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Looked like Thomas had a lead leg dangling for someone willing to take it but Fernandes was tentative and Thomas ripped off a quick single leg and put Fernandes right on his back for a quick fall.

Cardenas and Laird did nothing for 7 minutes and went to SV tied 1-1. In OT, Cardenas hit two blast doubles but Laird tied up the first and they went out of bounds before Cardenas could cover for 2 on both. I think Cardenas got a little frustrated and a little sloppy and ended up on the wrong end of a scramble. I don't think he's used to anyone fighting him off when he gets in that deep.

Edited by ugarte

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46 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

I do know they're 2 separate teams and did try to look up FLWC at first (the RTC has a much better website BTW).   I'm not saying the 2 clubs are necessarily "interacting," just thatI i imagine the kids likely attend practices for both.  I mean don't the guys that are actually on the Cornell roster often attend the RTC practices as well?

The short answer is no. Grayshirting athletes are not yet enrolled in the college in which they plan to (but are not bound to) enroll and cannot participate in that school’s official practices, which is where the coaching staff of said school’s program spends its time actually coaching. When the season is over, some coaches may spend a meaningful amount of time coaching at their affiliated RTC, but even if they wanted to do so suits the NCAA season, it’s practically impossible due to the in-season demands on their time. in other words, grayshirting and redshirting are NOT the same athletically. 

Edited by wrestlingnerd

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18 minutes ago, wrestlingnerd said:

The short answer is no. Grayshirting athletes are not yet enrolled in the college in which they plan to (but are not bound to) enroll and cannot participate in that school’s official practices, which is where the coaching staff of said school’s program spends its time actually coaching. When the season is over, some coaches may spend a meaningful amount of time coaching at their affiliated RTC, but even if they wanted to do so suits the NCAA season, it’s practically impossible due to the in-season demands on their time. in other words, grayshirting and redshirting are NOT the same athletically. 

 I think that’s a different topic.   Grey is literally listed as the head freestyle coach of the RTC, so I think it’s safe to assume he spends a “meaningful amount of time” coaching there. But what I’m not sure of is how much time the grayshirts spend there.   Although considering they’re pretty much just taking a few community college courses and wrestling, I’d bet they’re there pretty often (but of course have no way to prove it).

BTW I do think the NJ trio will be good. I’m sure Fernandes probably needs to work on his bottom wrestling considering he pretty much pinned all of his opponents last year in the first period.

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103....

I don’t mean to drag this on but you’re suggesting RTCs, such as Cornell’s, are being used to violate NCAA rules and allow non-students to practice with the team as if they were on the team. I just disagree and find no evidence of such a thing. I am not a Cornell insider but have donated to a couple of different RTCs and am familiar with how they work. The greyshirts at Cornell are not attending Cornell practice. They are not coached daily by Koll and staff. I don’t know what exactly Grey’s role is in their development during the season, but I can assure you that in-season and afternoon wrestling season is very different for coaches. I see no way he splits his time as you suggest. 

My point was that the NJ guys will likely improve more when they’re in the Cornell room coached by the Cornell staff daily, working out with the full team daily, having access to all the resources available to student-athletes daily. Your point is that you think they’re already being coached in super secret practices by Mike Grey on a frequent basis because a website suggests to you Grey spends a lot of time at the RTC during the folkstyle season. Even if that were true, which I very much doubt, it’s still not the same situation. 

I agree the NJ guys will be good. Didn’t mean to suggest otherwise. I just thought they’d be a bit more competitive than they showed in the quarters, nothing more. 

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Well, the grey shirts at Cornell may not have the benefit of full time coaching by the staff of their college to be, but they also don't have to carry a full course load like redshirts - the burden depending, of course, upon the academic rigor of the particular college.  The grey shirts at Cornell can take no college courses at all if they wish.  And if they take courses, they're at a local community college or on-line with the credits transferrable to Cornell (usually it's SUNY branch) once they enroll.  So I wouldn't agree that they are underprivileged vis-a-vis redshirts - especially when compared with redshirts at an academically rigorous college.

Edited by witwhiz

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Now that IS a different topic altogether. It is unquestionably easier academically to take 0-12 credits or whatever at a CC. But the greyshirts are technically deferring enrollment for a year, so the right comp for their experience is that of kids who don't go to school at all (non-athletes sometimes do this to gain a year of maturity while "seeing the world"). I think a real redshirt is more advantageous to a recent HS grad's development than a grayshirt, but the easier academic situation is a benefit of the latter for sure.

It's ironic that in wrestling, some of the best athletes committed to the best wrestling schools grayshirt, while in football, which is the sport that I believe started the practice, it's the relative scrubs who are asked to grayshirt, either to give them a year to improve enough to qualify for a spot on the team or to give the coach some time to consider how badly they need the guy.

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55 minutes ago, wrestlingnerd said:

103....

I don’t mean to drag this on but you’re suggesting RTCs, such as Cornell’s, are being used to violate NCAA rules and allow non-students to practice with the team as if they were on the team. I just disagree and find no evidence of such a thing. I am not a Cornell insider but have donated to a couple of different RTCs and am familiar with how they work. The greyshirts at Cornell are not attending Cornell practice. They are not coached daily by Koll and staff. I don’t know what exactly Grey’s role is in their development during the season, but I can assure you that in-season and afternoon wrestling season is very different for coaches. I see no way he splits his time as you suggest. 

My point was that the NJ guys will likely improve more when they’re in the Cornell room coached by the Cornell staff daily, working out with the full team daily, having access to all the resources available to student-athletes daily. Your point is that you think they’re already being coached in super secret practices by Mike Grey on a frequent basis because a website suggests to you Grey spends a lot of time at the RTC during the folkstyle season. Even if that were true, which I very much doubt, it’s still not the same situation. 

