 Yasar Dogu.  Would have to find the interview, but this match was one of the reasons he made the move to the OTC.  By his own admission he gassed in part because he was still helping at Mizzou at the time and wasn't able to devote all his time to his training.

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just noticed dt sent cox a congrats on twitter - is he trying to butter up cox to prevent him from coming down ??  Is anyone really buying snyders interview where he supposedly said he takes 2 of 3 from cox ? didn't see it, just saw that in this thread. Snyder is a gamer though

what do u do if your cox ? I think it comes down to a few things

--who do you want to take out for legacy ? and ---which weight will affect performance most. While there is a weight cut issue (and we've seen cox complain about it before) there is a major adjustment to going up (see taylor, and sadulaev, and yazadani acclimation year)

IMO yazdani actually would be a bad matchup for cox. cox likes to work from space - even admittedly. yazdani you need to feel him at least once first or he will push you around the mat with his unique power.  dierenger and taylor gave up 100 pushouts to yazdani first time, need to feel him once. not that once at olympics. Cox had had 2 shots to get yazdani at worlds and olympics, and he didn't even get to him. .imo that was the time to do it if you wanted yazdani....at this stage you need to move on and challenge sadulaev. A few wins over taylor already proves cox legacy at 86

Edited by alliseeisgold

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17 minutes ago, alliseeisgold said:

just noticed dt sent cox a congrats on twitter - is he trying to butter up cox to prevent him from coming down ??  Is anyone really buying snyders interview where he supposedly said he takes 2 of 3 from cox ? didn't see it, just saw that in this thread. Snyder is a gamer though

what do u do if your cox ? I think it comes down to a few things

--who do you want to take out for legacy ? and ---which weight will affect performance most. While there is a weight cut issue (and we've seen cox complain about it before) there is a major adjustment to going up (see taylor, and sadulaev, and yazadani acclimation year)

IMO yazdani actually would be a bad matchup for cox. cox likes to work from space - even admittedly. yazdani you need to feel him at least once first or he will push you around the mat with his unique power.  dierenger and taylor gave up 100 pushouts to yazdani first time, need to feel him once. not that once at olympics. Cox had had 2 shots to get yazdani at worlds and olympics, and he didn't even get to him. .imo that was the time to do it if you wanted yazdani....at this stage you need to move on and challenge sadulaev. A few wins over taylor already proves cox legacy at 86

It depends on how bad the cut is. If its a really tough cut, then go up, if its semi tough, go down. I dont care how bad of a match up yazdani might be, Sadulaev is probably tougher. I dont think Yazdani will push Cox around.

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12 hours ago, FlyinLion said:

That was J'den's first loss at 92 kg.  His last loss was to Boke at 2018 Yasar Dogu.  Would have to find the interview, but this match was one of the reasons he made the move to the OTC.  By his own admission he gassed in part because he was still helping at Mizzou at the time and wasn't able to devote all his time to his training.

Just saying 213 is a much more difficult road for Cox. Several guys can beat him. Can he do it? I think he can. It is just that at 203 no one is close. Not sure about 189 after the cut. He has a big decision to make. 

Edited by PRyan2012

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Legacy this legacy that. It’s simple, the best thing for his legacy is an Olympic title, even if it’s against the weakest Olympian in history. That’s what’s missing from his resume. Cox is at best 50/50 to make the team at Snyder’s weight,  and from there, a big dog to win the weight a the Olympics. If he’s smart, he’s going 86 kg where he’s a substantial favorite to win the spot (especially given DT’s Injury) and then has a great shot of winning it all. And Cox is very smart. 

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11 hours ago, alliseeisgold said:

IMO yazdani actually would be a bad matchup for cox. cox likes to work from space - even admittedly. yazdani you need to feel him at least once first or he will push you around the mat with his unique power.  dierenger and taylor gave up 100 pushouts to yazdani first time, need to feel him once. not that once at olympics. 

I have the exact opposite view. Cox is a nightmare matchup for Yazdani. In what world is the bigger, stronger guy who makes a living schooling guys from distance a dog to a smaller guy who needs tie-ups to execute his offense and has a history of gassing? Cox all day and he knows it, which is why 86 is the right path. 

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15 hours ago, alliseeisgold said:

Is anyone really buying snyders interview where he supposedly said he takes 2 of 3 from cox ? didn't see it, just saw that in this thread. Snyder is a gamer though

Do you have a link to this interview?

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Cox is arguably the best defensive wrestler in the world right now.

DT is arguably the best scrambler and scorer in the world. 

Snyder while obviously still very  formidable has seemingly peaked and is no longer the feared opponent he once was.  You could argue that he is on the decline.

If Cox has to choose who he would rather face in a winner take all series to go to the Olympics  I tend to think he would rather face Snyder. And with the cut that he would have to undertake to make 86 I think 97 makes more sense. 

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5 hours ago, wrestlingnerd said:

Legacy this legacy that. It’s simple, the best thing for his legacy is an Olympic title, even if it’s against the weakest Olympian in history. That’s what’s missing from his resume. Cox is at best 50/50 to make the team at Snyder’s weight,  and from there, a big dog to win the weight a the Olympics. If he’s smart, he’s going 86 kg where he’s a substantial favorite to win the spot (especially given DT’s Injury) and then has a great shot of winning it all. And Cox is very smart. 

What about the weight cut? Wasn’t 86 brutal for J’den even with day before weigh in? Now he has to hold that cut and compete too.  I don’t know, maybe he can do it. But nonetheless, he is meeting with his coaches next week to discuss this and then J’den will decide.  Sounds like he doesn’t even know himself which weight he’s going yet. 

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9 minutes ago, 2td3nf said:

What about the weight cut? Wasn’t 86 brutal for J’den even with day before weigh in? Now he has to hold that cut and compete too.  I don’t know, maybe he can do it. But nonetheless, he is meeting with his coaches next week to discuss this and then J’den will decide.  Sounds like he doesn’t even know himself which weight he’s going yet. 

In J'den's post World's interview he suggested that he has not yet decided.  He also was pretty adamant that having 86kg not be qualified yet didn't concern him at all.  

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