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27 minutes ago, LJB said:

all anyone has to see is that a thread bashing FLO has continued for several days and 8 pages and counting, while, a thread praising Flo has one reply...

 

FLO has never bashed PSU... not once... 

manufactured outrage...

this is the world we live in...

Again, I am not stating the Flo organization has an institutional bias. I see no evidence of that.

I am saying that Pyles is an Iowa fan, which as a matter of fact he is, and that his fandom creeps in as bias from time to time. That bias is on occasion manifested as bias towards whomever is opposite PSU. The FRL show in question is one such instance.

 

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2 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Again, I am not stating the Flo organization has an institutional bias. I see no evidence of that.

I am saying that Pyles is an Iowa fan, which as a matter of fact he is, and that his fandom creeps in as bias from time to time. That bias is on occasion manifested as bias towards whomever is opposite PSU. The FRL show in question is one such instance.

 

you are clearly just hearing what you want to hear... nothing more

it is a weak state of being...

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Flo guys, I hope y’all can dig through the 80% nonsense in this thread and take the 20% of insightful constructive criticism. Many of us deeply appreciate Flo, and I’ve often said it gives me the most enjoyment per dollar of anything I buy each year (although I can’t for the life of me figure out why you can’t organize and expand the technique section which used to be great).

That said, as far as FRL goes, I don’t buy that you have to have competed at a high level like some of us to comment on tactics and technical intricacies, but having a high level retired athlete, official, or coach on every once and a while would certainly be beneficial. It’s not like you can’t find people in those categories with tons of personality. Mike Mal’s podcast was great on that stuff, and he already works for you, and after having him do a clinic at our club, I can assure everyone high level technique and tactics is all he thinks about, so just Skype the dude in.

One last thing, I know you all want to emulate successful, sometimes though commentary from “main stream sports”, but you really have to do a better job of realizing when you’re punching up and when you’re punching down. Every time some suited commentator is talking **** on an NFL or NBA player, they are talking about someone who is probably more famous than them, makes more money than they do, and is living a life where it should be pretty easy to dust off a loud mouth on TV and get back to the copious attention of good-looking company, but wrestling is not like that; often when you’re going at someone, outside of the .01% of elites, they very well might be scrapping by, their die hard fans are basically consists of their nuclear family, they are thinking about how to keep the dream alive another day, and may be in a pretty low place sometimes. Just keep that in mind that sometimes you’re the celebrities benefiting a lot off of the mass of wrestlers who might not be seeing the same rewards as y’all from their labors...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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21 minutes ago, LJB said:

you are clearly just hearing what you want to hear... nothing more

it is a weak state of being...

Yeah, and I waited years to say something about it, LJB. Clearly its just me. Except 9 pages say otherwise. 

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4 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Yeah, and I waited years to say something about it, LJB. Clearly its just me. Except 9 pages say otherwise. 

you're not unique... yeah

you're also not correct...

it is the bane of "team" and group think...

a weak state of being...

i route for no team... only individuals... from that perspective, the only bias i have ever felt on FRL is pyles silly pro-USA, which, might be more anti-russian, perspective on everything... it is annoying, but, i can live with it... 

the rest of the "bias" complaints just come from weak minded "fans"... it is easy to see it as baseless because every weak minded "fan" thinks they are constantly putting down that weak minded "fan's" own team... 

 

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1 hour ago, TBar1977 said:

I am saying that Pyles is an Iowa fan, which as a matter of fact he is, and that his fandom creeps in as bias from time to time.

Tbar, I am an Iowa fan. A couple weeks ago Pyles said very bluntly that PSU had the best wrestlers and coaches. No Iowa fan can say that without the gag reflex kicking in. 

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56 minutes ago, GoNotQuietly said:

One last thing, I know you all want to emulate successful, sometimes though commentary from “main stream sports”, but you really have to do a better job of realizing when you’re punching up and when you’re punching down. Every time some suited commentator is talking **** on an NFL or NBA player, they are talking about someone who is probably more famous than them, makes more money than they do, and is living a life where it should be pretty easy to dust off a loud mouth on TV and get back to the copious attention of good-looking company, but wrestling is not like that; often when you’re going at someone, outside of the .01% of elites, they very well might be scrapping by, their die hard fans are basically consists of their nuclear family, they are thinking about how to keep the dream alive another day, and may be in a pretty low place sometimes. Just keep that in mind that sometimes you’re the celebrities benefiting a lot off of the mass of wrestlers who might not be seeing the same rewards as y’all from their labors...