I agree the NJ guys will be good. Didn’t mean to suggest otherwise. I just thought they’d be a bit more competitive than they showed in the quarters, nothing more. 

You keep trying to put words in my mouth.

I didn’t say I thought the grayshirts attended Cornell practices.  I said I thought they attended the RTC practices (which based on my understanding of the eligible athlete criteria is perfectly legal), presumably led by Grey and also likely attended by current Cornell wrestlers.

It’s not just Cornell of course.  l’m sure the increase in PSU grayshirts is likely in part due to the rise of NLWC, where I’d bet they are attending RTC practices as well.

Edit:  In this case I was not trying to suggest that anything fishy was going on.  Just that I think the statement of them “spending no time with the staff” (or little time for that matter) is likely false.

 

Edited by 1032004

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2 minutes ago, wrestlingnerd said:

You literally said that you think grayshirts attend practices for "both", those of their RTCs/clubs and those of the college team's. They do not.

Sorry, I meant I think they attend both FLWC and NYRTC practices, not Cornell’s

Edited by 1032004

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I heard Scottie Boykin is the main coach for the grey shirts.  Former UTC wrestler. Fernandes was wearing a Boykin singlet in his last match.  Nice 9-3 win for 5tg over Intermat's #19 guy Cary Miller. 

Edited by RedFan

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Foca came very close to beating Bullard. Looked good. Needs to get used to the strength at this level and not underestimate his opponents. 

Cardenas got a takedown of the whistle but was otherwise dominated by Geer. 

Fernandes is wild to watch on top. Finally got the tilt he was trying for in the third. His roll to a reversal was also sweet. 

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In the unlikely chance you aren't tired of following Cornell recruits, two of them are in the Doc Buchanan Invitational:

120:  #3 seed Cornella into the quarterfinals (10-3, 4:31 fall)

132:  #11 seed Wyatt Yapoujian into the quarterfinals (3:23 fall, 3-2 over #6 seed)

Coverage on Flo, quarterfinals scheduled at 8pm Eastern.

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3 hours ago, klehner said:

In the unlikely chance you aren't tired of following Cornell recruits, two of them are in the Doc Buchanan Invitational:

120:  #3 seed Cornella into the quarterfinals (10-3, 4:31 fall)

Is this one being recruited because he's good? Or...

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On 1/2/2020 at 11:33 AM, ugarte said:

A good night's sleep did wonders. 

Foca pinned a kid from Campbell iin the first period, with a tech in hand. App State next, dodging 3 seed Carey (Navy) who took an MFF after getting worked by Starocci.

 

Rumor has it Foca was pretty sick on day 1 of the tournament. 

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59 minutes ago, ugarte said:

Why do I think Dylan Cedeno is going to Cornell also? he's in the 132 final.

10-19-19 Virginia Dylan Cedeno Bergen Catholic NJ 133/141

As per Intermat.  However, a deeper search shows that he was committed to Cornell in August per Flo:

77 SR Dylan Cedeno Bergen Cath. NJ 133 Cornell 77

Flo shows him committed to Virginia as of October, also.

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On 1/3/2020 at 6:44 PM, klehner said:

 

120:  #3 seed Cornella into the quarterfinals (10-3, 4:31 fall)

132:  #11 seed Wyatt Yapoujian into the quarterfinals (3:23 fall, 3-2 over #6 seed)

Cornella lost 1-0 in the semi and finished in third. 

Yapoujian lost in the QF and the blood round. 

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Lehigh vs. Cornell - Time to chat this one up?

If I plug in what I THINK will be the lineups, Wrestlestat prediction shows it at 18-12 for Lehigh.  I think it gets the wins/ losses correct, but I think Lehigh has a bit more potential for some bonus wins.  Some key questions:

  • Will Yapoujian be available for Cornell?
  • If Yap is a go - who will go 165 for Cornell?
  • Will Jimmy Hoffman be available for Lehigh?

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2 hours ago, red blades said:

Lehigh vs. Cornell - Time to chat this one up?

If I plug in what I THINK will be the lineups, Wrestlestat prediction shows it at 18-12 for Lehigh.  I think it gets the wins/ losses correct, but I think Lehigh has a bit more potential for some bonus wins.  Some key questions:

  • Will Yapoujian be available for Cornell?
  • If Yap is a go - who will go 165 for Cornell?
  • Will Jimmy Hoffman be available for Lehigh?

Also, will Womack be available for Cornell?  Probable bonus points if not.

It's been written close to definitively that Hoffman's out.

Edited by witwhiz

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23 minutes ago, red blades said:

Lehigh vs. Cornell - Time to chat this one up?

If I plug in what I THINK will be the lineups, Wrestlestat prediction shows it at 18-12 for Lehigh.  I think it gets the wins/ losses correct, but I think Lehigh has a bit more potential for some bonus wins.  Some key questions:

  • Will Yapoujian be available for Cornell?
  • If Yap is a go - who will go 165 for Cornell?
  • Will Jimmy Hoffman be available for Lehigh?

What will the 184 Loew look like?  The one who beat Wisman or the one who lost against the others in South Beach?

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1 hour ago, klehner said:

What will the 184 Loew look like?  The one who beat Wisman or the one who lost against the others in South Beach?

I don't think there was a lot of difference tbh. Most of his opposition was in the NQ range and that's about where he is. He's going to have to get a spot at NCAAs by qualifying at EIWA since a run good enough to earn an at-large seems unlikely. His matches against Weiler and Stefanik are going to be so important in whether he gets any juice in the CR.

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