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Will John Smith win another title at tOSU?

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He won't. OSU brings its lower tier guys (still huge recruits) up, but its top tier guys(of which they have their fair share) don't explode.

Kaid Brock is emblematic of the successes and failures of the program in this era.

When Smith was rolling, he had Pat and Branch as assistants, similar to when Strobel had Santoro and Mccoy. 

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Out of all the PSU wins under Sanderson, OkState, under Smith, came the closest to knocking them off in 2013, losing by 4 pts.  Smith will continue to produce teams that can break the 100 pts barrier.  He just can't have PSU and tOSU continue to score 120+.

With what Sanderson has done, it is REALLY hard to predict anyone else winning.  However, I don't think Smith has really dropped off.  He just has to deal with the same thing Iowa does.  PSU and tOSU are juggernaught programs that finally have the right coaching staff to nearly maximize the raw potential.

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Who knows? Odd are he won't. That being said, before you write him off remember their recruiting has jumped a ton the last couple of yeears. Their 2020 class is a monster, monster class and they could still add one of the two top pound for pound kids in that class. Assuming Fix, redshirts this year he will lineup with those kids. If they can get this new wrestling facility built soon that should also help their recruiting. 

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As long as Carl continues on at PSU this topic could easily be replaced with "Will Smith, Brands, Ryan, etc. win another title."  

Great 2020 class as mentioned...it's all in how they develop and so far Carl has the lead. 

Edited by Idaho

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11 hours ago, hammerlockthree said:

He won't. OSU brings its lower tier guys (still huge recruits) up, but its top tier guys(of which they have their fair share) don't explode.

Kaid Brock is emblematic of the successes and failures of the program in this era.

When Smith was rolling, he had Pat and Branch as assistants, similar to when Strobel had Santoro and Mccoy. 

A little unfair to name Brock, as he blew out his knee early in his career, right after a huge pin-win over Cody Brewer. 

Fix may go 2, 1,1,1 for all we know.

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15 hours ago, CoachWrestling said:

I’m thinking that he will not. The time has passed for them and they will stay around the 3-7 mark. 

I'm confused, what do you mean by "another" has he "ever?"

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I think he certainly could. Has some firepower in the wings and they are always good enough for that any team can get hot on the right day. It would take some big head to head wins over the elite, and he’s had and going to have squads capable of that. 

Now whether he will. I think his window is Fix’ eligibility. Not just because of him but what they have coming and that timeline. Goes without saying he’s a big piece. I think PSU will come down a little bit, not enough to where they won’t be the favorite but maybe more catchable. And Smith will have the guns capable. 

Having said all that, if I had to put money on yes or no, it would be no. 

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Losing Kerkvliet really hurt. Keep what he has coming in, along with an instant 285 contender and I would put them at the top in 20-21.  Right now they are dead at 197-285 and 2 weights with the likelihood of zero hurts. 

With that said they can be very strong from 125-184. 

125-Picc-top 4

133- Fix-finalist

141-Brock-low AA

149-Boo/Gfeller AA

157-Sheets/loser at 149 and even Balmeceda

165-Smith-mid AA if he shows up committed

174-Wittlake-unsure

184-Geer-mid AA

A healthy Marsden is serviceable but they need firepower up top to truly compete with the big dogs  

 

 

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I saw talk of Geer at 197.  He definitely has the frame and he was there last year before Weigel came back.  Either way I think Smith has shown he can invent upperweights.  Schafer, Weigel, White, and Boyd were all pretty lightly regarded recruits that had success the past few years.  

As for whether they win... 

The way things go these days I think recruiting has more momentum than the sport itself.  Sign an influential superstar and guys will line up to surround him.  It happened with Taylor/Ruth and continued with Nickal/Nolf.  Having two at once made those teams invincible.  It happened with Snyder and they won a title.  Now it's happening with Spencer Lee and Iowa has a shot the next 2 years.  And at OSU it's happening with Fix.  They signed him and all of a sudden the 2020 class is one of the best any school's ever had.  Great young wrestlers want to wrestle with other great young wrestlers even more than they want to wrestle for legendary coaches (and they really want to wrestle for legendary coaches).  

So say Fix takes the Olympic RS and then competes in the ensuing 3 seasons.  That gives the big 2020 class time to get on the mat.  And if Smith can't win by the time Fix is done then he will never win.  

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13 hours ago, boconnell said:

I saw talk of Geer at 197.  He definitely has the frame and he was there last year before Weigel came back.  Either way I think Smith has shown he can invent upperweights.  Schafer, Weigel, White, and Boyd were all pretty lightly regarded recruits that had success the past few years.  

As for whether they win... 

The way things go these days I think recruiting has more momentum than the sport itself.  Sign an influential superstar and guys will line up to surround him.  It happened with Taylor/Ruth and continued with Nickal/Nolf.  Having two at once made those teams invincible.  It happened with Snyder and they won a title.  Now it's happening with Spencer Lee and Iowa has a shot the next 2 years.  And at OSU it's happening with Fix.  They signed him and all of a sudden the 2020 class is one of the best any school's ever had.  Great young wrestlers want to wrestle with other great young wrestlers even more than they want to wrestle for legendary coaches (and they really want to wrestle for legendary coaches).  

So say Fix takes the Olympic RS and then competes in the ensuing 3 seasons.  That gives the big 2020 class time to get on the mat.  And if Smith can't win by the time Fix is done then he will never win.  

With Geer at 197, what happens to 184?  Maybe that settles for 2020-2021, but this upcoming season I would say they are better of with Geer at 184.

As far as tOSU goes, they won a title because of Logan Stieber and he was much more the catalyst for success than Snyder.  The Snyder name has since taken over, but a 4x Champ was HUGE and compounding it, with a team title the same year as his 4th, was a huge selling point.

Fix helps, to a point, but not winning it at 133 tones that down a smidge. If he does well at Worlds, maybe that trumps the NCAA result.  But, If he doesn't win it again next season, I think his "brand" takes a knock.  Regardless, Smith has always been a great recruiter.  His 2020 class makes a lot of sense, regardless of Fix, since I would think he really only has significant money tied up in Fix, Picc and maybe Brock.  Boo, Gfeller and Geer may have some partials.  I would assume that his son doesn't tie up much scholly money.  Wittlake may have a bit, but he seems to have fizzled a bit and may not be getting that much.  With Rogers, Jacobe Smith, Weigel and White all leaving that had to have freed up a decent amount of money.  

Going forward, landing an Amos or Ferrari type up top is paramount.  Another title contender up top to go with Plott could be enough to put them over the top.

Edited by MSU158

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