Whats the best way to bring attention to those guys who are scraping by? Praise is good, but you can only hear so much about how hard someone works until people are just tired of it. A contentious character gets attention and unfortunately that does play a part here too. I agree with what you are saying, and there is definitely a fine line to walk, but to suggest there is no room for criticism of the athletes can actually hurt the athletes in my opinion. You have to create an interesting narrative to keep people entertained, but its definitely a fine line though. 

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27 minutes ago, LJB said:

you're not unique... yeah

you're also not correct...

it is the bane of "team" and group think...

a weak state of being...

i route for no team... only individuals... from that perspective, the only bias i have ever felt on FRL is pyles silly pro-USA, which, might be more anti-russian, perspective on everything... it is annoying, but, i can live with it... 

the rest of the "bias" complaints just come from weak minded "fans"... it is easy to see it as baseless because every weak minded "fan" thinks they are constantly putting down that weak minded "fan's" own team... 

 

You can write those words to diminish any criticism of bias, regardless of how it manifests. If there were a Russian here he might say that you are a weak minded fan. See how that works? 

Anyone who wants to see what truly unbiased reporting on the Zain - Yianni match from the other day looks like, read this article from Track Wrestling. FRL 403, takes notes. You can learn something here.

 https://www.trackwrestling.com/tw/PortalPost.jsp?postId=1682294132

Edited by TBar1977

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2 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

You can write those words to diminish any criticism of bias, regardless of how it manifests. If there were a Russian here he might say that you are a weak minded fan. See how that works? 

you are horrible at this...

if there was a russian here he might agree with me totally and commend me for being to clearly see what was going on...

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14 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

If there were a Russian here he might say that you are a weak minded fan.

Didn't Pyles do the pledge of allegiance over FRL? He openly and consistently describes himself as a patriot and just yesterday he was talking about how the Russian government has people killed. 

Let me know when Pyles sings the Iowa fight song on air, otherwise that seems like a false equivalence.

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3 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Trolly on, LJB. Trolly on. 

oh, don't worry, i'll always keep being me...

and by all means, you keep scouring the googlewebs for evidence of the big bad wolf... make sure your supply of pitchforks and torches is well stocked up... the plebians will need to be armed by more than manufactured outrage and rhetoric...

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5 minutes ago, LJB said:

oh, don't worry, i'll always keep being me...

and by all means, you keep scouring the googlewebs for evidence of the big bad wolf... make sure your supply of pitchforks and torches is well stocked up... the plebians will need to be armed by more than manufactured outrage and rhetoric...

I am looking to get this thread to 15 pages. Give a shout out to your friends so we can keep this one going strong today. 

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8 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

I am looking to get this thread to 15 pages. Give a shout out to your friends so we can keep this one going strong today. 

it's adorable you think i have friends...

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23 minutes ago, russelscout said:

Whats the best way to bring attention to those guys who are scraping by? Praise is good, but you can only hear so much about how hard someone works until people are just tired of it. A contentious character gets attention and unfortunately that does play a part here too. I agree with what you are saying, and there is definitely a fine line to walk, but to suggest there is no room for criticism of the athletes can actually hurt the athletes in my opinion. You have to create an interesting narrative to keep people entertained, but its definitely a fine line though. 

Absolutely, the athletes are not immune from criticism, my point there was simply that there is a fine line and I don't think that a lot of wrestlers should be fair game to Flo under the current paradigm, honestly.  What I would really like to see, is Flo putting up serious prize money for the events as part of their coverage contracts.  Certainly, for the top couple guys at Schultz, NYAC, etc. Flo can put together a package.  Some scholarships generated from the massive amount of money they generate off of unpaid high-schoolers and college kids seems appropriate also, if they can find a way to pay the community back like that without skirting NCAA rules.  I also don't mean to insinuate that they do nothing; I think the FloFilms and a lot of their social media hype is phenomenal for the athletes (although, how hard is it to just # the guys on twitter and instgram, i mean really?). 

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1 minute ago, GoNotQuietly said:

I think the FloFilms and a lot of their social media hype is phenomenal for the athletes (although, how hard is it to just # the guys on twitter and instgram, i mean really?). 

FloFilms excellent. Flo social media godawful. There's a big halo effect, which we see is diminishing. Flo's got every thing it needs to do better. Waiting...

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Gotta love the folks that post like the following —

— I am right.  Flo people said this, backs up my case.  Flo people agree with me.  That shows you are wrong.

- you are wrong.  I don’t care that Flo people agree with you or said X.  They / he is horribly biased, blind, and / or doesn’t know what the hell they are talking about.

 

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1 hour ago, jhc said:

"Flo social media godawful" ??? what is so "godawful about it ?

Lol you've got to be kidding!

 > "THE BEST RTC IN AMERICA IS...?"

 > "MY FAVORITE WRESTLING MEME PAGE IS...?"

 > "WHAT'S MORE DANGEROUS? A. BO/NOLF B. DT/RUTH"

 > "WHO WINS 149 THIS YEAR?"

 > "BURROUGHS WILL TAKE DOWN ASKREN _____ TIMES"

Stylized to match the final example: FLO SOCIAL MEDIA IS L_ZY, SH_LLOW, SH_TTY.

All-caps formatting is annoying. Those examples come from graphics not from plain text and so persons with accessibility needs, such as those who use screen readers, cannot consume. Flo presents a 'new media' vibe and it touts itself as a tech-savvy outfit and so its social media absolutely does disappoint. Examples shown here are amateurish not savvy. Flo social media pales in comparison to FloFilms. Hard to argue otherwise! Nothing says savvy like screenshots of Wiki medal-record tables!

Not to mention that a good portion of Flo social-media content comprises screenshots of athletes' posts (Flo would respond to this critique by saying 'we're helping to amplify the message' but I say nonsense -- by posting screenshot rather than posting hyperlink Flo, in some sense, steals the content). And also a good portion of Flo social-media content comprises screenshots of Flobros' posts. It's a Good Ol' Boys club with lots of sizzle, with little substance, and with absolutely zero polish.

 

Edited by jon

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19 hours ago, Jaroslav Hasek said:

if you are referring to college rankings then that's on me and CP. Nomad doesn't do the NCAA rankings. Although Nomad may have defended the practice of not ranking true freshman. in which case then it's probably fair to include him.

I was really referring to how incredibly arrogant he comes across when defending ranking system.

But since you brought it up yes I think your rankings at times become borderline irrelevant because you refuse to rank (or comically under-rank) true freshman like Spencer Lee and Mark Hall after its known they’re wrestling as true freshmen. 

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6 minutes ago, BobDole said:

I sent my resume, but Pyles denied me. I believe it's age discrimination. I am going to file a lawsuit.

Discrimination? Lol you're not so far from the truth. You see his great idea that UWW should separate Iran + Israel entrants? 

 

Edited by jon

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3 hours ago, GoNotQuietly said:

Flo guys, I hope y’all can dig through the 80% nonsense in this thread and take the 20% of insightful constructive criticism. 

One last thing,..... talking about someone who is probably more famous than them, makes more money than they do, and is living a life where it should be pretty easy to dust off a loud mouth on TV and get back to the copious attention of good-looking company, but wrestling is not like that; often when you’re going at someone, outside of the .01% of elites, 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

All joking aside, we are aware that we have areas of improvement.  Of course we can improve in some areas. not everything is always as buttoned up as we would like. sometimes it's frustrating for us, too. (i wasn't thrilled with the production for Yianni-Zain, for instance).

As far as critiquing 'non-elites' - i'm not sure i follow. can you provide examples? Generally speaking, i think there's a fine line between being respectful and giving our genuine opinions, which the sport deserves. If we don't call it as we see it and assessing things as they are to protect feelings (which has been a problem in wrestling media (and wrestling gov't) for a long time, than what's the point. that being said, i don't recall an instance where we've been over-the-top critical of athletes. 

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1 hour ago, jon said:

Lol you've got to be kidding!

 > "THE BEST RTC IN AMERICA IS...?"

 > "MY FAVORITE WRESTLING MEME PAGE IS...?"

 

 

maybe our social media just isn't for you. 

people love it. we're quit successful with it, and there's much more to it than your above examples.

for sure there is the occasional post that i don't like, but for the most part, it's engaging and interesting and the results speak for themselves.

don't expect a change in our social media methods any time soon. 

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